=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 10:55:48 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Zach Hoon <junky@BURROUGHS.NET>

Subject:      The horror of ken going furthur

In-Reply-To:  <Pine.A32.3.93.970512134717.18000A-100000@srv1.freenet.calgary.ab.ca>

 

ahh i must admit this little thread has made me feel quite young here, not

being able to remember those glorious 60s, having to read cuckoo's nest in

high school...hm. so before folx go off the deep end about kesey and his

work, just let me say that's not what this post is about, never liked his

work, maybe someday i will but i doubt it...

anyways, here i agree with adrien, this whole pranksters thing a pathetic

attempt...as well as the Futher Festival (with the some Greatful Dead

offshoots, etc), and the fact that good ole Yasgur's farm is going to be a

theme park by the turn of the century (this is no joke, folks). a good time

for rememberances if you're of that age group i suppose, but i can't stand

seeing ppl my age (22) standing there hippie'd to the gills going 'aw man i

was born 30 yrs late. you got that joint, man?'

Derek said:

> who else would have the gall & guts to drive a 1949

>international harvester acid trip from one side of the country to the

>other...

i did it myself last summer, albeit not in a harvester, but with a bunch of

us driving from here (madison, wi) to san francisco, august last year...far

from sober, amazing...frisbee at three in the morning some iowa wayside i

was convinced the thing was a large, glowing, hovering nabisco nilla wafer,

and refused to get back in the car, instead staring at the headlites for a

minute while my friends were determined and laughably failing to get up on

the roof of a pavilion...or the red redness of utah mountains, sudden

flatness of salt...yeah long acid roadtrips may have been groundbreaking 30

years ago, but i've got friends who do them every year now, for the whole

summer, and no they're not following phish or the undead dead. we know what

DID happen but it's irrelevant to us because we concentrate on what CAN

happen. sick of cultural recycling...Try flying from  Chicago to Prague and

Prague to Chicago on ecstasy there's something new...(well, kinda)

There is too much new going on to be stuck in the old. like it or not,

future is where we're headed. the ideas and concepts laid down by KK and

crew, AG, Jk, even my dear WSB need to be taken and listened to and

reapplied. very few things are timeless. ideas that affect society hardly

are, seeing that society is a fast changing monster.  most ppl living

entirely (remember that word) by philosophies and ways laid down 30 yrs ago

are clueless and closed to so many things, IMHO.

I latched onto burroughs real quick because he seemed future-oriented; a

place i wanted to go, and yet need some sort of intro to.  to paraphrase:

'the future of writing is in space, not time'. i liked that. that got to

me. with the exception of some of AG's poems, i could give fuck-all for

most of the other beats...Jk always came across as some guy who had a few

good roadtrips and times and then drank the very long night away at his

catholic mother's house in good ole safe Mass. Cassady riding the magic

carpet that was Ag's infatuation to some sort of glorified chauffer version

of fame.  the first 3rd? more like the last 8th.heh...those who latched on

in the late 60s, 70s were worse to me, i didn't even bother to find out

much about them after reading their materials. But without all of them, so

many things would probably be left unsaid, and the grand story would be

incomplete. so i take those facts, which _are_ important to me, and apply

it to what i do. i've read enough WSB. now i need to apply these ideas to

what i do.

..etc etc. back to KK and his MPs. There are too many things going on now

that are rooted in what's going on now; taking our advancements and being

creative, outrageous, disruptive with them, interrupting a flow and putting

you, maybe just briefly, into a wild possible future. that's what charms

me: it's a possible future, not definite.  when you're doing something

past-based, there is only one possible course of action, one that follows

the path of those events already taken. altho i admit ther'll probably be

much spontinaeity involved with KK and the MPs, but it will be based on a

same philosophy. For those who were around back then, it'll be a wonderful

one, but based on sentimentality, not new ideas, not any groundbreaking.

and to say well it _was_  groundbreaking back in the day; yeah, so was

hooking up a horse to a buggy.

I admit to a shortage of things as of late. Raves used to be an outing of

choice: 100s or 1000s of ppl in some huge secret location, dancing to

future.music, taking care of each other, having surreal, induced

conversations. It's a younger crowd now, concerned mainly with the drugs

and the clothes, and being 'underground'. there are huge similarities in

fundamental philosophies of rave and hippie culture, but the approach is

very different. but now, all of it seems corrupted.

for those of you wanting to see/feel something new, with similar outlook,

feeling to it: 'A Little Furthur' memorial day weekend, and 'Even Furthur'

july 18-21, electric campout festivals, location usually an undisclosed

campgrounds somewhere in Wisconsin.  this event has been going on for 3 yrs

now, and gets better every year. and they even use a picture of the

Pranksters bus on the flyer. i get an indescribeable kick going to these

things, like the universe just all clicks together for a few days, and

everyone can be far from beat for a little while.

Pranksters? I'll stay home and read a book.

Obviously, i've been meandering here. Apologies, and no offense...

 

-zach

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 10:12:45 -0500

Reply-To:     race@midusa.net

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>

Subject:      Re: The horror of ken going furthur

 

Zach Hoon wrote:

>

> ahh i must admit this little thread has made me feel quite young here, not

> being able to remember those glorious 60s, having to read cuckoo's nest in

> high school...hm. so before folx go off the deep end about kesey and his

> work, just let me say that's not what this post is about, never liked his

> work, maybe someday i will but i doubt it...

> anyways, here i agree with adrien, this whole pranksters thing a pathetic

> attempt...as well as the Futher Festival (with the some Greatful Dead

> offshoots, etc), and the fact that good ole Yasgur's farm is going to be a

> theme park by the turn of the century (this is no joke, folks). a good time

> for rememberances if you're of that age group i suppose, but i can't stand

> seeing ppl my age (22) standing there hippie'd to the gills going 'aw man i

> was born 30 yrs late. you got that joint, man?'

> Derek said:

> > who else would have the gall & guts to drive a 1949

> >international harvester acid trip from one side of the country to the

> >other...

> i did it myself last summer, albeit not in a harvester, but with a bunch of

> us driving from here (madison, wi) to san francisco, august last year...far

> from sober, amazing...frisbee at three in the morning some iowa wayside i

> was convinced the thing was a large, glowing, hovering nabisco nilla wafer,

> and refused to get back in the car, instead staring at the headlites for a

> minute while my friends were determined and laughably failing to get up on

> the roof of a pavilion...or the red redness of utah mountains, sudden

> flatness of salt...yeah long acid roadtrips may have been groundbreaking 30

> years ago, but i've got friends who do them every year now, for the whole

> summer, and no they're not following phish or the undead dead. we know what

> DID happen but it's irrelevant to us because we concentrate on what CAN

> happen. sick of cultural recycling...Try flying from  Chicago to Prague and

> Prague to Chicago on ecstasy there's something new...(well, kinda)

> There is too much new going on to be stuck in the old. like it or not,

> future is where we're headed. the ideas and concepts laid down by KK and

> crew, AG, Jk, even my dear WSB need to be taken and listened to and

> reapplied. very few things are timeless. ideas that affect society hardly

> are, seeing that society is a fast changing monster.  most ppl living

> entirely (remember that word) by philosophies and ways laid down 30 yrs ago

> are clueless and closed to so many things, IMHO.

> I latched onto burroughs real quick because he seemed future-oriented; a

> place i wanted to go, and yet need some sort of intro to.  to paraphrase:

> 'the future of writing is in space, not time'. i liked that. that got to

> me. with the exception of some of AG's poems, i could give fuck-all for

> most of the other beats...Jk always came across as some guy who had a few

> good roadtrips and times and then drank the very long night away at his

> catholic mother's house in good ole safe Mass. Cassady riding the magic

> carpet that was Ag's infatuation to some sort of glorified chauffer version

> of fame.  the first 3rd? more like the last 8th.heh...those who latched on

> in the late 60s, 70s were worse to me, i didn't even bother to find out

> much about them after reading their materials. But without all of them, so

> many things would probably be left unsaid, and the grand story would be

> incomplete. so i take those facts, which _are_ important to me, and apply

> it to what i do. i've read enough WSB. now i need to apply these ideas to

> what i do.

> ..etc etc. back to KK and his MPs. There are too many things going on now

> that are rooted in what's going on now; taking our advancements and being

> creative, outrageous, disruptive with them, interrupting a flow and putting

> you, maybe just briefly, into a wild possible future. that's what charms

> me: it's a possible future, not definite.  when you're doing something

> past-based, there is only one possible course of action, one that follows

> the path of those events already taken. altho i admit ther'll probably be

> much spontinaeity involved with KK and the MPs, but it will be based on a

> same philosophy. For those who were around back then, it'll be a wonderful

> one, but based on sentimentality, not new ideas, not any groundbreaking.

> and to say well it _was_  groundbreaking back in the day; yeah, so was

> hooking up a horse to a buggy.

> I admit to a shortage of things as of late. Raves used to be an outing of

> choice: 100s or 1000s of ppl in some huge secret location, dancing to

> future.music, taking care of each other, having surreal, induced

> conversations. It's a younger crowd now, concerned mainly with the drugs

> and the clothes, and being 'underground'. there are huge similarities in

> fundamental philosophies of rave and hippie culture, but the approach is

> very different. but now, all of it seems corrupted.

> for those of you wanting to see/feel something new, with similar outlook,

> feeling to it: 'A Little Furthur' memorial day weekend, and 'Even Furthur'

> july 18-21, electric campout festivals, location usually an undisclosed

> campgrounds somewhere in Wisconsin.  this event has been going on for 3 yrs

> now, and gets better every year. and they even use a picture of the

> Pranksters bus on the flyer. i get an indescribeable kick going to these

> things, like the universe just all clicks together for a few days, and

> everyone can be far from beat for a little while.

> Pranksters? I'll stay home and read a book.

> Obviously, i've been meandering here. Apologies, and no offense...

>

> -zach

 

You make the Pranksters sound as dull as Ward and June Cleaver and

Dwight and Mamie Eisenhower.  That's not half bad.  Living in the past

is silly.  a bit of remembrance now and then is ... perhaps sentimental

but what the fuck it is fun to be sentimental.  i remember a group i

hung out with a few years ago that pledged to get together when we were

80 and drop acid for a big fling.  it would be sentimental.  it would be

new too.  it ain't gonna happen i'm almost certain.

 

i think it is stupid to place Kesey or others on a pedestal just as it

is silly to place oneself there.  pedestals fall, crash and burn.

 

i ain't certain the future is all it's cracked up to be.  no offense.

it seems your generation is just as capable of fucking up as the rest of

us..... :)

 

rambling on and on and blah blah blah from kansas plains.

 

david rhaesa

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 08:20:50 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>

Subject:      Re: Final estate details (for a while)

 

.... Your a nut case...you couldn't get anyone to buy it you finally sold it to

>U-Lowell for whatever terms you could get...Sorry, but if you

>want to listen to the taped interviews, you must have written permission

>from the subjects...

 

                                                        May 13, 1997

 

        Phil, your reply is full of bull crap from one end to the other.

        No one wanted the largest collection of Kerouac primary source

material in the world?  300 interviews with people who knew Kerouac?  Are

you selling the Brooklyn Bridge too?

        I chose to put all that material in Lowell because I thought that's

where the most Kerouac scholars would get to see it.  When I put it there,

the university knew there were no individual permissions (there rarely are

with ANY archive), and the university promised to make the material

accessible to the public.  They DID MAKE IT ACCESSIBLE until 1995, when John

Sampas came to complain to them.

        Martha Mayo herself told me that.  Later, she added "the woman from

Connecticut," but she refuses to name her.  Why can't she name her if she

named John Sampas?

        You deliberately quoted pieces of that article out of context.  It

was Martha Mayo claiming that "if you want to listen to the taped

interviews, you must have written permission," not the reporter.  Of course

she's claiming this, it's her excuse for letting Mr. Sampas have his way

about closing the collection.

        When Michigan State University scholar Shari Krishnan complained

about being turned away from the MEMORY BABE collection, she received a

phone call from--guess who?--JOHN SAMPAS!  (Not "the woman from

Connecticut.")  Sampas told Ms. Krishnan that she had to go thru him to see

materials in the collection, and that there were certain materials he would

not allow her to see.

        I'm a "nut"?  I received my MASTER'S DEGREE WITH HIGHEST DISTINCTION

IN ENGLISH FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF ILLINOIS, as a result of which I was

awarded a FOUR YEAR FELLOWSHIP IN ENGLISH TO UCLA,  Later, I received the

DISTINGUISHED YOUNG WRITER AWARD FROM THE NATIONAL SOCIETY OF ARTS AND

LETTERS FOR MEMORY BABE.  I've been a featured speaker at FIVE MAJOR KEROUAC

CONFERENCES IN THREE DIFFERENT COUNTRIES.

        What exactly are your credentials for making all these

pronouncements about Kerouac scholarship?  Having dinner every night with

John Sampas?

        I'm through arguing with you about Kerouac scholarship.  It's a

waste of my time.  I want to speak with someone who's MY EQUAL.

        I.e., please tell Mr. Sampas to send in the first-string team now.

        Best, Gerry Nicosia

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 11:20:23 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Rodgers <Rodgers@TRACOR-A4.CCMAIL.VITRO.COM>

Subject:      Paul Blake, Jr.

 

     Mr. Nicosia:

 

     Couldn't Mr. Blake pick up a few bucks for himself by writing a book

     about his relationship with his uncle Jack?

 

 

     Ron Rodgers

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:03:25 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Zach Hoon <junky@BURROUGHS.NET>

Subject:      Re: The horror of ken going furthur

In-Reply-To:  <337884ED.3034@midusa.net>

 

david rhaesa said:

>i ain't certain the future is all it's cracked up to be.  no offense.

>it seems your generation is just as capable of fucking up as the rest of

>us..... :)

 

oh definitely. i think we already have; _I_ already have. that's not really

what i was saying. there seems to be another group of powermad money hungry

kids welling up, another mid 80s hell. doesn't make so good for the future.

hopefully they will be beaten down. the future isn't going to be better,

just different, and new. because it is the future, you know. and besides,

back in the 60's there was a whole lot more to fuck up with (race issues,

war), and i don't think, after all was said and done, the fuckups on the

gov't side tremendous, on the little ppl side (us), close to nil. here i

the 90s, what? i don't even know what to call the major issues. gay lib?

abortion? aids? this generation/decade seems to be plagued by wackos and

cults: Oklahoma City, Waco, Dahmer, Heaven's Gate, Atlanta Bomber, World

Trade Center, Planes blowing up. Can't protest that. can't be a movement or

a march against that. no one knows what or when things will happen...We had

a 3 day war that was a bunch of bullshit, not even enough time to get the

pickett signs made before all the laser guided missles hit the piles of

iraqis in the sand, in the munitions plants. lets blow up chemical weapons

bunkers that we _know_ are chemical weapons bunkers and contaminate all of

our faithful soldiers! maybe one of them will give birth to a kangaroo

that's really the reincarnation of Jack Kerouac! (ever see 'Tank Gir'? if

not, don't bother).

