=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 19:30:27 -0400
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Dylan memories
In a
message dated 97-05-30 15:04:32 EDT, you write:
<<
11/27/64 - Masonic Memorial Auditorium, SF, CA
Would this be the one?
Mike
>>
Thank you
Mike. That's it.
Pam
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 18:44:49 -0500
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Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: this beat list
Maya
Gorton wrote:
>
> scream of ripping flesh pierces brain
reduces heart to mass of tangles
>
despair
synapses
twist through backyard memory of childhood
puppy-love
tangled
and ending in empty memory
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 18:59:17 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: Desire
Maya
Gorton wrote:
>
Constant
realization
....becoming
unbecome.
Becoming
other---what was i in the first place?
I can
only come to the
conclusion that
'I'
never
existed.
never. what's never?
unbecoming
of become
perpetual
demolition
of it
that
connects
"i"
with
"I"
and IT
is it
ever
and never
dance a
slow waltz
and
eternity
becomes
straightjacketed
in some
fool's
concept
of time.
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 17:17:37 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: Cranial Guitar keeps Kaufman in
tune....
Comments:
cc: WXGBC@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
At
04:41 PM 5/30/97 -0400, you wrote:
>At
10:50 AM 5/30/97 -0700, you wrote:
>>
May 30, 1997
>>Jeffrey
Weinberg writes:
>>"...
argumentative but very talented editor Mr.
>>Nicosia...."
>>
>>Jeffrey,
>> There's a difference between
"argumentative" and "committed" or
>>"willing
to fight for what he believes in."
>> Rush Limbaugh is argumentative.
>> Martin Luther King, Jr. was committed.
>> There are people who don't like either
of them, but let's not mix up
>>meanings.
>>
>> Best, Gerry
>>
>>Don't
disgrace the name of the great Dr. King by comparing yourself to him.
>Nicosia-committed
I agree. Phil
>
Dear
Phil, May 30, 1997
Here we just calm things down, and get
agreements about no slander,
etc.,
and you turn around and call me a "disgrace."
I hope everybody's watching just who
starts the gunfights and who
lights
the fires around here.
Your use of the word
"disgrace" about me is clearly over the bounds
set by
Bill Gargan.
I did not compare myself to Martin
Luther King, Jr., any more than I
was
comparing myself to Rush Limbaugh. I
was using both of them as examples
to make
a semantic distinction between argumentative and committed.
My commitment to helping black people,
by the way, goes a long way
back,
and I have put my time and energy where my mouth is. For years I
worked
with a ghetto church in Chicago, the Lawndale Community Church, in
the
same neighborhood where my dad delivered mail, working with troubled
neighborhood
kids, counseling and tutoring, etc.
Recently I met with Martin Luther
King's daughter, Bernice, to
discuss
the issue of a white family adopting a black child.
JUST WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR BLACK
PEOPLE THAT ENABLES YOU TO JUDGE
ME A
DISGRACE IN THIS REGARD?
(Please answer in a civilized manner,
as per Mr. Gargan's
instructions,
and without namecalling.)
Yours truly, Gerald Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 20:24:08 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Ben <beidelson@USA.NET>
Subject: Re: On the Road 1st edition Facsimile
This is
a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_01BC6D37.6DA9BA80
Content-Type:
text/plain;
charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
quoted-printable
HELP!!
I'm stuck on this list and I'm only ten years old! I can't get =
off! HOW DO I GET UNLISTED?!? (no insult
intended).
Ben
Eidelson
----
From:
Paul Maher <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>
To:
Multiple recipients of list BEAT-L <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Date:
Friday, May 30, 1997 9:56 AM
Subject: On the Road 1st edition Facsimile
There
is a number you can call to order a 1st edition hardcover =
facsimile
of
On the
Road which falls in line with a series of other hardcover such as
Fitzgerald,
Hemingway, Faulkner,Kesey, etc. The number to obtain this is =
in
Groton,
Connecticutt. It is 1-800-367-4534. Ask for the 1st Edition =
Library
and
tell them you would like to buy On the Road. It may be around =
$35.00.
It
isn't
the real thing but is nice to have this novel in a hardcover =
format
nevertheless.
regards, Paul of TKQ....
------=_NextPart_000_01BC6D37.6DA9BA80
Content-Type:
text/html;
charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE
HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML 3.2//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META
content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META
content=3D'"Trident 4.71.0544.0"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY><FONT
face=3DArial size=3D2>
<P><FONT
size=3D+4>HELP!!</FONT> <FONT size=3D+1>I'm stuck on this list =
and I'm
only=20
ten
years old! I can't get off! <FONT size=3D+2>HOW DO I GET =
UNLISTED?!?</FONT>=20
(no
insult intended).</FONT></P>
<P><FONT
size=3D+1>Ben Eidelson</FONT>
<P><FONT
size=3D+1></FONT> </P>
----<BR>
<B>From:
</B>Paul Maher <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM><BR>
<B>To:
</B>Multiple recipients of list BEAT-L =
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU><BR>
<B>Date:
</B>Friday, May 30, 1997 9:56 AM<BR>
<B>Subject:
</B> On the Road 1st edition Facsimile<BR>
<BR>
<HTML><BODY><FONT
size=3D2>There is a number you can call to order a 1st =
edition=20
hardcover
facsimile of<BR>
On the
Road which falls in line with a series of other hardcover such =
as<BR>
Fitzgerald,
Hemingway, Faulkner,Kesey, etc. The number to obtain this is =
in<BR>
Groton,
Connecticutt. It is 1-800-367-4534. Ask for the 1st Edition =
Library<BR>
and
tell them you would like to buy On the Road. It may be around =
$35.00.
It<BR>
isn't
the real thing but is nice to have this novel in a hardcover =
format<BR>
nevertheless.
regards, Paul of TKQ....<BR>
</FONT></FONT>
</BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_01BC6D37.6DA9BA80--
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 19:29:29 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Random Revelation
>
>
just got a packet in the mail from dallas in cambridge with the packets of
"firewalk thru madness" and
"beyond the haldol haze" collections i wrote in 92
and lost.
and this little tidbit i gave dallas with a letter in wintson-salem
or evanston - they run together.
>
>
Random Revelation
> or
>
Revalationary
>
Randomness
>
>
dbr -
>
>
Yahtzee
> a
random
>
game
>
that's
>
not quite random
>
but more
>
than Spades
> I
guess
> at
least
>
when
> my
friend
>
the Manson
>
look alike
> is
dealing the cards
>
and my partner
>
Saint John
>
was writing
>
Revelations
> as
he
>
explained
>
the righteousness
> of
Hitler
> to
me
>
and Gandhi
>
and Jesus
>
lifted him
>
out of his
>
Thorzine haze
>
and let him
>
see the
> Angels
> of
a
>
different color
>
(like the horse
> in
the Wizard of Oz)
> so
that he
>
could go
> to
Germany
>
through a
>
book
>
called
>
Lightning
>
and explain
> it
all
> to
Adolph
>
before they
>
died
>
and then
> he
could
>
explain it
>
all to Adolph
>
Coors
>
and Fred Domino
>
over Caserolle
> at
the Soup Kitchen
> in
downtown
>
Iowa City
>
next to the
>
church
>
where
>
the pastor
> is
a janitor
>
and the
>
admiral
> is
an
>
admissions
>
officer
>
and
>
the piano
>
hasn't been
>
tuned
>
since
> it
got
>
there
> in
1836.
>
>
(remember the cards games with John like yesterday)
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 17:48:44 -0700
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From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Bob Kaufman and Martin Luther King
May 30, 1997
Just thinking about the irony of this:
I am accused by Phil Chaput
of
"disgracing" Dr. Martin Luther King (one of my heroes) just by
mentioning
his
name from my lips.
And it's all in the context of my
having just helped bring honor to
the
GREATEST BLACK POET OF THE BEAT GENERATION: BOB KAUFMAN. (I don't think
Ted or
Amiri would dispute me on that.)
Again, Phil, what have YOU been doing
for black people lately?