So i have a lot of respect for the protests and marches and _ambition_ of

those involved in the 60s. not an easy thing to do...i wish for something

to drive my generation into action, instead of Jenny McCarthy's boobs or

the next $%&^# Batman movie.

but oh well. i rant. apaologies.

 

-zach

i'm all for it.

 

-z

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 11:37:15 -0500

Reply-To:     race@midusa.net

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>

Subject:      Re: The horror of ken going furthur

 

Zach Hoon wrote:

>

> david rhaesa said:

> >i ain't certain the future is all it's cracked up to be.  no offense.

> >it seems your generation is just as capable of fucking up as the rest of

> >us..... :)

>

> oh definitely. i think we already have; _I_ already have. that's not really

> what i was saying. there seems to be another group of powermad money hungry

> kids welling up, another mid 80s hell. doesn't make so good for the future.

> hopefully they will be beaten down. the future isn't going to be better,

> just different, and new. because it is the future, you know. and besides,

> back in the 60's there was a whole lot more to fuck up with (race issues,

> war), and i don't think, after all was said and done, the fuckups on the

> gov't side tremendous, on the little ppl side (us), close to nil. here i

> the 90s, what? i don't even know what to call the major issues. gay lib?

> abortion? aids? this generation/decade seems to be plagued by wackos and

> cults: Oklahoma City, Waco, Dahmer, Heaven's Gate, Atlanta Bomber, World

> Trade Center, Planes blowing up. Can't protest that. can't be a movement or

> a march against that. no one knows what or when things will happen...We had

> a 3 day war that was a bunch of bullshit, not even enough time to get the

> pickett signs made before all the laser guided missles hit the piles of

> iraqis in the sand, in the munitions plants. lets blow up chemical weapons

> bunkers that we _know_ are chemical weapons bunkers and contaminate all of

> our faithful soldiers! maybe one of them will give birth to a kangaroo

> that's really the reincarnation of Jack Kerouac! (ever see 'Tank Gir'? if

> not, don't bother).

> So i have a lot of respect for the protests and marches and _ambition_ of

> those involved in the 60s. not an easy thing to do...i wish for something

> to drive my generation into action, instead of Jenny McCarthy's boobs or

> the next $%&^# Batman movie.

> but oh well. i rant. apaologies.

>

> -zach

> i'm all for it.

>

> -z

 

well after reading your post i listened to burroughs' words of advice

for young people about 33 times and re-read your post and thought about

it long and hard and decided that the sixties have been forgotten

somewhat if they're only about "movements", that the sixties had their

fair share of lunatics on both sides of the law-and-order game, but i

was just a young kid knee-high to a small donkey (burrough/jack ass)

when that was all going on and i guess i fall in the 'tweener'

generation that never amounted to much of anything for anyone to

anyplace at anytime.  and so what!!!  i think Ken Kesey and his geeser

pals should drive their bus to eternity and back if they want to and

that they say in big letters Never trust a Prankster so the younger

generations myself and the 'tweeners' included who get caught in the

hype of it all deserve exactly what we get.  anytime you're dealing with

a prankster or someone with a movement attached to their name "get it in

writing!!!!" ....

time for my siesta as a casualty of the "tweener" generation, i am

prescribed to enjoy a siesta or two every day whether the magic bus is

flying by airplane, train or flatbad pickup truck with Vegas plates.

 

the Hall of Fame of the "tweener" generation will include: ????????

help, fill in the blanks please please oh please .... off to sleep enjoy

y'alls work-a-day-work and roadtrips and all that jazz/jacuzzi junk.

 

david rhaesa

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 09:32:11 -0700

Reply-To:     letabor@cruzio.com

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Leon Tabory <letabor@CRUZIO.COM>

Comments: To: "The horror of ken going furthur"@cruzio.com

 

Hey dude, and yous men and gals and grrrls, women folks, who else

is/ain't part of me/us, anyone not here now get with it anyone?

 

I think there is something going on with us that we can't put our

fingers quite on, or it comes out a litle garbled or something, fuck off

all of you others, not me's, and you is them there, or is it something

in ourselves that we are so uneasy about that we can't fan our fire's

exuberance without chasing someone out, out of the picture, get out a

here, you ain't nothin' but a shadow of the past or are you a nobody

nothing from now. Like directors of a play who are afraid that they have

to control everybody's actions on the stage? Hey folks see those clowns

hollering for attention? Please don't give them no never mind, they

ain't nothin but goofballs, look at me, look at me, don't follow therm,

follow me, me me me. Oh, that shit again. So what else is new?

 

 

When my weekend comes on Monday, I would like to go over your post in

depth and detail, for the moment I want to tell you that I like your

post a lot. Fresh and alive and good energy moving ahead. How can I feel

so good about it on the verge of 27, oops, 72! I know there are very

good reasons. Too busy at the moment to look into it. be late for work.

That alone could disqualify me then, not so much now.

 

Maybe it's because I too loved Madison. Spent more time sailing on lake

Mendota, and in the Rathskeller than in the classrooms, but those were

ok too. some of them. Here I go again giving my age away. Hey, that's

what it is. Age discrimination. Pure and simple. Everybody does it, kid.

That's why I am happy to have a part time very low paying job. Never

missed a day's work in five years at least. Why else would anyone

complain about a bunch of guys going on a fun trip, thinking they have

something to say , too? Are you objecting to anything they said on this

trip? Are you objecting because they are too proud of threir entry in

the parade over thirtry years ago, hell, for having started that parade

then? Love to hear the further, fun and future advancements. As Kesey

was singing in the Filmore of SF taking his bus to a final resting place

of honor in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame museum in Cleveland, "Hip Hip

Hurray, Hip Hip Hurray" to anyone who is doing a great trip, "Hip Hip

Hurray, to you too Zach. If you are in the Santa Cruz area, I might know

of a good rave. I guarantee you no one will ask you to move off the

stage because of your age, or costume, or local dialect, or temporary

fad.

 

Leon

Zach Hoon wrote:

>

> ahh i must admit this little thread has made me feel quite young here, not

> being able to remember those glorious 60s, having to read cuckoo's nest in

> high school...hm. so before folx go off the deep end about kesey and his

> work, just let me say that's not what this post is about, never liked his

> work, maybe someday i will but i doubt it...

> anyways, here i agree with adrien, this whole pranksters thing a pathetic

> attempt...as well as the Futher Festival (with the some Greatful Dead

> offshoots, etc), and the fact that good ole Yasgur's farm is going to be a

> theme park by the turn of the century (this is no joke, folks). a good time

> for rememberances if you're of that age group i suppose, but i can't stand

> seeing ppl my age (22) standing there hippie'd to the gills going 'aw man i

> was born 30 yrs late. you got that joint, man?'

> Derek said:

> > who else would have the gall & guts to drive a 1949

> >international harvester acid trip from one side of the country to the

> >other...

> i did it myself last summer, albeit not in a harvester, but with a bunch of

> us driving from here (madison, wi) to san francisco, august last year...far

> from sober, amazing...frisbee at three in the morning some iowa wayside i

> was convinced the thing was a large, glowing, hovering nabisco nilla wafer,

> and refused to get back in the car, instead staring at the headlites for a

> minute while my friends were determined and laughably failing to get up on

> the roof of a pavilion...or the red redness of utah mountains, sudden

> flatness of salt...yeah long acid roadtrips may have been groundbreaking 30

> years ago, but i've got friends who do them every year now, for the whole

> summer, and no they're not following phish or the undead dead. we know what

> DID happen but it's irrelevant to us because we concentrate on what CAN

> happen. sick of cultural recycling...Try flying from  Chicago to Prague and

> Prague to Chicago on ecstasy there's something new...(well, kinda)

> There is too much new going on to be stuck in the old. like it or not,

> future is where we're headed. the ideas and concepts laid down by KK and

> crew, AG, Jk, even my dear WSB need to be taken and listened to and

> reapplied. very few things are timeless. ideas that affect society hardly

> are, seeing that society is a fast changing monster.  most ppl living

> entirely (remember that word) by philosophies and ways laid down 30 yrs ago

> are clueless and closed to so many things, IMHO.

> I latched onto burroughs real quick because he seemed future-oriented; a

> place i wanted to go, and yet need some sort of intro to.  to paraphrase:

> 'the future of writing is in space, not time'. i liked that. that got to

> me. with the exception of some of AG's poems, i could give fuck-all for

> most of the other beats...Jk always came across as some guy who had a few

> good roadtrips and times and then drank the very long night away at his

> catholic mother's house in good ole safe Mass. Cassady riding the magic

> carpet that was Ag's infatuation to some sort of glorified chauffer version

> of fame.  the first 3rd? more like the last 8th.heh...those who latched on

> in the late 60s, 70s were worse to me, i didn't even bother to find out

> much about them after reading their materials. But without all of them, so

> many things would probably be left unsaid, and the grand story would be

> incomplete. so i take those facts, which _are_ important to me, and apply

> it to what i do. i've read enough WSB. now i need to apply these ideas to

> what i do.

> ..etc etc. back to KK and his MPs. There are too many things going on now

> that are rooted in what's going on now; taking our advancements and being

> creative, outrageous, disruptive with them, interrupting a flow and putting

> you, maybe just briefly, into a wild possible future. that's what charms

> me: it's a possible future, not definite.  when you're doing something

> past-based, there is only one possible course of action, one that follows

> the path of those events already taken. altho i admit ther'll probably be

> much spontinaeity involved with KK and the MPs, but it will be based on a

> same philosophy. For those who were around back then, it'll be a wonderful

> one, but based on sentimentality, not new ideas, not any groundbreaking.

> and to say well it _was_  groundbreaking back in the day; yeah, so was

> hooking up a horse to a buggy.

> I admit to a shortage of things as of late. Raves used to be an outing of

> choice: 100s or 1000s of ppl in some huge secret location, dancing to

> future.music, taking care of each other, having surreal, induced

> conversations. It's a younger crowd now, concerned mainly with the drugs

> and the clothes, and being 'underground'. there are huge similarities in

> fundamental philosophies of rave and hippie culture, but the approach is

> very different. but now, all of it seems corrupted.

> for those of you wanting to see/feel something new, with similar outlook,

> feeling to it: 'A Little Furthur' memorial day weekend, and 'Even Furthur'

> july 18-21, electric campout festivals, location usually an undisclosed

> campgrounds somewhere in Wisconsin.  this event has been going on for 3 yrs

> now, and gets better every year. and they even use a picture of the

> Pranksters bus on the flyer. i get an indescribeable kick going to these

> things, like the universe just all clicks together for a few days, and

> everyone can be far from beat for a little while.

> Pranksters? I'll stay home and read a book.

> Obviously, i've been meandering here. Apologies, and no offense...

>

> -zach

> .-

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:44:12 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         "Gibbons, Jeffrey x85139e1" <x85139@EXMAIL.USMA.ARMY.MIL>

Subject:      Re: The horror of ken going furthur

 

Zach,

Just wondering if you thought that the only reason to have a war is so

protestors can picket.  Granted our intentions in the Gulf War were

based mainly for economic security.  However, I think it's naive to

think that Saddam was going to simply invade Kuwait and that would end

it.  His intentions were certainly larger than just the port of Kuwait.

He tested the U.S. (and its coalition) to see if we had the guts to

attack, and he failed the test.  Sometimes there are wars (if you can

call the battles in 1991 a war) that are necessary.  Sorry to make this

statement on the "Beat" list, I will try to keep future postings to

strictly Beat related topics.

Jeff

 

>----------

>From:  Zach Hoon[SMTP:junky@BURROUGHS.NET]

>Sent:  Tuesday, May 13, 1997 11:03 AM

>To:    Multiple recipients of list BEAT-L

>Subject:       Re: The horror of ken going furthur

>

>david rhaesa said:

>>i ain't certain the future is all it's cracked up to be.  no offense.

>>it seems your generation is just as capable of fucking up as the rest of

>>us..... :)

>

>oh definitely. i think we already have; _I_ already have. that's not really

>what i was saying. there seems to be another group of powermad money hungry

>kids welling up, another mid 80s hell. doesn't make so good for the future.

>hopefully they will be beaten down. the future isn't going to be better,

>just different, and new. because it is the future, you know. and besides,

>back in the 60's there was a whole lot more to fuck up with (race issues,

>war), and i don't think, after all was said and done, the fuckups on the

>gov't side tremendous, on the little ppl side (us), close to nil. here i

>the 90s, what? i don't even know what to call the major issues. gay lib?

>abortion? aids? this generation/decade seems to be plagued by wackos and

>cults: Oklahoma City, Waco, Dahmer, Heaven's Gate, Atlanta Bomber, World

>Trade Center, Planes blowing up. Can't protest that. can't be a movement or

>a march against that. no one knows what or when things will happen...We had

>a 3 day war that was a bunch of bullshit, not even enough time to get the

>pickett signs made before all the laser guided missles hit the piles of

>iraqis in the sand, in the munitions plants. lets blow up chemical weapons

>bunkers that we _know_ are chemical weapons bunkers and contaminate all of

>our faithful soldiers! maybe one of them will give birth to a kangaroo

>that's really the reincarnation of Jack Kerouac! (ever see 'Tank Gir'? if

>not, don't bother).

>So i have a lot of respect for the protests and marches and _ambition_ of

>those involved in the 60s. not an easy thing to do...i wish for something

>to drive my generation into action, instead of Jenny McCarthy's boobs or

>the next $%&^# Batman movie.

>but oh well. i rant. apaologies.

>

>-zach

>i'm all for it.

>

>-z

>

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 11:47:56 -0500

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         jo grant <jgrant@BOOKZEN.COM>

Subject:      Re: Kicks, Joy, Darkness AND A RIP-OFF

In-Reply-To:  <9704128634.AA863460932@Mail.ff.cc.mn.us>

 

12May97 Wes Lundburg <wlundburg@MAIL.FF.CC.MN.US> wrote

 

>I do like the Johhny Depp reading, although I hate to admit it (don't ask me

>why, I just don't like him).