With all due respect,
Gerry Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 18:54:33 +0000
Reply-To: annie@rt66.com
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: annie shank <annie@RT66.COM>
Organization:
you can't be serious
Subject: Just for starters: 3
Haight:
69
Junkies
wandering the dawn
wraiths
in Dayglo
vague
in their near-transparency
Shiva
worshippers
naked
as sunlight
chanting
morning mantra in a park tree
Acid
dealer electric shaman
amid
acolytes
prismatic
Amber
street lamps
glowing
witchlights
in the dusk
Musk of
patchouli
City
smell of bus exhaust
Distant
tang of ocean:
Mystic
incense of home
to
those once transformed
and
still dreaming
2/94
annie
annie@rt66.com
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 21:01:43 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
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From: Maya Gorton <Marioka7@AOL.COM>
Subject: i loved
tonight
i'm sad..going to nyc tomorrow to my old friends in brooklyn...i
wonder
why i moved away sometimes, then i remember.
i hate, i mean love, i
mean,
hate the city. i miss having friends,
but then i remember how little
those
people really counted when i was dying.
in New york, if you don't
write
or paint every day, it gets clogged up inside you, you need to get it
out of
your system. That was my first mistake,
and i guess my biggest. How
foolish
i was to think love existed!
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 20:09:58 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
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From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: i loved
Maya
Gorton wrote:
>
...i
wonder why i moved away sometimes, then i remember.
this
one made my day. applies to so much
more than 'moving away'....
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 21:20:23 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Marie Countryman <country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: odd bits o'this and that. thoughts for
the day, or whatever
In-Reply-To: <338EF959.541FA2C7@scsn.net>
yep its
me agin on a saturday night, blonde on blond playing,
free
association among remembered quotations:
from
Moby Dick:
pip and
what he became
"the
intense concentration of self in the middle of such a heartless
immensity,
my god! the sea had jeeringly kept his finite body up, but
drowned
the infinite in his soul. not drowned entriely though, rather,
carried
down alive to wondrous deptshs, where strange shapes of the
unwarped
primal world glided to and from before his passive eyes. he saw
god's
foot upon the treadle of the loom, and spoke it, and therfore his
shipmates
called him mad...[pip] 'i look you look he looks,,,and you and i
you and
he; and we ye and they, are all bats...here's the ship's naval,
this
doubloon here, and they are all on fire to unscrew it, but unscrew yr
navel
and what's the consequence. then again, if it stays here, that is
ugly
too, for when aught's nailed to the mast its a sign that things grow
desperate..
wcw/asphodel,
bk one
i
cannot say
that i have gone to hell
for your love
but
often
found myself there
in your pursuit
i did
not like it
and wanted to be in heaven
hear me out
,,,it is the mind
that must be cured
short of death's
intervention,
and the will becomes again
a garden
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 21:33:59 EST
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Clay Vaughan
<CLV100U@MOZART.FPA.ODU.EDU>
Subject: unsolicited influence
Night
of breaking glass
remembering Elise
"Baby it's up to you," is
what she's
actually saying, "about how many
times
you wanta see me and all that-- but
I want to be independent like I
say."
from SUBTERRANEANS, by
Jack Kerouac
An
emptied bottle
abruptly
tossed
from
hand over head
over
backward lost
in a
high dive off
a third
floor roof
onto a
street
below
More
than symbol
evincing
loss
(did
this really
happen
once?)
what in
the world
suggests
as strange
a scene
as this
than an
unrequited
love
for an awful girl
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 20:34:54 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: odd bits o'this and that. thoughts
for the day, or whatever
Marie
Countryman wrote:
>
>
yep its me agin on a saturday night, blonde on blond playing,
>
free association among remembered quotations:
>
its me
again at my night is Friday though they are all the same to me -
they're
nights. loved your quotes and thought
i'd send back a few.
"He
was insane. And when you look directly
at an insane man all you see
is a
reflection of your own knowledge that he's insane, which is not so
see him
at all. To see him you must see what he
saw and when you are
trying
to see the vision of an insane man, an oblique route is the only
way to
come at it."
--
Robert Pirsig
"One
must harbor chaos within to give birth to a dancing star."
--
Nietzsche
"I
think present-day reason is an analogue of the flat earth of the
medieval
period. If you go too far beyond it
you're presumed to fall
off,
into insanity. And people are very much
afraid of that. I think
this
fear of insanity is comparable to the fear people once had of
falling
off the edge of the world."