 

Have to point out that the royalties due Jan Kerouac from this Johnny Depp

reading were never paid to her. Producers of the show state that Jan gave

permission for the material used by Depp. This is not true. She never gave

permission for the material to be used. I have asked to see documentation

regarding Jan giving permission and have not received a reply. Since

permission from Jan doesn't exist they would have to come up with

permission from John Sampas and they will not do this.

 

This is a case of Jahn Sampas picking up $50,000.00 from Depp for a Jack

Kerouac coat and giving him permission to use the material and not pay

royalties.

 

It's my understanding that the Sampas Estate would also have recieved

royalties, but  since they received the $50,000.00 gave permission to use

the material royalty free.

 

Could the TV Production afford the fee? Of course they could. It was simply

another case of the estate making sure Jan Keroauc did not get what was

legally coming to her.

 

Jahn Sampas made out. Jan Keroauc got shafted--again.

 

j grant

 

                BE ON THE WATCH

for items stolen from the Keroauc Collection

        O'Leary Library, U Mass, Lowell

http://www.bookzen.com/kerouac.theft.html

 

Academic & Small Press Authors & publishers

                display books free at

           <http://www.bookzen.com>

     302,443  visitors since July 1, 1996

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:49:50 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         "Gibbons, Jeffrey x85139e1" <x85139@EXMAIL.USMA.ARMY.MIL>

Subject:      Re: The horror of ken going furthur

 

I should have added to my last post, drive on Ken Kesey, Bob Dylan,

Furthur Festival, Bob Weir and Ratdog, Mickey Hart and his Mystery

Box...etc. etc.

 

>----------

>From:  Zach Hoon[SMTP:junky@BURROUGHS.NET]

>Sent:  Tuesday, May 13, 1997 11:03 AM

>To:    Multiple recipients of list BEAT-L

>Subject:       Re: The horror of ken going furthur

>

>david rhaesa said:

>>i ain't certain the future is all it's cracked up to be.  no offense.

>>it seems your generation is just as capable of fucking up as the rest of

>>us..... :)

>

>oh definitely. i think we already have; _I_ already have. that's not really

>what i was saying. there seems to be another group of powermad money hungry

>kids welling up, another mid 80s hell. doesn't make so good for the future.

>hopefully they will be beaten down. the future isn't going to be better,

>just different, and new. because it is the future, you know. and besides,

>back in the 60's there was a whole lot more to fuck up with (race issues,

>war), and i don't think, after all was said and done, the fuckups on the

>gov't side tremendous, on the little ppl side (us), close to nil. here i

>the 90s, what? i don't even know what to call the major issues. gay lib?

>abortion? aids? this generation/decade seems to be plagued by wackos and

>cults: Oklahoma City, Waco, Dahmer, Heaven's Gate, Atlanta Bomber, World

>Trade Center, Planes blowing up. Can't protest that. can't be a movement or

>a march against that. no one knows what or when things will happen...We had

>a 3 day war that was a bunch of bullshit, not even enough time to get the

>pickett signs made before all the laser guided missles hit the piles of

>iraqis in the sand, in the munitions plants. lets blow up chemical weapons

>bunkers that we _know_ are chemical weapons bunkers and contaminate all of

>our faithful soldiers! maybe one of them will give birth to a kangaroo

>that's really the reincarnation of Jack Kerouac! (ever see 'Tank Gir'? if

>not, don't bother).

>So i have a lot of respect for the protests and marches and _ambition_ of

>those involved in the 60s. not an easy thing to do...i wish for something

>to drive my generation into action, instead of Jenny McCarthy's boobs or

>the next $%&^# Batman movie.

>but oh well. i rant. apaologies.

>

>-zach

>i'm all for it.

>

>-z

>

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:53:24 EDT

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Joe <100106.1102@COMPUSERVE.COM>

Subject:      no more to say & nothing to weep for

 

 i mentioned earlier last week that there would

 be a documentary in the uk on sunday night / monday

 morning...well there was and it was titled

 

    No More To Say And Nothing To Weep For

 

 i'm guessing that its the same television programme

 that was shown a little earlier in the states.

 

 i watched it all.

 

 obviously put together after his death, i was a little

 bemused by the fact they didn't once mention neil cassady

 or william burroughs!  i'm aware he led an amazingly

 fulfilled life, more than can be crammed into a

 one hour documentary, but nc & wsb were only shown

 on photographs!

 

 also who was the guy who said ginsberg was a little

 naive about politics?  what happened during that interview?

 the interviewer really took the piss out of ginsberg to belittle

 him infront of that firing squad.

 

 anyone else see this documentary have any thoughts

 on this?

 

 

 also, as an aside, apart from an allen ginsberg interview

 i've nothing regarding beat gen on video so that was the

 first time i'd seen the kerouac / steve allen show.  man,

 i wished i'd have heard him read road all the way thru...

 

 

 

 joe,

 newcastle united kingdom

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:51:36 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Comments:     MAA11719 on camphor (hop 0), Tue, 13 May 1997 12:51:36 -0400 (EDT)

From:         Randi Jaclyn Friedman <rfiedma@GROVE.UFL.EDU>

Subject:      Re: subscribe me

Comments: To: SlugBug747@AOL.COM

In-Reply-To:  <970427001803_-831476971@emout02.mail.aol.com>

 

 PLease take me off the list. rfiedma@grove.ufl.edu

 

On Sun, 27 Apr 1997 SlugBug747@AOL.COM wrote:

 

> Hey can you subscribe me please!

>

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:15:06 -0500

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Ron Guest <rguest@SUNSET.BACKBONE.OLEMISS.EDU>

Subject:      Fatty??

 

FATTY?? Are you kidding me?  I got a little fast on the delete key, but I

think someone called someone else a fatty on here.  Having a great time

reading the Kerouac Estate Debate..keep it coming..but fatty?  We'll take

that up at recess.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:18:59 -0500

Reply-To:     race@midusa.net

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>

Subject:      Re: Fatty??

 

Ron Guest wrote:

>

> FATTY?? Are you kidding me?  I got a little fast on the delete key, but I

> think someone called someone else a fatty on here.  Having a great time

> reading the Kerouac Estate Debate..keep it coming..but fatty?  We'll take

> that up at recess.

 

expecting "pants-on-fire" any minute now ...

 

david rhaesa

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:24:42 -0500

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         jo grant <jgrant@BOOKZEN.COM>

Subject:      Re: A Question for G. Nicosia/not Estate related!!

In-Reply-To:  <970510213306_811267926@emout15.mail.aol.com>

 

>In a message dated 97-05-10 19:47:58 EDT, you write:

>

><< You might ask Jeffrey Weinberg if book

> misprints are as valuable as those in stamps and coins. >>

>

>In the case of the Memory Babe misprint, there is no extra worth attached to

>such a copy...But you should send the copy to Gerry and ask him to sign it

>for you anyway.

>Just don't forget to add return postage....

>JW

>Water Row Books

 

 

 

JW,

 

Your post is interesting. There is no doubt in my mind that sending a book

to Gerry with return postage would be a safe move.

 

Back a few years ago, when I learned the value of a pre-publication edition

of Catch 22 that I have I mentioned to a publisher friend that I was going

to send it to Joseph Heller and ask him to sign it. He told me, "Don't do

it! You'll never see the book again."

 

I couldn't imagine that happening. I have no information about Heller being

that kind of person, but didn't want to take the chance. What do you think?

Is it risky?

 

j grant

 

 

                BE ON THE WATCH

for items stolen from the Keroauc Collection

        O'Leary Library, U Mass, Lowell

http://www.bookzen.com/kerouac.theft.html

 

Academic & Small Press Authors & publishers

                display books free at

           <http://www.bookzen.com>

     302,443  visitors since July 1, 1996

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 13:30:53 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Zach Hoon <junky@BURROUGHS.NET>

Subject:      Re: The hilarity of ken going to war

In-Reply-To:  <c=US%a=_%p=USGOV%l=EXMAIL10-970513164412Z-61132@exmail.usma.army.mil>

 

Jeff said:

>Just wondering if you thought that the only reason to have a war is so

>protestors can picket.

 

War is unreal to me. it's history. it's televised. it's not going on now

(at least involving our country, so it's not prominent on the news etc...)

I could put on the beads and flowers and say : 'there's no reason at all to

have a war', and ideally, that's what should be. but i'm not an idealistic

person; this isn't an idealistic world. although the US was probably right

for hoppin' into the gulf fray, there have been many more noble or

'necessary' causes of war, IMHO. Coalitions, alliances....bah...i'm not one

for politics. so the only reason for war is so the soldiers can fight so

the protesters can protest so the civilians can enjoy their freedom while

making money from making bullets and missles  so the generals have jobs and

the president looks pretty and heroic...whatever. i'm indifferent. if it

comes to a choice i have to make, i'll go to the front and not the border.

don't ask me why cause i don't know. maybe all the tales of the opium dens

in Nam (nah just kiddin).

 

yepyep.

 

-zach

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 13:46:03 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         PAM <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>

Subject:      Re: New JK books for Fall

 

At 08:24 AM 5/13/97 -0500, you wrote:

>Gerry and all:

>

>I checked the copyright law properly this time before posting. Please ignore

>unless you're really interested as it gets complicated.

>

>>From 1909 onwards, copyright was provided for 28 years from date of

>publication. At the end of 28 years you could renew for another 47 years,

>making 75 in all. If you failed to renew, 28 was all you got. HOWEVER, in

>1992 the renewal aspect was significantly changed, and renewal was granted

>AUTOMATICALLY to all books published after January 1, 1964. Now nearly all

>the dates you listed in this post fall just before that date, bt you don't

>list all the dates, so it's possible some of the works may still be

>protected. Anything published after 1978 of falls under the new Death+50

>rule (though it may well become Death+70 in the next few years).

>

>As for your comment about can you sell books not yet assembled to a

>publisher, of course that's perfectly possible if both sides are willing to

>take the risk and there's enough money put up front by the publisher. It's a

>bit like the infamous 'player to be named later' trade.

>

>Best

>

>Nick W-W

>

>One of the last things to be published will be the notebooks. if that

includes all or some is still up in the air. Regards to all, Paul...

>

>>

>

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 10:46:57 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>

Subject:      Overview, Part 2, Final Statement

 

To all the Patient Folks on the Beat-List:

 

        I came on here hoping to initiate an honest dialogue on the Kerouac

Archive with John Sampas or one of his official representatives, such as Ann

Charters.  What I got instead was Phil Chaput throwing 20 lies a day at me

to answer, to keep me away from any real discussion of what is being done,

and what should be done, with the thousands and thousands of papers Kerouac

carefully saved and filed away all his life.

        I assume Mr. Chaput has been put up to this by Mr. Sampas himself.

Almost every one of the pieces of "evidence" he's thrown at me were standard

lines used in the past by Mr. Sampas or his lawyer Mr. Tobia.  I had dealt

with them all years ago, and now, instead of being able to move forward on

this question, I was forced to rehash the past for the last two weeks.

        I'm quitting this futile treadmill they've stuck me on.  I think

I've exposed enough of Mr. Chaput's lies to throw doubt on the credibility

of all his future claims--and I'm sure there are going to be hundreds more

before he's done.  Since the demands on my time right now are a lot more

intense than the demands on his, he can afford to continue with this game

indefinitely, and I cannot.

        I should also add that I've just been asked to write my

autobiography for Gale Research's literary encyclopedia called CONTEMPORARY

AUTHORS--a 10,000 word piece that will take all of what little free time I

have left these days.  For that reason alone, it will be tough checking my

Beat-List mail on a timely basis, and so I would ask those of you with

IMPORTANT QUESTIONS TO JUST EMAIL ME DIRECTLY at GNicosia@earthlink.net.

        The best I can hope to do here is TO GIVE YOU THE OUTLINES OF WHAT I

AM FIGHTING FOR, AND WHY I AM FIGHTING SO HARD:

        SInce all this began with a few comments of Mr. Anstee's, let me

return to his most forceful point: that people should hold back getting

involved, that people shouldn't take sides, that people should allow the

status quo to continue.

        THE BIGGEST PROBLEM IS: THERE IS NO STATUS QUO.  MR. SAMPAS IS

CURRENTLY MAKING MOVE AFTER MOVE, WITH THE INTENTION OF CONTROLLING JACK

KEROUAC SCHOLARSHIP WELL BEYOND THE TIME OF HIS DEATH.  He is currently

grooming nephew Jim Sampas to follow in his footsteps.

        THERE IS NO STATUS QUO: at present Jan Kerouac's heir, exhusband

John Lash, having made a deal with John Sampas, is engaged in a

down-and-dirty court fight to get me thrown out as Jan Kerouac's literary

executor, even though she appointed me to do that work in her will.  Mr.

Lash is being abetted (and doubtless encouraged) in this attack by Mr.

Sampas.  As evidence, when Tom Staley, Humanities Research Center Director

at U. of Texas, Austin, sent an affidavit in my behalf to the probate court

in Albuquerque (where Lash is fighting me), SAMPAS HIMSELF CALLED THE

UNIVERSITY OF TEXAS TO COMPLAIN ABOUT STALEY'S INVOLVEMENT.

        My legal bills in New Mexico exceed $60,000.  Mr. Lash's bills are

comparable.  Before the battle is over, each side will doubtless have spent

over $100,000.  Why is Mr. Lash spending so much money to get rid of me as

Jan's literary executor?--an action that has drawn outcries from the world's

most important literary organization, PEN.  I quote from the letter of

author Floyd Salas, President of PEN OAKLAND (PEN USA WEST): "To deny the

clear intention of Jan Kerouac's statements about her desire to save her

father's literary estate, and to change the clear instructions of her will,

which names Gerald Nicosia her literary executor, is to censor the voice of

this fine American writer, Jan Kerouac, even in her grave."

        WHY IS JAN KEROUAC BEING "CENSORED EVEN IN HER GRAVE"?  Because it

is necessary to do so if John Sampas is to continue his one-man control of

the whole field of Kerouac scholarship and, I may add, Kerouac sales..

        Is this only what Mr. Anstee calls "paranoia"?

        Let me cite some specific examples:

        In 1992, Irish writer Elgie Gillespie wrote a long article on the

strange goings-on in the Kerouac Estate.  It was scheduled to be published

in THE SAN FRANCISCO REVIEW OF BOOKS.  Someone tipped off Mr. Sampas before

publication, and Sampas phoned SFROB publisher Don Paul, threatening a

lawsuit if the article was published.  Don Paul immediately killed the

article and told Ms. Gillespie never to publish it anywhere.

        When MEMORY BABE was kicked out of Viking/Penguin (only weeks after

Mr. Sampas had made his 6-book deal there for the publication of new Kerouac

texts), I took my biography to the University of California Press, which

immediately agreed to reprint it.  A month later, U of C Press publisher Jim

Clark got a call from Mr. Sampas's agent, Jacob Hoye, instructing him that

Mr. Sampas would take legal action to stop MEMORY BABE from being

reprinted--claiming I needed to pay permissions fees all over again (not a

normal practice) and that Mr. Sampas did not intend to resell me those

permissions.  Mr. Hoye made it clear to Mr. Clark that Mr. Sampas did not

want to see MEMORY BABE back in print.

        When I let it be known I was about file a tort-action suit against

Mr. Sampas for "interference with contractual relations," I received a call

from Mr. Sampas himself, explaining to me that he was only doing his best to

protect Jack Kerouac, since my book was "filled with mistakes."

        MISTAKES ACCORDING TO JOHN SAMPAS.

        Clark republished MEMORY BABE.  No suit was filed.  But two years

later I received a letter from Mr. Sampas's agent Sterling Lord, reviving

essentially the same charges against MEMORY BABE--only this time saying I

had NEVER paid for the right to quote from MEXICO CITY BLUES.  I told Mr.

Lord I had paid those permissions 15 years ago, and he demanded to see

proof.  I told him the permissions had been filed with Grove Press 15 years

ago, and that Grove had been resold as a company 4 times since then--they no

longer had records going back that far.  Again, there was no actual suit.

        Mr. Sampas has contacted both the University of Texas and the

University of California's Bancroft Library, attempting to restrict access

to Kerouac materials on deposit there (i.e., scholars would need Sampas's

permission just to look at them).  This is the same tactic Mr. Sampas used

successfully with my MEMORY BABE archive in Lowell.  In Sampas's letters to

Tom Staley at the University of Texas, he specifically demanded information

about what materials Gerald Nicosia had seen.  Staley refused to divulge

private library records, and BOTH CALIFORNIA AND TEXAS TOLD MR. SAMPAS TO

KEEP HIS HANDS OUT OF THEIR COLLECTIONS.  Would that U Mass, Lowell, had

done the same.

        Mr. Sampas had the "FINAL SAY" on what Kerouac letters, and what

parts of letters, Ann Charters was allowed to publish in the SELECTED

LETTERS volume from Viking/Penguin.  This is by her own admission in her

interview with Dan Barth, which I excerpted in an earlier post.

        There is no proof that Mr. Sampas controls the Lowell Celebrates

Kerouac! committee, but the two key members of that committee who gave Brad

Parker* the hardest time, Paul Marion and Roger Brunelle, are both close

associates of Mr. Sampas.  (In an earlier post, I told how Brad Parker had

attempted to stage independent Kerouac events in Lowell, had been opposed by

the Lowell Celebrates Kerouac! committee, and had complained to the National

Park Service about their interference.)

        Mr. Sampas and his nephew Jim were honored guests at the New York

University Kerouac Conference in 1995.  They sat behind the same desk with

conference organizer Helen Kelly.  Ms. Kelly repeatedly refused to invite

Jan and me to participate in that conference--though both of us had spoken

for years with a unique voice about Jack Kerouac.  Instead, we were replaced

with the likes of Andy Clausen, a hod-carrier poet from Oakland (any of you

ever heard of Mr. Clausen as an expert on Jack Kerouac?).  When Jan Kerouac

and I showed up at the conference anyway, and paid $120 apiece to get in, we

were almost immediately dragged out by police.  Later, one of the conference

organizers told me confidentially: "You know, we had to please Mr. Sampas,

or he wouldn't have given us permission to use Kerouac materials here.  We

couldn't have put on this conference without his cooperation."

        Recently, Mr. Sampas has hassled Steven Turner in England about both

the content and the format of his book, ANGELHEADED HIPSTER.  There were

complaints to Turner from David Stanford, Sampas's editor at Viking, that

material about Jack's alcoholism and bisexuality should be removed from the

book.  Sampas even objected to the use of a photo on the back jacket showing

JACK HOLDING A TEACUP, because, according to Turner, MR. SAMPAS FELT IT

SHOWED KEROUAC AS A DRINKER!  According to Mr. Turner, Mr. Sampas has also

threatened legal action against him for what Sampas claims was his illegal

use of certain Kerouac materials.

        When biographer Ellis Amburn sought John Sampas's help, he was given

a list of people NOT TO SPEAK TO.  Brad Parker, my friend, was on the TABOO

LIST.  Mr. Amburn never contacted me either, incidentally, though Kerouac

scholars contact me on a weekly (sometimes daily) basis.

        FINALLY, NOT ONE KEROUAC SCHOLAR IN THE WORLD HAS HAD FREE ACCESS TO

THE ENTIRE JACK KEROUAC ARCHIVE, AND THE VERY FEW WHO HAVE SEEN EVEN

SIGNIFICANT PIECES OF IT HAVE BEEN HAND-PICKED BY MR. SAMPAS.  (Contrast

this with Allen Ginsberg, for example, who allowed any serious scholar

complete access to his own archive, and did not demand proof of political

correctness first.)

        NONE of the above activities by Mr. Sampas is ILLEGAL.  But they

demonstrate an overweening effort to control Kerouac scholarship by an

individual who is not a scholar in any sense.  They smack of censorship, and

they are hugely detrimental to the free flow and free development of ideas

about Jack Kerouac.

        Mr. Anstee asserts that in opposing this control, I simply want to

control Kerouac scholarship myself.  I ask Mr. Anstee to produce HIS

EVIDENCE OF THIS, comparable to the list I have just produced.

        I have here produced plenty of evidence (and there is more I have

not mentioned) of Mr. Sampas's ongoing control.

        A great American writer deserves better than this.

        What can YOU DO ABOUT IT?  YOU CAN RAISE YOUR VOICES ABOUT IT, AND

KEEP RAISING YOUR VOICES, and refuse to be silenced by Mr. Anstee's

dishonest call for a return to the status quo.  WHAT status quo, Mr. Anstee?

The ground is being swept out from under my feet, and the feet of every

sincere Kerouac scholar, even as we speak.  ALL OF YOU ON THE BEAT-LIST, AND

YOUR FRIENDS, CAN LET MR. SAMPAS KNOW THAT THIS KIND OF HEAVY-HANDED CONTROL

IS NO LONGER ACCEPTABLE.

        Finally, let me dispel once for all this smokescreen Mr. Chaput has

put out that the Jack Kerouac Archive is already in the New York Public Library:

        Jack Kerouac saved all his childhood and teenage writings, many of

them in the form of self-published comic books and newspapers.  He also

saved early unpublished "juvenile" novels, such as THE SEA IS MY BROTHER and

AND THE HIPPOS WERE BOILED IN THEIR TANKS!  The New York Public Library has

NONE OF THE YOUTHFUL, PRE-PUBLICATION WRITINGS OF JACK KEROUAC.

        Jack Kerouac typed almost all his most important books (with the

exceptions of DR. SAX, VISIONS OF GERARD and VISIONS OF CODY) on long

scrolls of paper.  ON THE ROAD was typed on 20-foot strips of Japanese art

paper taped end to end; the others were typed on teletype rolls.

        THE NEW YORK PUBLIC LIBRARY DOES NOT OWN A SINGLE ONE OF THESE

SCROLLS.  NOR DOES IT OWN ANY OF THE RETYPED VERSIONS OF THESE BOOKS.

        VISIONS OF GERARD, VISIONS OF CODY, and DR. SAX, undoubtedly three

of Kerouac's greatest books, were written mostly in pencil.  THE NEW YORK

PUBLIC LIBRARY DOES NOT OWN ANY OF THE DRAFTS OF THOSE BOOKS EITHER.

        Kerouac carefully filed all of his correspondence (including drafts

of his own letters) since the early 1940's--three decades of correspondence.

WHAT THE NEW YORK PUBLIC LIBRARY HAS OF THIS IS A FEW DOZEN XEROXED KEROUAC

LETTERS AND A FEW DOZEN ORIGINAL KEROUAC LETTERS TO MEMBERS OF THE SAMPAS

FAMILY.

        Jack Kerouac kept an extensive file of personal photographs of his

family and his friends.  THE NEW YORK PUBLIC LIBRARY HAS NONE OF THESE PHOTOS.

        Jack Kerouac made 100's of private tapes of himself and his friends

reading and singing.  NONE OF THESE TAPES IS IN THE NEW YORK PUBLIC LIBRARY.

        Jack Kerouac had a personal library of hundreds of books, many of

them with marginal annotations that he made in them while reading.  THE NEW

YORK PUBLIC LIBRARY HAS NONE OF KEROUAC'S BOOKS.

        How is it, then, that the New York Public Library already houses the

Jack Kerouac Archive?

        Ladies and gentlemen, I rest my case.

        In friendship to all of you, especially the guy in Fort Wayne who

offered to buy me a cold beer, I remain (as my Vietnam vet buddies say)

        Yours for the duration, Gerry Nicosia

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 10:00:41 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Levi Asher <brooklyn@NETCOM.COM>

Subject:      Anybody know Andrew Burnett?

 

Is anybody here in touch with a Beat aficianado named

Andrew Burnett?  Over a year ago he wrote up a virtual

tour of Neal Cassady-era Denver for me, which I put

up on my pages at http://www.charm.net/~brooklyn/Denver/Denver.html --

this week, to my great surprise, it got a very nice write-up

in the New Yorker (!) in the section where they review web

sites.  Andrew would be thrilled -- but I don't have a current

email or snail-mail address for him!

 

------------------------------------------------------

           Levi Asher = brooklyn@netcom.com

 

   Literary Kicks: http://www.charm.net/~brooklyn/

            (the beat literature web site)

 

 Queensboro Ballads: http://www.levity.com/brooklyn/

             (my fantasy folk-rock album)

 

          ###################################

 

          "Tie yourself to a tree with roots"

                    -- Bob Dylan

-----------------------------------------------------

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 11:05:14 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>

Subject:      Re: Paul Blake, Jr.

 

At 11:20 AM 5/13/97 -0400, you wrote:

>     Mr. Nicosia:

>

>     Couldn't Mr. Blake pick up a few bucks for himself by writing a book

>     about his relationship with his uncle Jack?

>

>

>     Ron Rodgers

>

Dear Ron:     May 13, 1997

 

        Paul is a great storyteller like all the Kerouac's, and I recently

spent a whole day out in Sacramento with him, listening to him tell Kerouac

family stories to the BBC film crew.  (I put some of them on audio tape

myself.)  The trouble is, he's not a professional writer; and he's also

desperately trying to take care of his family of wife and 4 kids.  He didn't

get to park his trailer on the neighbor's land for free.  There are actually

a couple of empty houses on the land that he has to repair, fences to keep

up, and general caretaker duties he has to do to earn the right to keep his

family there rent-free.

        Certainly Paul has enough material for a book, but he would need a

good writer or editor to work with him.  If you've followed my recent posts,

you know I have more than enough family duties (sick mother, 2 year old

daughter) and work duties (Vietnam book, 2 Kerouac estate lawsuits,

autobiography to write for CONTEMPORARY AUTHORS) to use up the 24 hours in a

day.  There's no way I could find time to go out to Sacramento and work with

him on that book.

        It would also have to be somebody he could trust, because many of

his revelations will be told in court, if Jan Kerouac's lawsuit ever goes to

trial in St. Petersburg.

        I think we all should help him get back on his feet, however, and

I'll suggest something on the Beat-List later today.

        Thanks for your concern.

        Best, Gerry Nicosia

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 11:45:12 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>

Subject:      Re: the mysterious Corso

 

At 01:00 PM 5/13/97 +0300, you wrote:

>Dear all,

>

>I am new here and have been following the interesting discussions

>on this list concerning the Beats for a while now.  But whatever happened

>to Corso?!  I am currently working on a paper on Corso's poetry, and since

>I know that there are many 'experts' here, I would like to ask you a

>question concerning his poetry.  In the poem called "Clown" he has the

>following line:

>

>"And for God I am ready with a mouthful of penguins."

>

>Does anyone know or have any idea as to the meaning of the word

>"penguins"?  I know that he uses the same expression in at least a

>couple of other poems as well, so I'm guessing that it's more than just a

>whimsical surrealistic image.  Perhaps drug lingo?  Also, if anyone knows

>any academic work that has previously been done on Corso, I'm all ears.

>

>Ilkka

>

Dear IIkka,     May 13, 1997

        I don't think I'm telling tales out of school that Gregory (whom I

like to think of as a good friend) has had substance abuse problems for a

long time, both with heroin and alcohol.  He was (and may still be) in a

methadone program.  He has many regrets about having wasted portions of his

life and talent, and especially about "not being there for his kids" more.

He is on the surface a thorny, sarcastic, distrustful sort of guy; but deep

down he cares about a lot of things, including making this world a better

place, and certainly about "keeping poetry pure," as he's said to me more

than once.

        There was a woman running around a couple of years ago doing

interviews for a biography of Corso, but I never heard any more from her (I

can't even remember her name!) and I never heard any more about her book either.

        Gregory is far more a surrealist than a symbolist, so you can't

expect every image in his poem to correlate to some other thing or concept.

"Fried shoes"--another of his great lines--doesn't represent anything but

the mind having fun with itself.  "A mouthful of  penguins"--in my view--is

just another attempt to jar you out of your mundane mindset, make you see

the world differently--which is traditionally the great mission of poetry,

which the surrealists just updated a little.  As far as the image recurring

in a few places, well, Gregory often enjoys quoting himself and will play

with favorite images like a kid looking at different facets of a favorite

marble.

        Best, Gerry Nicosia

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 11:56:46 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>

Subject:      Re: New JK books for Fall

 

.... in

>1992 the renewal aspect was significantly changed, and renewal was granted

>AUTOMATICALLY to all books published after January 1, 1964. Now nearly all

>the dates you listed in this post fall just before that date,

>Best

>

>Nick W-W

>

Dear Nick,           May 13, 1997

        The only one of the books I listed that was published after Jan. 1,

1964 was the second half of OLD ANGEL MIDNIGHT, but it was published not as

a book but as part of a magazine, EVERGREEN REVIEW.  Does that still make it

automatically renewed?  If so, it means that only half of OLD ANGEL MIDNIGHT

is in public domain.

        Sorry if I misled anyone.  It was unintentional.  As you say,

copyright law is complicated--it's no wonder lawyers have to specialize in

it to be any good.