--
Robert Pirsig
"Nay,
be a Columbus to whole new continents and worlds within you,
opening
new channels, not of trade, but of thought.
Every man is the
lord of
a realm beside which the earthly empire of the Czar is but a
pretty
state, a hummock left for the ice."
--
Henry David Thoreau
"(A
bluetick hound bays out there in the fog, running scared and lost
because
he can't see. No tracks on the ground but
the one's he's
making,
and he sniffs in every direction with his cold rubber nose and
picks
up no scent but his own fear, fear burning down into him like
steam.) It's gonna burn me just that way, finally
telling all about
this."
-- Ken
Kesey
"If
one listens to the faintest but constant suggestions of his genius,
which
are certainly true, he sees not to what extremes, or even insanity
it may
lead him; and yet that way, as he grows more and more faithful,
his
road lies. The faintest assured objection
which one healthy man
feels
will at length prevail over the arguments and customs of mankind.
No man
ever followed his genius till it misled him.
Though the result
were
bodily weakness, yet perhaps no one can say that the consequences
were to
be regretted, for these were a life in conformity to higher
principles."
--
Henry David Thoreau
"Good
is a verb."
--
Robert Pirsig
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 18:43:37 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: "s.a. griffin"
<perrotta@USC.EDU>
Subject: Re: odd bits o'this and that. thoughts
for the day, or whatever
At
08:34 PM 5/30/97 -0500, you wrote:
>Marie
Countryman wrote:
>>
>>
yep its me agin on a saturday night, blonde on blond playing,
>>
free association among remembered quotations:
>>
>its
me again at my night is Friday though they are all the same to me -
>they're
nights. loved your quotes and thought
i'd send back a few.
>
>"He
was insane. And when you look directly
at an insane man all you see
>is
a reflection of your own knowledge that he's insane, which is not so
>see
him at all. To see him you must see
what he saw and when you are
>trying
to see the vision of an insane man, an oblique route is the only
>way
to come at it."
>--
Robert Pirsig
>
>"One
must harbor chaos within to give birth to a dancing star."
>--
Nietzsche
>
>"I
think present-day reason is an analogue of the flat earth of the
>medieval
period. If you go too far beyond it
you're presumed to fall
>off,
into insanity. And people are very much
afraid of that. I think
>this
fear of insanity is comparable to the fear people once had of
>falling
off the edge of the world."
>--
Robert Pirsig
>
>"Nay,
be a Columbus to whole new continents and worlds within you,
>opening
new channels, not of trade, but of thought.
Every man is the
>lord
of a realm beside which the earthly empire of the Czar is but a
>pretty
state, a hummock left for the ice."
>--
Henry David Thoreau
>
>"(A
bluetick hound bays out there in the fog, running scared and lost
>because
he can't see. No tracks on the ground
but the one's he's
>making,
and he sniffs in every direction with his cold rubber nose and
>picks
up no scent but his own fear, fear burning down into him like
>steam.) It's gonna burn me just that way, finally
telling all about
>this."
>--
Ken Kesey
>
>"If
one listens to the faintest but constant suggestions of his genius,
>which
are certainly true, he sees not to what extremes, or even insanity
>it
may lead him; and yet that way, as he grows more and more faithful,
>his
road lies. The faintest assured
objection which one healthy man
>feels
will at length prevail over the arguments and customs of mankind.
>No
man ever followed his genius till it misled him. Though the result
>were
bodily weakness, yet perhaps no one can say that the consequences
>were
to be regretted, for these were a life in conformity to higher
>principles."
>--
Henry David Thoreau
>
>"Good
is a verb."
>--
Robert Pirsig
>
>
"let
us say yes to our presence in chaos"
john
cage
_______________________________________________________________________
Lorraine
M. Perrotta
email: lperrotta@huntington.edu
Acquisitions
Librarian phone: 818-405-2184
The
Huntington Library
1151
Oxford Road
San
Marino, CA 91108
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 21:12:54 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Subject: meeting W.S.B. to ben
HI,
I am a
11 year old I know William S. B. So I know you are trapped on the
list.
but
some of the stuff is sota neat just do not bring it to school. If
you
want to get
off the
list just e-mail my mom, oKay? I really like him he is cool. You
like
cats?
I do he
does he has a lot of cats. He likes
salt. He has a bunch of
neat
art stuff. He shoots it and stuff. HE is my fab. art person. HE IS
COOL!
but this list may not be cool
so just
e-mail my mom if you want to depart from it.
Lena
PS
E-mail me at
Lena@sunflower.com
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 23:01:01 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Sean Elias <SPElias@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: how annoying some of these whiny
people are!
Just
what was in that suitcase in Pulp Fiction anyway?
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 23:02:18 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Sean Elias <SPElias@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Music...
I bet
we all listen to music almost all the time.
It'd be inneresting if
people
posted their soundtracks with their posts.
(ben neil)
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 23:02:47 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Sean Elias <SPElias@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Dylan memories
In a
message dated 97-05-30 11:28:10 EDT, someone wrote
<<
<< Do you remember when you first heard
Dylan? >>
I
remember too many late nights at the capitol theater in port chester, n.y.
( run
by howard stein? later of the ??? in nyc?)..........
lay lady lay etc.......
not the
first but close enuf
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 23:02:47 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Sean Elias <SPElias@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Music...
In a
message dated 97-05-30 13:57:03 EDT, you write:
<<
How 'bout: read Burroughs and listen Throbbing Gristle? >>
Too
obvious. How about Pynchon/Pierre Henry
Genet/Coil...........too
obvious
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 22:02:22 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Patricia Elliott <pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Subject: Re: Music...
Sean
Elias wrote:
>
> I
bet we all listen to music almost all the time. It'd be inneresting if
>
people posted their soundtracks with their posts. (ben neil)
Patricia
listens to AD Astra by Celtic Visions, ( a local celtic group)
only cd
i own and i figured out the computer would play it. its good.
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 23:12:41 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Jason P. Mast"
<Oddthought@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: a calm request
Well my
account is no longer accepting e-mail because of this inanity. I
decide
to step out to vegas for a weekend and this is the result I would like
to
personally thank the contributers to this, even though everyone else seems
to have
been doing it for me. I think that the principals (mostly Ph.d's
apparently)
should step back and realize that there were some hard lessons
learned
in kindergarten, "even if they did hit first there is room to play
nicely
tomorrow." If that didn't
penetrate your thick skulls at least grade
yourself
at the level you would grade student papers. Cut the crap and
namecalling
make real points and if the horse is dead stop beating it.
personal
replies should have declawed the gerbil :-(
thank
yu
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 21:39:35 +0000
Reply-To: annie@rt66.com
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: annie shank <annie@RT66.COM>
Organization:
you can't be serious
Subject: Re: Dylan memories
Sean
Elias wrote:
>
> In
a message dated 97-05-30 11:28:10 EDT, someone wrote
>
<< << Do you remember when you first heard
> Dylan? >>
I think
it musta been '64; I know it was my jr. year in high school.
"Hey,
hey, Woody Guthrie/I wrote you a song....."
Ah,
yes....
annie
annie@rt66.com
"What
fresh hell is this?" Dorothy
Parker, upon awakening
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 23:29:22 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Bruce Hartman
<bwhartmanjr@INAME.COM>
Subject: Re: Music...
How
about Kurt Vonnegut and light-hearted polka?
Bruce
--------------------------
bwhartmanjr@iname.com
http://www.geocities.com/~tranestation
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 01:17:54 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Phil Chaput <philzi@TIAC.NET>
Subject: Re: CENSORSHIP SUCKS THE BIG ONE
At
05:17 PM 5/30/97 -0700, you wrote:
>At
04:41 PM 5/30/97 -0400, you wrote:
>>At
10:50 AM 5/30/97 -0700, you wrote:
>>>
May 30, 1997
>>>Jeffrey
Weinberg writes:
>>>"...
argumentative but very talented editor Mr.
>>>Nicosia...."
>>>
>>>Jeffrey,
>>> There's a difference between
"argumentative" and "committed" or
>>>"willing
to fight for what he believes in."