        Best, Gerry Nicosia

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 15:00:45 EDT

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Bill Gargan <WXGBC@CUNYVM.BITNET>

Subject:      Re: SoRRY  (Bill Gargan)

In-Reply-To:  Message of Mon, 12 May 1997 22:34:28 -0500 from

              <msackma@MAILHOST.TCS.TULANE.EDU>

 

Matthew, just resubscribe from your new address.  I deleted you.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 12:38:54 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         "s.a. griffin" <perrotta@CALVIN.USC.EDU>

Subject:      Re: Howl to the bard/exploding text report

 

=20

>i think you should consider posting the Howl to the Bard narrative on

>the Listserv.  i imagine some people would enjoy it.  it certainly would

>provide a change of pace from the Mother-of-All-Estate-Squabbles ....

>

>david rhaesa

>

>

 

Here ya go kids, lost it once on the =91puter thang.  Swallowed the danged

thing up and wouldn=92t give it back.  Ah well.  Anyway, forgive any errors,

mistakes in reference, it is almost 4 a.m. here on the not so sunny

westcoast at present and I am left handed.   Thanks again for playing with

me on Allen=92s behalf.  It was a rare pleasure.  Until we meet to sing and

dance, yours, s.a.

 

Howl To The Bard

Allen Ginsberg Tribute at Beyond Baroque

May 10, 1997

Venice, Ca.

 

 

I was late getting started as I had been going on in a stone rant earlier on

with neighborhood pal about poetry and how not to give oneself credit for

reinventing the wheel as it just is so roll with it.  Was there to cop a

bone to carry to the reading with me as not to arrive empty headed out of

hand alas.  Much traffic on the 10 West backed up in looksee museum of

common rubberneck activity due to multiple late in the day stress breakdown

party up get down out of control shutdown late in the day early in the

evening beautiful Saturday pile ups Santa Monica freeway eastbound.  Wow!

Put marbles in mouth and teach me to talk.  So anyway, I=92m doing my best=

 to

get there carrying a head full of words and a heart full of Allen.  When I

finally pulled up to the event, parking was very tough leading me to believe

that this was going to be a full blown shindig indeed.  Finally squeezed

into a tiny space with my little Korean limo, grabbed copies of exploding

text and headed towards the light of Baroque.

 

30 or so were gathered on the lawn outside around a speaker monitor

listening to the goings on as I threaded thru  the crowd of good folk

passing out the exploding text that many thought were programs and I say

sure why not and keep moving weaving bobbing  boxing  my way thru making my

way inside falling in deeply the tea party full steam.  More folks are

standing in the lobby as there was no room inside the squeezing room only

main event.  The room generally only holds a max of about 100 or so and at

least 250 plus were assembled attentive as the thing was alive with energy,

love and spirit.  I came in on the Venice Beat segment of the show as John

Thomas was at the business of talking about Allen and Neal and about this

and that and working the crowd with much grace and appreciated wit and

somehow ended up in the bathroom sitting on the toilet or something  when

Fred the director came over and grabbed me to take me to a seat next to

FranCeye Dean Smith former old lady of Bukowski mother of Marina

affectionately known in Buk lit as "old snaggle tooth".  A truly fine and

sweet woman.  I felt like I was there to see the man Frank Sinatra at

Madison Square Garden the way the room held itself.  There was some recorded

stuff of Ginsberg and then next in the music WAS FRANK, Frank T. Rios old

time Venice beatster and east coast wise guy who talked disembodiment of

poets poetry and disembodied holy past in drugs and words and deed with

Corso the two somehow simpatico lit brothers of street smart scene and

hipster beat thing of period past and how he woke up the morning after Allen

had passed and said to himself that he like every other dumb fuck was

writing A GINSBERG POEM and this made him self conscious and naked in

thought so he called Black Ace publisher poet writer man Tony Scibella cross

town old pal still another component of Venice Beat old time wordsmith rat

pack and asked if he was doing the same like writing a poem for and about

Ginsberg and he says I don=92t write poems on dead body and this was=

 something

for Frank to work with.  So Frank talked a bit more and read holy inspired

poem for Ginsberg and then when finished burned it and placed in sacred

silver salad bowl shrine sitting on the sidelines.  He took us there

peaceful like and we felt the grace and beauty and love.  To complete the

Venice segment is Philomene Long raven haired beat angel  wife of John

Thomas and creator director of fantastic film "Venice Beats:  An Existential

Comedy" which I highly recommend and she reads words for Allen in a never

before voice which seemed to come from the other side that shot thru the

crowd and filled our centers with sweet cream of vision.

 

We were there,  flying.  Click your heels three times there is no place like

home.  The Wichita Vortex is intoned.  There are many Red Wheelbarrows as

well.  Whitman and Blake left their footprints on the night and then left

the building as  cosmic croon doggies of sing me to sleep inside the common

dream of human desire. =20

 

There goes Jupiter, there goes Mars and here comes Man =91O War! =20

 

Heard later that I had missed Keith Antar Mason  of Hitite Empire whom

everyone said was great and he is.

 

More folks jumped up and spoke and read.

 

Black Sparrow high priestess of word Wanda Coleman is in the house following

jazzpoet husband Austin Strauss.  She goes on in a searing rant and roll of

anger, hatred and brokenhearted ire and the crowd is silent as if standing

in the middle of the road in shocking glare of headlights or watching an

oncoming train with your foot caught in the switching track.  She finishes

her prepared work for the eve and then breaks it all down in a slow

deliberate rap about how when she came into this room pissed but that the

spirit of the room reached out to her as Allen Ginsberg coming from the back

of the room arms open for her and he comes toward and she is still fucking

pissed but Allen wraps her in arms of true devotion and she is letting go

her anger now being consumed by Allen=92s embrace and she slowly and more

quietly dissolves into peace and now descends into silent love set free on

everyone there.

 

David Ulin talks about how some critic said that Allen was the poet most

willing to be mediocre and David says that this is a high compliment and I

agree that he, Allen, was human and willing to fail and if you can=92t fail

then what have you got?  Shit sandwich disguised as wisdom.=20

 

Mike Lally talked about his actor ego and such and finally walked into short

world of how to be humble and began to say that Allen always said he was

reminiscent of Neal C. due to energy and attitude and Lally shot off, "Hey,

fuck you man, I=92m from New Jersey, I=92m Kerouac, not Cassady!"  Large=

 guilty

laughter at common attitude and not so secret shared dreams unfulfilled and

in the back of the room Neal tossed his hammer and talked endlessly about

Dr. Feelgood and his =9239 Chevy with no brakes coming down the hill while

tripping on gassy nebula undiscovered.  Lally went on some more and finally

came to the point where after years of association with the man due to much

experience of living he had calmed down and come full circle to where

Ginsberg began to defer to Michael.  He ended up talking about a fete or

something of Allen where folks went on and on about Allen this and that

until finally Allen gets up and basically calls it all fake in amazing

poetic language even accusing the gold as being "fake".

 

More audio of Allen.  Pull My Daisy, the incredible eulogy to Neal about

nipples, bicep=92d arm and flesh which I was glad to hear as it is one of my

all time faves.

 

More people read.  Speak.

 

Michael C. Ford, one of the only humans I could never tire of hearing speak

because of his glib gravely jazzy jazz speak like from the brass bell of

trumpet he talks about old days late 60=92s flash to Kenneth Rexroth via

Kenneth Patchen, someone=92s got a gig at San Diego State and Rexroth having

some trouble with the deal in terms of respect and so there are things to be

done to restore honor, respect.  The students will mount an event maybe.

Rexroth says to Ford come to my place tonight for dinner got a surprise for

ya. Ford shows up and guess who=92s coming to dinner?   Ginsberg,=

 Ferlinghetti

and him.  In retro he says that of course he didn=92t know what he had or=

 who

was really with and as the eve goes on Allen isn=92t looking good or=

 something

and someone maybe Michael C. as youth says what=92s the deal and Ginsberg=92=

s

response is, "New York!"  That all his woes are New York, that whatever it

is is New York.  The weather?  New York!  The economy?  New York!  New York,

New York, New York!  Bad hair day?  Fucking A!  New York. . . " and the

event becomes New York and there is the feel of Times Square Huncke digging

all beatific winking at the parade.

 

This night strange for me.  So much death in recent time.  Huncke gone.  Jan

K. dead of Jack attack at young age just like father before her.  Clellon

Holmes and first beat Go!. . . gone.  L.A. bigbeat meat poet Bukowksi

slipped away to make words for father in possible heaven.  Local

friends/poetmakers gone: J.W. McCullough from Philly/Denver scene found dead

in flophouse digs of broken heart and mind said wandering  funkytown center

of L.A. in sad drag looking for a fix for breaking heart.  Allen J. Friedman

who whispered poem to me in deathbed meditation and left with his boots on

swinging to other side.  Gone.  Bob Flanagan Supermasochist leader of poetry

at Beyond Baroque who transcended pain of living thru pleasure of pain in

life.  Gone.  Kurt Cobain who mistook the hole in his stomach for the tears

in his head, also gone & Jerry Garcia who took the show with him. . . Gone.

And in mid-December my mother gone from overload of sad life liver shutdown

I missed her by minutes in life now she gone and this the day before

Mother=92s Day and I call you Mother from the pulpit of my life, my living

memorial to you I am.   Now they are all here with me, now.  With the folks

from the Beat List.  The electric voice and spirit all here now.  I have

fasted for this, waited for this, meditated and come here for this. . . soon

these voices will rise up with me and sing!

 

The night rolls on.  2, 2 =BD hours.=20

 

1st break.

 

I am in the lobby sitting on the stairs taking my head for a walk when

somebody taps me on the shoulders and sez, "Did you hear?  Corso is dead!

Died two days ago standing in front of a train!"  "What?  Don=92t fuck with

me, I=92m not up for it."  "No, I just heard. Corso=92s dead!"  She sees=

 that I

am truly shaken because somewhere in the back of my skull there lurks this

same info like the long shadow of a recent ghost some kinda fucking

doppleganger and so she leaves me dressed in the not so pretty news as I

despair on the stair.  I search the crowd for verification/denial and all I

get is both.  It is maddening; mad, not even funny rumor of death inside of

death and it is racing towards my stomach and vaulting towards my head past

my heart.  Happy entrails to you, until we meet again. . .  The break is

over.  Liza Richardson of radio scene steps up to the stage takes the

microphone and declares Corso gone as well.  Poet patron sacred soul Ron

Maxson who is related to Corso by marriage stands up in the audience to

debate/deny her story.  It is too much.  I don=92t think I can deal.  I walk

outside to put some air back into my sails.  Later Ron tells me that he had

heard the same rumors the past few days and in prep for this event called

back east to find out truth so to bring it with him here just in case and as

it happened, thank whatever fucking gods for that!  He did.

 

Like Mark Twain:  "The rumors of my death have been greatly exaggerated."

 

While outside they play a recording of Allen.  I used to believe that really

all that Allen wanted to be was a rock star.  After hearing this recording I

was convinced that he was a rock star.  I don=92t know what the hell it was,

but it rocked, and rocked and rocked!  Don=92t let anyone tell you any

different, Allen Ginserg was a rock star baby!

 

Now a woman gets up to speak of her first meeting with AG like many have and

will before the night=92s over.  She talks about how she gave him a poem she

wrote and asked his opinion and he says it has womans blood in it and take

it to Waldman as she is better equipped to deal with such and she says hey

if it had cock in it would you dig it then? And Ginsberg sez yeah.  She goes

on to read her piece which blooms like surreal picnic in glorious garden of

everything still possible.  She knew him many years and  the words ring with

long and short deep feel of it.   She gives us her special place in the sun

and we are warmed with her safe fire of passion for poet and deeds done.

 

Then, an assassin takes the mike.  She is dressed in sheep=92s clothing of

Naropa.  She is a Greek bearing gifts of Allen this and Allen that.  Her

assault is relentless.  She cannot run out of ammunition.  She drops bombs,

one after the other.  She burns bridges. She is loaded with endless hip and

cool.   She rapes our tiny village of good times.  She chokes the audience

like a weak kitten slam dunking our sorry asses into her hellish toilet of

long winded self reflection as she goes on and on and on. . . 5, 10, 15, 20

minutes of nothing and nowhere and somehow off  into the realm of NAMBLA

even and Allen this and that rat a tat tat tat tat and the crowd starts to

leave first one, then two, then they start for the door in small groups and

as they exit they ponder out loud like what in the fuck is she going on for

and why is she doing this to us?  What the hell did we do to her to deserve

this?   She has committed the numero uno sin of all sins as a

performer/speaker or anything pretending to entertain or inform:  SHE IS

ENDLESSLY BORING!!!!!    She murders any hope that she will soon be

finished.  To be intentionally boring can be and is an art, but to bore

unintentionally should be punishable by immediate revocation of poetic

license never to be returned.  To the credit of those of us left in

attendance, as much as she uses the good name of Allen Ginsberg, we know she

only speaks of herself and is certainly not paying any sort of tribute to

the man.  Is she innocent?  Is she guilty?

 

Finally she is finished.  Stick a fucking fork in her and turn her sorry ass

over.

 

Forgive me father Ginsberg.

 

But wait!  Could it be?  Just when you thought it was safe to venture back

into tributeville up to the mike comes her accomplice, because in Hollywood,

everything deserves a lousy sequel. =20

 

So now this second hitman for the art mob, this wordy sonofabitch goes on

and on and on. He is reading an essay.  Lucky him.  Not so lucky us.  Now

the people are really filing out.  They are fanning themselves with doubt

and worry afraid for their own tender hides as they leave their wounded

comrades bruised and bleeding at yet the tonsils of this second assassin.

 

The crowd, once hopeful and 250 or 300 strong, within the span of 45 minutes

and two speakers, have been roasted down to about 100 of the truly strong of

spirit =91cause they know that there is magic yet to live.  Poetry can be=

 ugly

and nasty, a vile and evil fucker that can kill your spouse and steal your

mind, but the real spirit of poets and poetry will always prevail and before

ya know it, in comes Williams Wheelbarrow and there is Whitman=92s Brooklyn

Bridge which sings electric and a gentle rain begins to fall to douse the

tall flames lit by the two strangely innocent killers and there is Allen

Ginsberg with his arms once again around the night whispering in our ear:

"Are you my angel?"  And he kisses the ignorant heads of the two bombers and

acquits them of any wrong doing, pats them on their stupid heads and sends

them on their way as he knows they will have places to go now that they have

finished with their Wagnerian warblings in the key of nothing flat and

nowhere sharp.

 

The 2nd break.

 

More folks leave satisfied that there is nothing any longer worth staying

for.  The assassins satisfied that they have done their job leave as well

and Gregory Corso is still alive. =20

 

The room relaxes.