>>> Rush Limbaugh is argumentative.
>>> Martin Luther King, Jr. was committed.
>>> There are people who don't like either
of them, but let's not mix up
>>>meanings.
>>>
>>> Best, Gerry
>>>
>>>Don't
disgrace the name of the great Dr. King by comparing yourself to him.
>>Nicosia-committed
I agree. Phil
>>
>
>Dear
Phil, May 30, 1997
>
> Here we just calm things down, and get
agreements about no slander,
>etc.,
and you turn around and call me a "disgrace."
> I hope everybody's watching just who
starts the gunfights and who
>lights
the fires around here.
> Your use of the word
"disgrace" about me is clearly over the bounds
>set
by Bill Gargan.
> I did not compare myself to Martin
Luther King, Jr., any more than I
>was
comparing myself to Rush Limbaugh. I
was using both of them as examples
>to
make a semantic distinction between argumentative and committed.
> My commitment to helping black people,
by the way, goes a long way
>back,
and I have put my time and energy where my mouth is. For years I
>worked
with a ghetto church in Chicago, the Lawndale Community Church, in
>the
same neighborhood where my dad delivered mail, working with troubled
>neighborhood
kids, counseling and tutoring, etc.
> Recently I met with Martin Luther
King's daughter, Bernice, to
>discuss
the issue of a white family adopting a black child.
Boy
Gerry your a legend in your own mind. The fact of the matter is that
it's
bad enough that your constantly tooting your own horn but the fact you
compare
yourself to Martin Luther King in any way shape or form makes me
want to
puke. Now we have Cimino singing your praises to the world because
you
only put your name in three places on Kaufman's book. Well praise be to
God to
Gerry Nicosia he must be the greatest man on earth for that!
> JUST WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR BLACK
PEOPLE THAT ENABLES YOU TO JUDGE
>ME
A DISGRACE IN THIS REGARD?
Do you
read English Mr. Scholar I said you disgraced MARTIN LUTHER KING'S
NAME
because you compared yourself to him by saying you were committed like
him. I
don't think your cause quite compares with his Gerry (not by a long
shot)
and quite frankly it pissed me off because he was my hero too. Wow, we
do have
something in common. Gerry I'm sure your not prejudiced and I never
implied
you were (from what I've heard about you I'd say your absolutely not
prejudice.)
so you don't have to use this post to get on your soapbox and
preach
to us about how wonderful you are. That's just my point I'm sick of
hearing
how great you are. This has nothing to do with what I've done for
black
people but if I had to answer that I'd say the most important thing is
I've
raised three fine boys who haven't got as much as an atom of prejudice
in
their bodies. On a Saturday in my yard the basketball court looks like as
one of
my friends once said "the United Nations". As far as heros another
one of
mine was Lenny Bruce and that's why I say "Fuck censorship" Just
remember
it was YOUR THREATENING TO SUE THE BEAT-L LIST that got this list
censored
in the first place. In the spirit on Non-censorship I ask you- How
long
did your father jerk off in the flower pot to raise a blooming idiot
like
you? You know what Gerry I don't give a fiddler's fuck if I get thrown
off the
list cause listening to you makes me sick anyway. Take those rules
about
censorship print it out, roll it into a ball and SHOVE IT UP YOUR ASS.
A
person can only take so much. UNCENSORED IN LOWELL - Phil Chaput
> (Please answer in a civilized manner,
as per Mr. Gargan's
>instructions,
and without namecalling.)
IS
THAT CIVILIZED ENOUGH?
> Yours truly, Gerald Nicosia
>
>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 22:28:23 -0700
Reply-To: stauffer@pacbell.net
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: James Stauffer
<stauffer@PACBELL.NET>
Subject: SHOOTING STARS
What
music?
Tonight
again it John Lee Hooker doin "Chill Out"
(tho some strange Wagnerian Sturm and
Drang
tape come on whenever I get to posts
regarding
post mortem aftermaths of beaten
novelists)
Wishing
I had some art to shoot.
No art
to spare and I sold the 12 gauge last fall.
What is
Bill shooting his art with?