 

I tune up with just a little more weed.  Got to relax.  Give it up.

 

The break is over.

 

It is sad how people never learn that the real music often blows after the

doors shut and the saxophone man sits down to play his music to the angels

like a river to the sea where we all float in ecstasy.  School=92s out and

school=92s in let the fat rhythm begin.

 

Round 3.

 

FranCeye gets up and lights the event with her love letter to Allen.  She

says that once she said to Allen, "Thank you."  And he said, "You=92re

welcome."  And this was all that mattered.  That you=92re welcome was some

sort of mantra, a chant that said it all and as she finished she left

quietly with, "Thank you Allen.  You=92re welcome."  And believe me, we were

cleansed and the room was free.

 

Earlier in the night someone had read Ginsberg=92s America poem and Laurel=

 Ann

Bogen Detective Supremo freaked and almost left because that was what she

was going to read.  Fred and I, mostly Fred, got down on our knees in mock

worship to keep her there and stay she did.   We were lucky.   A self

confessed split personality type, she was fueled with the anger of her

displacement and was a survivor of the holocaust of earlier boring rants by

our twin killers.  She was prime.  With arched eyebrow and magic manic grin,

she read that damned thing the way it should always be read:  Mad baby!

Mad!  She roared and the music of AG=92s language which broke new land speed

records and jailhouse rocks as flowers exploded in a frenzied quilt of color

at ground zero.=20

 

Then fellow Carma Bum Doug Knott read.  Giggling goddess of spoken and

written word Ellyn Maybe did her thing and sang White Shroud.  The Dharma

Lion stretched his legs across the room and relaxed in the empty seats.  We

were about 3 =BD hours into it now and there were only about  50 devoted=

 ones

left.

 

Exene Cervenkova asked me during the break if I minded going after her since

she was being recorded for some  Internet thing and I pulled out my stuff

and said well I created mine on the Internet so maybe it was relevant but it

didn=92t really matter to me and she said well I was told that you had been

waiting a lot longer than me and I said do whatever you like Exene it will

be fine that whatever she did would be the right thing and she walked away

mumbling something like I=92m sure it will.

 

My name was called as I was sitting outside talking with John Thomas and

Laurel Ann.  I shot up and walked in.  Not so stoned but very high.  "I come

to you as the Reverend representative of The Dynasty of Divine Love and

Tolerance."  I started.  "Bless the sacred holy noble truth.  Welcome to

Temple Baroque!"  A few shouted with me.  My part in the revival had begun.

"Be with me now!"  I intoned, "Be with me. . . "  I hardly knew where I was

anymore.  I was coming apart and reassembling myself as a cubist comedy in

full relief.   I was hungry and scared and somehow sacred in the moment.  I

announced that I was sick of writing eulogies for dead poets and that I

really wasn=92t up to it, so being on this beat list thing where we all=

 talked

about Beats and about who was Beat what was Beat, beat, beat, beet and then

we eat it and Rinaldo walked in with Italy under his arm and took an empty

seat.  I went on about how  I took Ginsberg=92s piece "On Burroughs Work"

presented it to the list and 7 or 8 of us took turns altering it and blah,

blah, blah. . . . I pronounced and mispronounced the authors names.  I took

a breath, looked at the paper as if it were something and I spoke, " On The

Work of Burroughs. . . the method must be purest meat of sharktalk spoor. .

."  there was an energy, there was a movement.  My voice didn=92t seem to be

my own, my body light and filled with all the thoughts and visions that had

come before.  I couldn=92t believe how easy it was to sing.  I was hitting

fastballs that were creeping past the plate from over the Atlantic as I

placed them one after the other in the outfield and over the fence.  Some

danced on the foul line safe and I was gone and everyone was there and we

were dancing the words.  I just kept speaking one word after the other not

really knowing what was coming next.  I reached the part of "skin holy,

baseball holy, time holy. . ." and I felt my center shoot up into my throat

as the words became large and wet with the tears struggling to liberate

themselves from my throat.  Allen wrapped his arms around me and I pulled

the humans in and together we shouted, "HOLY!  HOLY!  HOLY!"  I slipped the

page behind the others and suddenly I saw the words and knew I dropped a

page but being cut and paste I shouted "GODDAMMIT!!  WHICH WAY DOES YOUR

BEARD POINT TONIGHT ALLEN?  POETS HOLY:" Then skipped back and picked it up

previous,  jumping back on the bus roaring thru tributetown with everyone

once again safely on board.  We sang and drank skin holy, Canada holy, U.K.

holy, Kansas vortex and California holy, holy, holy, beat list members holy!

It is true, it was true; you could have heard the old proverbial pin drop in

timezone Saturday night.  I finished quietly firmly and direct, ". . . I

hear what you say and I now write to the world to do it:  rise up!  Rise up!

And claim this world!. . . " and the few left got it, I got it, they got, we

all got it.  Some shouted with me at the end, "Holy!  Holy! Holy!"  Then

once again, quietly I stated, "Don=92t hide the madness." as  I ripped up=

 the

paper with the words on it and dropped into Frank Rios=92 sacred silver=

 salad

bowl and left the room.  Lewis MacAdams was waiting to come on and turned to

me and said, "Nice words."  Later I realized that I had forgotten the last

line, "A word to the wise guy."  But I hadn=92t been myself really, I had=

 been

taken over and highjacked by the vision and energy of all of those that came

to the party with me.  I was pissed but cut and paste. . . I did it Sunday,

Mother=92s Day in memory of my gone Mother at weekly poetry hullabaloo up=

 the

street at The Onyx Caf=E9 and it sang again and vibrated in all the right

places once again!  Holy!  Fucking Holy!  It lived.  It lives.

 

But hey, the night=92s not over, no indeedy. =20

 

Next was Exene Cervenkova who got up and said that Allen Ginsberg was the

greatest poet of the 20th Century and she was glad he was gay.  She talked

about back in the heyday of  quintessential punk rock days of X with John

Doe while living on Ave. 42 in Mt. Washington I believe it was that she

received a fax one day from AG and she didn=92t know how he got their number

but nonetheless, there was this fax and seems that Allen wanted her and John

to put it to music and maybe use it on an album or something.  Well, I guess

that never happened, in fact, Exene says she lost the thing and hopes to

someday find it again.  She and Ginsberg became buds.  She talked about how

he deferred to her setting up his stage for his readings and asking if

everything was all right and then showing her poetry of his and asking if

that was all right and so on.  Exene saying that the man was just being

humble in her opinion as he had done this thousands of times and who was

she?  She closed with words for Allen and then got off.

 

Lewis MacAdams who wrote an incredible sendoff for Allen in The L.A. Weekly,

whose brilliant JK/Beat documentary will live forever, dressed in coat and

tie and fine brim looking a bit like a song and dance man straight out of

maybe St. Louis, came in somewhere about this time and told a story about

how Ginsberg wanted to make it with him and his old lady at this particular

time past maybe when he first met the big man can=92t recall the whole=

 evening

is of course filtered thru experience and light haze of medicinal marijuana

which tugs at the old memory bone from time to time ya know, so anyway Lewis

is talking here and he says well hey Allen I=92m not into this scene so=

 Lewis,

he goes and crawls into his sleeping bag while Allen and his woman I guess

are wrestling, going at it, Lewis watching and listening, panting and

groaning or what have you, doing it until finally I guess Allen reaches over

with one finger and touches Lewis gently on the forehead and Lewis spurts

immediately.   Yowsa!  Guess he=92s not into those scenes, huh?  Lewis went

and talked some more and read leaving us well and happy.

 

Then something wonderful happened.

 

Exene had brought along Ronnie Blakely who sang in famous Altman flick

"Nashville".  She told us of her love for Allen and how when once time past

Allen who so wanted to be with Dylan on the Rolling Thunder Review, that

after he and Orlovsky, their segment of the show had been cut, agreed to

stick with the show by shuttling luggage to and from the tour buses.  It was

heartbreaking and enlightening to hear her tell it.  I have rarely seen a

person speak with such real love and reverence.  She said that they never

knew where they were going because for some reason it was all a secret, but

that she would stick her luggage out in the hallway late at night and early

in the morning, Allen and Peter would come by scooping up the luggage to be

placed on board the bus and on to destination unknown cities.  She spoke

lovingly of relationship of many years and then asked if she could speak or

sing a song she had written for him.  The group asked her to sing.  I cannot

tell you how lucky we were to be there.  She was our angel, the angel Allen

spoke of.  Her voice was honey, she held Allen in her music quenched his

thirst and quelled his fears.  She held our hearts captive with her song and

healed the wounded night.  It rained love.  This was the moment of pure

light that the sax man dreamed as he played his music to the stars.   Hale

Bopp.   She sang it for us all.

 

The night certainly could have ended there.  But there was an open now.

 

First one guy went on and on with his hit on America poem called America

revisited.  Ouch.  He started reading when I realized that he had a stack of

paper.  Ah well, what the fuck ya know.  In the now kind and gentle spirit

of it all, the last dozen or so left, we listened.  Then Nate (no last name)

got up and jammed on guitar punk like and screamed and sang a fantastic rant

for Allen.  Another home run.  Then lastly a guy who got up and said he was

a film director who had desperately been trying to do a thing on the beats

and said he wouldn=92t go on too long. . . guess what?  He did.

 

>From begin to end:  just about 4 =BD hours.=20

 

The six of us left all went out to drink and eat.

 

Holy, holy, holy. . .love holy!   Allen Ginsberg. . . holy.

 

End of story.

 

 

xxxooo

S.A. Griffin

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 15:51:30 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Michael Stutz <stutz@DSL.ORG>

Subject:      Re: The horror of ken going furthur

In-Reply-To:  <v03007802af9df8229a77@[206.190.9.125]>

 

On Tue, 13 May 1997, Zach Hoon wrote:

 

> here i the 90s, what? i don't even know what to call the major issues. gay

> lib? abortion? aids? this generation/decade seems to be plagued by wackos and

> cults: Oklahoma City, Waco, Dahmer, Heaven's Gate, Atlanta Bomber, World

> Trade Center, Planes blowing up. Can't protest that. can't be a movement or

> a march against that.

 

no protests, no movements -- the issue is communication. the word of the 90s

is feedback.

 

 

> So i have a lot of respect for the protests and marches and _ambition_ of

> those involved in the 60s. not an easy thing to do...i wish for something

> to drive my generation into action, instead of Jenny McCarthy's boobs or

> the next $%&^# Batman movie.

 

Not _everyone_ in the 60s was a hippie protester. Don't you think there are

a lot of people driven into action right now? Maybe not picketing, no, but

there are many more important things to be doing right now.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 13:51:08 -0700

Reply-To:     stauffer@pacbell.net

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         James Stauffer <stauffer@PACBELL.NET>

Subject:      Re: The horror! The horror!

 

AC46 wrote:

>

> I can't believe that I'm reading things about a Prankster reunion

 

Well, of course, you don't have to, but then what did you expect on a

list principally devoted to old or dead writer?

 

I was given tickets to go see Dylan. Since that day I cannot listen

> to Dylan without partly seeing the old, haggard, out of tune man that I

> saw at the concert.

 

But if you had gone earlier he would have been young, haggard and out of

tune--still great

 

 but I for one

> would rather see an unknown group of 20 yr olds who were making valid

> nineties statements, than make a pilgrimage to see the Pranksters who

> belonged to a very specific and real "moment" in American history.

 

 

No one's asking you not to check out the 20yr olds.  Is this mutually

exclusive. Did Kesey need to get permission from another generational

zip code before making this trip, and if so who elected you? If you

aren't interested, don't bother with it. I assume you and Zach are the

lucky ones that will never grow old, never bore the kids with stories of

your glory days, you're going to keep that edge on your blade all the

way through.  Good luck.    You should tack this post up on your wall

and read it every decade or so--just to keep you honest.

 

J Stauffer

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 17:00:52 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         "Robert H. Sapp" <rhs4@CRYSTAL.PALACE.NET>

Subject:      Re: The horror! The horror!

In-Reply-To:  <AD25FD42EC@banana.le.ac.uk>

 

Hello,

 

It seems to from this post that the member AC46 is taking an "Age-ist"

view, though i dont wanna sound like some politically correct person or

anything.

 

I think if a bunch of elderly gents wanna act all wild and crazy and how

most people feel THE YOUNG ARE SPOSED TO ACT, then fuck yeah im all for

it. i mean, what, are you sposed to shut up when you reach a certain age

and quit racing around high or not or something?

 

As far as Dylan is concerned, most people it seems either like his voice

or not; sure, he's become a lil' less articulate (!) in singing but

that's certainly made up for by the feeling i get from his performance;

he should HAVE to adapt to the prevailing trends anymore than someone

should HAVE to flee from 'em.

 

respectfully,

Eric

 

 

P.S. regarding the Pranksters:

Do not go gentle into that good night

Dose, dose before they take away your right.

 

 

On Tue, 13 May 1997, AC46 wrote:

 

> I can't believe that I'm reading things about a Prankster reunion. Why

> can monumental experiments like that taken by Kesey and the "Neon

> Revolution" not just be left to history.

> I was nowhere near to being born in the sixties, but the Beats and

> "hippies" are my heroes. When I see them revamped and updated it makes

> me lose some of the love that I had for them in the first place. A year

> ago I was given tickets to go see Dylan. Since that day I cannot listen

> to Dylan without partly seeing the old, haggard, out of tune man that I

> saw at the concert. That is not to say that I no longer love Dylan's

> work, but I am just dissapointed by his reluctance to move with the

> times. In the last few years we have seen Woodstock 2, which in true

> nineties style went off with a wimper, the return of the beatles, and

> now Kesey and co. are back, no doubt with Day-Glo paint all over their

> zimmer frames and taking the bus to the post office every tuesday to

> collect their pensions.

> I am not questioning the validity of these aspects of sixties culture, I

> am merely expressing my dissappointment at the Pranksters for doing it

> all again in the nineties. Maybe there is not enough in our generation

> which can be held as representative of the counteculture, but I for one

> would rather see an unknown group of 20 yr olds who were making valid

> nineties statements, than make a pilgrimage to see the Pranksters who

> belonged to a very specific and real "moment" in American history.

>

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 22:52:09 +0200

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>

Subject:      Teardrops, photographed by Robert Frank.

In-Reply-To:  <Pine.OSF.3.95.970513125048.31530A-100000@camphor>

 

        PRANKSTERS DON'T TEARS FLOWERS

                NIGGHTIME

 

 

        lontano, molti anni sono passati,

        noi stiamo diventano cose,

        fiori, flowers, le nostre cellule cerebrali,

                our brain cells, diminished,

        diminuiscono, praksters are own flowers,

 

        la finestra di Robert Frank's photo, guarda,

        look at,

        grandma's doilies,

        blur windows glass,

        un'auto aspetta sul courtyard,

 

        boys, go!, it's 15th august,

        l'auto corre, the grass on both side of the highway,

 

        go! Padua, Bologna, Florence, Rome, Naples,

        Siracusa, Francofonte, Taormina, l'Etna smokin'

        in the old times, furious dog chase barking

                                under olives branches

                                        like thunder,

 

        the ferrari runs as quick as a lightnin'

        grandama calls rinaldo, look at the sirs!,

 

        the top of the Volcano, qualche pietra raccolta,

        Salvatore corre come un pazzo

                        lungo il side of the Volcano,

        look at in the down there's the snow!,

                great! IT'S summer,

 

 

        noi stiamo diventando cose,

        we're turnin' into things,

        like grandam doilies

                like xeroexes, like photos, like sound tracks of

                        Jimmi Hendrix, like everything,

 

        keep me head

        in my hands

 

        fuzzy bats & owles,

        near my house,

 

        look at the teardrops,

                smell the ancient room,

                        where black dressed woman

                                talked ancient stories

                                        tonight my grandma

                                                had planted me

                                                        as potato in the yard.

 

 

yr rinaldo

*the dumb*

*the beet*

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 17:09:54 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Michael Stutz <stutz@DSL.ORG>

Subject:      Re: the mysterious Corso

In-Reply-To:  <199705131845.LAA28915@italy.it.earthlink.net>

 

On Tue, 13 May 1997, Gerald Nicosia wrote:

 

>         There was a woman running around a couple of years ago doing

> interviews for a biography of Corso, but I never heard any more from her (I

> can't even remember her name!) and I never heard any more about her book

 either.

 

Yeah, what happened to her? Anyone know if the book ever came out? I had her

address around here somewhere, but now I can't find it, and i don't remember

the name.

 

m

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 17:30:27 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         "Robert H. Sapp" <rhs4@CRYSTAL.PALACE.NET>

Subject:      Re: The horror of ken going furthur

In-Reply-To:  <v03007800af9ddac8b3e5@[206.190.9.125]>

 

greeting fellow travelers,

 

I'd like to say first to Zach that your post is very inneresting and

enjoyale reading.

 

i just want to address a few points that disturbed me, even if its a bit

off topic on my part. forgive me.

 

 

 

On Tue, 13 May 1997, Zach Hoon wrote:

 

> flatness of salt...yeah long acid roadtrips may have been groundbreaking 30

> years ago, but i've got friends who do them every year now, for the whole

> summer, and no they're not following phish or the undead dead. we know what

> DID happen but it's irrelevant to us because we concentrate on what CAN

> happen. sick of cultural recycling...Try flying from  Chicago to Prague and

> Prague to Chicago on ecstasy there's something new...(well, kinda)

 

Following phish is no more un-genuine than SPECIFICALLY not following

phish.

the past is not IRRELEVANT if you want to improve the present or future.

 

Zach, you wrote something about -- there's too much going on now to be

dwelling on stuff rooted in the past -- (excuse the possible

misinterpretation, but i fucked up this email editing job.)

 

Anything one does IS what's happening NOW. This particular Prankster

voyage is new because it is (or at the time it just occured) was the

present. To say that an event is somehow not "new" or "current" enough is

meaningless, assumes there is a definite predictable notion of what MUST

go on at any given moment in the "current" era.

 

If they, the pranksters, want to drive around make appearences like they

did before, why the hell not? You dont have to avoid something just

because something similar has occured. And if other people are amused by

it, why should it bother you?

 

from,

Eric

 

P.S. some of the most genuine and sincere funloving friends of mine say

the've had a great experience at Furthur Fests. it might be an attempt to

reHash old times but at the same time creates NEW times whether you did

or did not live at the time o' the ol' Times. heehee!

 

 

 

> There is too much new going on to be stuck in the old. like it or not,

> future is where we're headed. the ideas and concepts laid down by KK and

> crew, AG, Jk, even my dear WSB need to be taken and listened to and

> reapplied. very few things are timeless. ideas that affect society hardly

> are, seeing that society is a fast changing monster.  most ppl living

 

 

> creative, outrageous, disruptive with them, interrupting a flow and putting

> you, maybe just briefly, into a wild possible future. that's what charms

> me: it's a possible future, not definite.  when you're doing something

> past-based, there is only one possible course of action, one that follows

> the path of those events already taken. altho i admit ther'll probably be

> much spontinaeity involved with KK and the MPs, but it will be based on a

> same philosophy. For those who were around back then, it'll be a wonderful

> one, but based on sentimentality, not new ideas, not any groundbreaking.

> and to say well it _was_  groundbreaking back in the day; yeah, so was

> hooking up a horse to a buggy.

> I admit to a shortage of things as of late. Raves used to be an outing of

> choice: 100s or 1000s of ppl in some huge secret location, dancing to

> future.music, taking care of each other, having surreal, induced

> conversations. It's a younger crowd now, concerned mainly with the drugs

> and the clothes, and being 'underground'. there are huge similarities in

> fundamental philosophies of rave and hippie culture, but the approach is

> very different. but now, all of it seems corrupted.

> for those of you wanting to see/feel something new, with similar outlook,

> feeling to it: 'A Little Furthur' memorial day weekend, and 'Even Furthur'

> july 18-21, electric campout festivals, location usually an undisclosed

> campgrounds somewhere in Wisconsin.  this event has been going on for 3 yrs

> now, and gets better every year. and they even use a picture of the

> Pranksters bus on the flyer. i get an indescribeable kick going to these

> things, like the universe just all clicks together for a few days, and

> everyone can be far from beat for a little while.

> Pranksters? I'll stay home and read a book.

> Obviously, i've been meandering here. Apologies, and no offense...

>

> -zach

>

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 18:16:25 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Jerry Cimino <Bigsurs4me@AOL.COM>

Subject:      Chaput is Kaput!

 

Phil,

 

I knew I'd get your attention with my clever little rhyme. :^)

 

Phil, Nicosia has demolished your credibility regarding the Great Estate

Debate just like he said he would.  Any further protest by you will only be

seen as whining and namecalling by the vast majority of the people on this

list.  I'd suggest you spare yourself that embarrassment.

 

 

Now I'd like to suggest we turn our attention to doing something positive

with the situation.  You mentioned before that you want to help with the

archives.  If you are sincere about that offer, I have some suggestions to

make that I'll list at the end of this note.  Everyone agrees it would be a

good thing to maintain the archives.  I'd like to enlist your support in

finding a way to do that.

 

You know, Phil, I believe loyalty among friends is usually a good thing.

 Sometimes, though, loyalty can be misplaced and one friend can wind up

playing the other friend to his detriment.  I've got to wonder if that is

what John Sampas has done to you here. You've taken a lot of slings and

arrows for John and received nothing but humiliation and embarrassment for

your efforts.

 

You say you're your "own man", Phil.  Then examine this situation with a

critical eye without the filter of friendship.  Can you honestly say John

Sampas has served you well here?  You tried defending an extreme position

with a very weak argument out of loyalty to a friend.  Now it is time for you

to drop that role and take some action.

 

There's an old saying and our mother's pounded it into all of us... "Actions

Speak Louder Than Words".  John Sampas has been telling everyone, including

you, he wants to protect the Kerouac Archives.  But what have his actions

said to everyone?

 

If a person wants to protect something they do not sell it off piecemeal to

the highest bidder!  That only insures the collection gets scattered all over

the world and the new owners get to make their own individual choices as to

what will happen to those items.  Not much of a strategy for preservation, do

you think?

 

You can take an active part in solving this situation by telling John Sampas

he needs to negotiate a deal with some University or organization that will

do the work required to protect the Kerouac Archive forever!  If you're

really a fan of Kerouac, and I believe you are, you should use every

opportunity you have to help direct John Sampas to do the right thing.

 

 

I have other ideas too.

 

1).  Use your association with Sampas to determine what it is going to take

for him to actually sell the archives to one organization.  It appears the $1

million that has been offered for the entire archive is not enough for John

Sampas.  He's been sitting on a gold mine valued at $10+M and was not about

to let it go for a cool mil no matter how much noise Gerry Nicosia or Jan

Kerouac made.

 

2).  Call me crazy but I bet there's a way to get the money John Sampas is

looking for to buy this collection.  There have got to be many millionares

around the world who might be willing to contribute in some fashion to get

John Sampas his asking price.  Kerouac influenced a lot of people, some of

whom influenced a lot of other people.  Bob Dylan, Van Morrison, Paul Simon,

The Beatles, The Doors, Johnny Depp and probably may other Hollywood types.

 What is that line about "six degrees of separation"?  I bet some of the

people just mentioned are known personally by some of the people on this

list, or maybe are a friend of a friend.

 

Think about it!  A hundred rich people cobble together $10 million bucks,

there's some big ceremony held at NYPL or someplace, CNN and C-SPAN cover it

live and all these people get their name put on a plaque somewhere and John

Sampas gets a big fat check!  Part of the deal is Paul Blake gets taken care

of in the royalties or some other way, everybody's legal fees gets paid up in

some fashion and everybody is happy!  No more litigation, Kerouac's archives

are protected forever and the Sampas family is wealthy for the rest of their

lives.  I've seen stranger things happen!

 

The point is, Phil, you and maybe some others are in a unique position to

jumpstart some sort of negoiated settlement. From what I can see Gerry

Nicosia is not going to go away and if he wins in Florida Sampas could wind

up with a big mess.

 

How about we all move forward and make something happen instead of calling

each other names?!?

 

Whaddya say?

 

 

Jerry Cimino

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 18:30:20 EDT

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Bill Gargan <WXGBC@CUNYVM.BITNET>

Subject:      Re: the mysterious Corso

In-Reply-To:  Message of Tue, 13 May 1997 13:00:51 +0300 from <ik56385@UTA.FI>

 

I think he means nuns.  It's a joke--little surreal short shot.  In

traditional English literature the penguin is sometimes a symbol for

Christ but I doubt Corso has this in mind.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 19:07:19 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         PAM <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>

Subject:      Re: Chaput is Kaput!

 

What troubles me about these posts is this...why is everyone concerned about

the archives when no one (by the indication of the NYPL) is utilizing what

is in there already?

    Kerouac's personal effects (books, letters etc.) as priceless as they

are still belong to the inheritor. The fact is that Stella was married to

Jack. Though he may have said he wanted to divorce her he never did. That is

out of our hands. From what I can see every effort is being made to put out

there what is publishable. Even if John Sampas had no say about editing

letters, Ann Charters would still have to make them "selected" letters.As

long as the recepients and subjects are still living, that is the law.

     The other thing that troubles me, though I have no qualms with Mr.

Nicosia, is his constant need to bolster his image by revealing his

credentials as a scholar. Why would he expect to be invited to LCK

activites? Dennis McNally was never invited to LCK and he holds a Doctorate!

Neither was Tom Clark! Though neither of their biographies are as "thick" a

book as Nicosia's, they are every bit as informative. They just didn't put

in as much sophmoric textual analysis of Jack's works. To be a scholar is to

be modest. One does not see Harold Bloom asserting his authority nor does

Perry Miller. Not even Ann Charters! To be specific...well forget it...I am

already setting myself up for a line of attack but if Gerry is a true

scholar he will know that I am right. I respect Memory babe for its research

and for Gerry's hard work in putting it together but it by no means is

definitive. It is a "critical" biography but it does not mean that the

criticisms are correct. They are the work of scholarship. Criticisms are

left up to debate. That is the nature of scholarship. That is why there are

about a dozen "definitive" biographies of Hemingway. No one has the last

word on a subject, especially when newer works are constantly being published.

    About John Sampas. I don't know what mental image some of you have of

Mr. Sampas. By appearance he does not look wealthy. He's not residing in a

mansion. He lives in a small, unassuming house. His clothes aren't Giorgio

Armani. He has always been nothing but pleasant to anyone I seen talking

with him. This is just to say that everything isn't always the way it

appears. This is not to say that Gerry  isn't right by his actions but there

is only one voice be spoken out here on this list. We can't speak for Mr.

Sampas. And I assure you that Phil Chaput isn't either. Regards to all and

please, if anyone has written anything of shcolarly importance...please

consider sending it to the Kerouac Quarterly! That's what it is here for.

Again regards, Paul of The Kerouac Quarterly.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 15:55:25 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>

Subject:      How to Help

 

To all Friends of the Kerouac Preservation Movement in America (to

paraphrase Joan Baez):

 

        I've been getting some private queries about how to help.  Some

people have suggested writing letters.  That's a great idea.  If you want

John Sampas to preserve the Kerouac Archive now, let him know your feelings.

He can be reached care of his agent:

 

                        John Sampas

                        c/o Sterling Lord/Literistic

                        65 Bleecker St.

                        New York, NY 10012

 

                        Fax: 212-780-6095

 

        I'd be especially glad if you sent me a copy of whatever you send

Mr. Sampas, as a nice fat sheaf of letters could be useful the next time I'm

in court--to show the breadth of public sentiment for saving the Kerouac

archive.  If you've got an academic credential, by all means use it in your

signature.

        Another good suggestion was that people call their local newspapers

or radio shows.

        Someone asked about sending me money for help with my legal costs.

        PLEASE DON'T SEND ME ANY MONEY!!!  The last thing I need is Anstee

and Chaput claiming I've cooked up this whole affair as a scam to get rich.

        If it gets to the point where my legal case bogs down for lack of

money, we'll do a real fundraiser, and have Kesey and the boys come down

again from Oregon, as they did to help Jan Kerouac.

        ONE LAST IMPORTANT SUGGESTION:

        I've also received queries about how to help PAUL BLAKE, JR.

        In Paul's case, a little cash right now would go a long way toward

getting him and his family back on their feet.  The situation he's in now is

kind of hopeless, since he has to spend his time doing maintenance and

custodial duties on the land where his trailer is parked, and it doesn't

give him much time to look for carpentry work and earn the kind of money he

will need to get his family back into another house.

        Paul lives in the country, because that's where his work is.  In

California, even in the country, housing costs are high, and you need first

and last month's rent, plus security deposit, to move into a rental property.

        LET'S GET PAUL BLAKE, JR. AND FAMILY INTO A HOME AGAIN!

        If everyone on the Beat-List sends him a check for $10, it will be

enough to do the trick.  Is all the joy and reading pleasure Jack Kerouac

gave you worth ten bucks for his beloved nephew, "Lil Luke" in THE DHARMA

BUMS and DESOLATION ANGELS?  It is for me.

        I'm sending him my check today.

        You can write to him at:

                                                Paul E. Blake, Jr.

                                                PO Box 33

                                                Rio Linda, CA 95673

 

        Okay for now.  I look forward to hearing from some of you.

        Best always, Gerry Nicosia

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 19:00:14 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Attila Gyenis <GYENIS@AOL.COM>

Subject:      Re: No Jumping

 

In a message dated 97-05-12 19:31:56 EDT, you write:

 

<< I read Kerouac's BIG SUR.

<sniperooni>

 >I'm now reading Brautigan's CONFEDERATE GENERAL

 >FROM BIG SUR.

 Since there seems to be a Big Sur theme, try Henry Miller's

 _Big Sur and the Oranges of Hieronymus Bosch_ >>

 

Anyother books on the reading list relating to Big Sur?

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 19:00:40 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Attila Gyenis <GYENIS@AOL.COM>

Subject:      Re: ESTATE DETAILS/direct flame sick of phil

 

In a message dated 97-05-13 01:56:58 EDT, you write:

 

<<  i simply lean forward and one of my giant boobs pop out and smothers the

 poor guy, >>

 

Really? (interest, interest)

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 19:01:35 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Attila Gyenis <GYENIS@AOL.COM>

Subject:      Prostate Wars (also know as the Growl from Lowell) (rhymes a

              little, no?)

 

Welcome to the chaaaaampiiiiion fight of the Prostate Wars.

 

And in this corner

 

in the red trunks -- PHILLY THE DILLY

 

"To be fair. Don't write to me for a while I won't be able to answer you. I'm

going to Greece for a few weeks with John Sampas to spend some of Stella's

hard earned money. Philly the Dilly (ha ha)"

 

and in this corner in the blue trunks -- GERRY

 

" I'm through arguing with you about Kerouac scholarship.  It's a

waste of my time.  I want to speak with someone who's MY EQUAL.

        I.e., please tell Mr. Sampas to send in the first-string team now.

        Best, Gerry Nicosia

 

Today's fight is sponsored by the New York Public Library Toilet Tissue

Corp., whose motto is "If you need a roll, we've got the scroll."

 

Winner will get Kerouac's $50,000 raincoat, and we'll throw in a pair of

dirty socks.

 

Jack Kerouac, Allen Ginsberg, Herbert Huncke, Jan Kerouac, Joan Haverty, John

Clellon Holmes, Edith Parker, Mary Carney, Stella Sampas, and Gerard are all

watching from the cheap seats drinking from bottles of cheap tokay that they

snuck in under their coats. (They are not all sitting together, sorry-- these

things happen in heaven as well).

 

Remember, no eye gorging like this [gorge], no hitting below the belt like

this [hit], but as much pissing as you want. I'm your referee, Attila the

Gorilla from Manila.

 

 

Judges, get out your #2 pencils, and people-- place your bets for round 1.

 

Gentlemen, come out swinging....

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 16:04:48 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>

Subject:      How to Help, Part Two

 

Hi, folks!  Realized some of you might not know how to send me copies of

your letters to John Sampas concerning preservation of the Kerouac Archive.

 

        You can email me at GNicosia@earthlink.net

        fax me at 415-924-2270

        or mail hard copy to me at 11 Palm Ave., Corte Madera, CA 94925

 

If any of you get stories printed anywhere, I'd like to see copies of those too.

        Thanks!

        Best, Gerry Nicosia

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 19:08:20 EDT

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Bill Gargan <WXGBC@CUNYVM.BITNET>

Subject:      Re: subscribe me

In-Reply-To:  Message of Tue, 13 May 1997 12:51:36 -0400 from

              <rfiedma@GROVE.UFL.EDU>

 

To subscribe, send mail to listserv@cunyvm.cuny.edu.  Leave the subject

line blank.  In the body of your mail type  subscribe beat-l first name

last name.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 19:46:43 EDT

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Bill Gargan <WXGBC@CUNYVM.BITNET>

Subject:      Re: Chaput is Kaput!

In-Reply-To:  Message of Tue, 13 May 1997 19:07:19 -0400 from

              <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>

 

Just for the record, I've used some of the Kerouac material at NYPL, although t

hat was several years ago.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 20:11:58 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         PAM <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>

Subject:      Re: Chaput is Kaput!

 

At 07:46 PM 5/13/97 EDT, you wrote:

>Just for the record, I've used some of the Kerouac material at NYPL, although t

>hat was several years ago.

>I apologize..I cannot speak for everybody but for what I was told by the

archivists at NYPL. The only evidence I can see is that I haven't read

anything of significance in any scholarly journal apart from mine in the

Commonwealth Undergraduate Review (Volume 1 1995-96)and I only used

published books for my research. I have checked for reasons of my own

several journals available at Harvard and Kerouac rarely appears. There were

none to date that were relatively recent. I will feature two in the next

issue of TKQ.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 20:00:36 EDT

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Bill Gargan <WXGBC@CUNYVM.BITNET>

Subject:      Research in special collections

In-Reply-To:  Message of Tue, 13 May 1997 20:11:58 -0400 from

              <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>

 

I think Ann Charters also wrote something several years ago in the Bulletin of

Research in the Humanities (a/k/a New York Public Library Bulletin).  I think t

hat if more Kerouac material could be located at NYPL, the materials would get

more use.  I suspect the Columbia collections got a lot more use from scholars-

-as least I used them more personallly--because there were several related coll

ections all in one place.  I agree with Gerry that it is more convenient for sc

holars to have most of the materials relating to a writer in a single collectio

n.   Unfortunately, that's seldom the case.  Perhaps with use of computer techn

ology like the world wide web, long distance research will become more feasible

.  Gerry is right again when he says there's no substitute for an original manu

script if you're doing certain kinds of specialized textual research.  Most of

the time, however, a facsimile or photo copy or downloaded text will do just fi

ne.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 20:53:06 -0500

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         jo grant <jgrant@BOOKZEN.COM>

Subject:      Re: Chaput is Kaput!

In-Reply-To:  <1.5.4.32.19970513230719.00689d30@pop.pipeline.com>

 

On 13MAY97 mapaul wrote:

 

>What troubles me about these posts is this...why is everyone concerned about

>the archives when no one (by the indication of the NYPL) is utilizing what

>is in there already?

>

>

>

>    About John Sampas. I don't know what mental image some of you have of

>Mr. Sampas. By appearance he does not look wealthy. He's not residing in a

>mansion. He lives in a small, unassuming house. His clothes aren't Giorgio

>Armani. He has always been nothing but pleasant to anyone I seen talking

>with him. This is just to say that everything isn't always the way it

>appears. This is not to say that Gerry  isn't right by his actions but there

>is only one voice be spoken out here on this list. We can't speak for Mr.

>Sampas. And I assure you that Phil Chaput isn't either. Regards to all and

>please, if anyone has written anything of shcolarly importance...please

>consider sending it to the Kerouac Quarterly! That's what it is here for.

>Again regards, Paul of The Kerouac Quarterly.

 

 

Wouldn't it be wonderful if Mr. Sampas would speak for himself. Why he

hasn't is anyone's guess.

 

Your comment about Nicosia's "constant need to bolster his image by

revealing his

credentials as a scholar" is unfair in my opinion.  I see it not as

bragging, but simply informing people that there is a foundation for what

he is saying. He is a Keroauc scholar. Acknowledged as such. As soon as his

book, "HOME TO WAR: A History of the Vietnam Veterans Movement" is

published he will add the subject of the VVAW to his area of expertise.

Every Vietnam Vet I know, and I know a bunch, are eagerly waiting

publication.

 

As with his "MEMORY BABE: A Critical Biography of Jack Kerouac," I'm

looking forward to what I anticipate will be an incredible learning

experience.

 

Let's get off Nicosia and concentrate on the Kerouac Literary Archives--a

collection that is a world treasure that must be preserved. An informed

public will help turn the tide. Soon the American Library Association will

be involved.

 

It's not going to stop until the collection is safe and secure.

 

j grant

 

 

 

 

 

 

                BE ON THE WATCH

for items stolen from the Keroauc Collection

        O'Leary Library, U Mass, Lowell

http://www.bookzen.com/kerouac.theft.html

 

Academic & Small Press Authors & publishers

                display books free at

           <http://www.bookzen.com>

     302,443  visitors since July 1, 1996

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 22:29:39 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         PAM <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>

Subject:      Re: Chaput is Kaput!

 

i agree!!! Don't think I don't. If that is his intentions then it certainly

doesn't come across that way. Anyone who takes the time to subscribe to this

list certainly is informed enough to know Mr. Nicosia and his credentials.

This is my point. He wants someone to speak that is on the same level as

"HE". Why wouldn't that be Phil Chaput? Is he any less a "scholar" than

anyone else because he hasn't published a book? His passion about this whole

thing is just as legitimate as anybody else's. He knows enough about Kerouac

to write his own book. The point of someone claiming that they are the

world's best anything would rankle anyone's nerves. I won't take up any more

of my time or the recepients of this list. I know my point is valid.The only

way to take issue with anybody who claims they are the best is to dispute

that claim. In this case it is through scholarship. Every one of the Kerouac

biographies has errors in them through no fault of their own. Some things

simply were not available like they are now. That's not Gerry's fault,

McNally's fault, Clark's fault, or Charter's fault. It is on this viability

that makes the claim of being the authority on anything ludicrous. Ellis

Amburn's new biography is supposedly definitive but he in no way claims to

be an authority on the subject. He, like all the rest, is only as informed

as his sources let him. This is not an estate issue. It is a scholar issue.

I said it before and I'll say it again. I RESPECT Gerry Nicosia and his work

immensely but I do not foster the image of him being an authority on the

subject of Kerouac. Though he indeed knows a lot about the subject, he

doesn't know everything. Nor does John Sampas, Stella Kerouac when she was

alive, nor did Gabrielle Kerouac. Only Jack was an authority of himself. The

best we can do is try to understand him and his work without nurturing this

proclaimed interest with egoism. Regards to Kerouac readers tonight, Paul...

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 23:01:02 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         PAM <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>

Subject:      Re: Chaput is Kaput!

 

As a final note, I thought it would be fair to Gerry to say that there are a

variety of things he has written about Kerouac that are informed and

insightful. His foreword to the Grove edition of The Subterraneans is one of

them. His inclusion in the booklet to The Jack Kerouac Collection is

another. His references throughout his bio with literature and American

culture has been helpful to me in the last three years since I read Memory

Babe. I do not mean to create any animosity or enemies with my postings. It

is just a going concern with anybody in the academic community when there is

an apparent image being fostered as an expert. The great Beethoven

biographer, Alexander Wheelock Thayer said towards the end of his life when

he didn't complete his bio (after some 2000 pages) that he still didn't know

enough. History has found that he knew plenty and yet more bios continue to

come out on Beethoven.

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 20:18:09 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Levi Asher <brooklyn@NETCOM.COM>

Subject:      Re: No Jumping

In-Reply-To:  <970513185952_121312510@emout20.mail.aol.com>

 

Attila --

 

Another great Big Sur moment to catch is a movie called

"Celebration at Big Sur", a Woodstock-era concert with

Joan Baez, Crosby Stills Nash (can't remember if Young

was there), lots of good tribal dancing and ocean cliff

views.  Also a fascinating bit of *cinema verite* when

the camera catches Stephen Stills flipping out and almost

getting into a fist fight with a fan who's "bugging out"

and acting like an asshole.  Then Stills  realizes he's starting

to act like an asshole himself, and decides to stop fighting.

Good movie, definitely something people on this list should

catch.

 

------------------------------------------------------

           Levi Asher = brooklyn@netcom.com

 

   Literary Kicks: http://www.charm.net/~brooklyn/

            (the beat literature web site)

 

 Queensboro Ballads: http://www.levity.com/brooklyn/

             (my fantasy folk-rock album)

 

          ###################################

 

          "Tie yourself to a tree with roots"

                    -- Bob Dylan

-----------------------------------------------------

 

On Tue, 13 May 1997, Attila Gyenis wrote:

 

> In a message dated 97-05-12 19:31:56 EDT, you write:

>

> << I read Kerouac's BIG SUR.

> <sniperooni>

>  >I'm now reading Brautigan's CONFEDERATE GENERAL

>  >FROM BIG SUR.

>  Since there seems to be a Big Sur theme, try Henry Miller's

>  _Big Sur and the Oranges of Hieronymus Bosch_ >>

>

> Anyother books on the reading list relating to Big Sur?

>

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 23:56:20 -0400

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Jerry Cimino <Bigsurs4me@AOL.COM>

Subject:      Re: Prostate Wars (also know as the Growl from Lowell) (rhymes a

              little, no?)

 

Enjoyed the Parody, Atilla.

 

"If you need a roll, we've got the scroll".  Clever!

 

 

Jerry Cimino

=========================================================================

Date:         Tue, 13 May 1997 21:52:21 -0700

Reply-To:     "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

Sender:       "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>

From:         Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>

Subject:      Re: Chaput is Kaput!

 

.... It

>is just a going concern with anybody in the academic community when there is

>an apparent image being fostered as an expert....

>

Dear Paul,          May 13, 1997

 

        You missed the whole point.  My point about credentials is this:

people on this list are being asked to accept Phil Chaput's opinions on the

needs of textual scholars as if he were some sort of expert.  To the best of

my knowledge, Phil has no training in this area whatsoever.  I was trained

in it throughout graduate school, and have practiced it for 20 years,

writing not only about the works of Kerouac, but also those of William

Wordsworth, Henry David Thoreau, Allen Ginsberg, Bob Kaufman, William S.

Burroughs, Jack Micheline, Nelson Algren, and many others.  Moreover, I have

worked in dozens of library special collections around the country.

        Anyone with a bit of training knows the rule that you don't use

xeroxes when actual manuscript copy is available.  Mr. Chaput posing as an

expert on text analysis with his new theory of xeroxes is absurd.

        You told me you have gone back to school yourself.  Then surely you

respect the fact that in certain areas expertise and experience count over

someone who is just mouthing off about something he knows nothing about.

Chaput comes on like a freshman humanities student claiming he knows more

about the world than Plato--but he hasn't even read Plato yet, let alone

understood him.

        When I said let me speak to my equal, I mean someone who has trained

in this area for as many years as I have.  I'd like to hear Ann Charters

come on here and try to tell me that "xeroxes are just as good as

originals."  She'd make a laughingstock of herself before the academic



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