12
guage? 20? Shooting a nice light
skeet
load in a 20 or ruinous 00Buck in
a
magnum 12 gage? Over and under?
Side by
side?
My
guess is pump. Nothing
beats a
pump shotgun for the malicious
Kerchunk!
that action makes.
But you
don't have to tie off
and it
doesn't leave track marks
Maybe a
sore shoulder
If
Billy the Kid only had some art to shoot.
But
he'd rather shoot artists I supose.
Wonder
if Bill ever hears the ghostly voice of
his
mother telling him not to play with guns.
Sort of
a bad record in target practice.
J
Stauffer
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 22:45:00 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: CENSORSHIP SUCKS THE BIG ONE
May 30, 1997
Phil
Chaput writes:
... the
fact you
>compare
yourself to Martin Luther King in any way shape or form makes me
>want
to puke....
.... In
the spirit on Non-censorship I ask you- How
>long
did your father jerk off in the flower pot to raise a blooming idiot
>like
you?
Phil,
Learn to read. I did not compare myself to Martin Luther
King.
The real disgrace is you pretending to
represent Jack Kerouac in any
shape
or form. Jack, Allen, Bill, and Gregory
fought censorship not for the
right
to slander, libel, demean, and defame other people, but to express the
full
range of their humanity, their sexuality, their joy in life, and their
spiritual
quest for knowledge. Jack went out of
his way to avoid hurting
people,
both physically and with his words.
When people told him they were
hurt by
some of the revelations in his writing, such as Carolyn, it pained
him
deeply.
Your father was one of the finest
gentlemen I ever met.
Yours truly, Gerald Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 00:46:39 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Subject: cancership or just boring bile
One of
the interesting observations for me is the fear and loathing that
beat
literature and beatophiles seem to bring out.
I have to say i have
enjoyed
the poetry posting that have been made but fear that they may
not be
all be actually beat. yet i am not a
great one to know right off
what is
beat.
Phil
seems to think that any curtailing of his emotional tantrums is
somehow
censorship. well here is a little story on me.
when i am
nervous
or have done something stupid i have a tendancy to go on and
compound
the hell. once at a party things got weird and i got to
motormouthing
it. wsb turned to me and with a great smile said shut up.
it was
the perfect thing to say , it restored interest to the party and
no one
in their right mind thought it was censorship. More air quality
control.
So if i
like beat literature and read it all the time is the provincial
poetry i
write somehow beat.
you
judge.
Cowgirl
blues
The
castrating cow from wellman county
A young
calf called Emily Ann
found a
skirt hanging on the fence
next to
the coyote skulls and hawk wings,
she
puts it on over her horns.
It's a magical skirt transforming her into a
cowgirl.
She is
a sweet looking thing,
wide
hips and long lashes,
She
heads east along the river
tromping through elkins prairie
she
eyes the bulls that team along the river.
She
sways her thighs and
with a
bawling voice says
Those
city slicker gals, all they do is
they
open up and just let them at it..
Well I
aint that way.
She
leans, leans on a young wild bull,
she
leads him away with tales of corn.
She
uses the name ann van
She
eyes that bull like a tit,
She
rolls her eyes and r's and says
those
city gals, they just open their legs
and
just let them at it,
I aint
that way,
I let
them because I'm a good cow girl.
Now I
am a wild cow girl,
I let
them, and Then
I cross
my knees and it's over.
I steer
them to me
I ain't
like those city gals.
May 31,
1997
The
candor bird
She had
hair like sunshine and summer.
In
front of the brick and stone house
stood
dried catfish heads,
perched
on each fence post
sentinels
of naked bone.
Her
youth was lean and hungry
striding
across continents.
Her
music the words of poets
in
barns and on blankets.
She
rhymed colors and verbs.
She
flew in and out of the
phoenix
flames, pulling out
long
red embers,
taking
them into her
until
she glowed like a star.
Her
heart turned warm,
No
protection left,
her
tongue melted,
Vomiting
coals, she gave birth
and
lived in the phoenix.
Government
Found
callow
Hazardous
house of rules and regulations
peopled
by those who's star is control.
Callow
soulless Honorlost and mean.
Business
The
world of dimes,
driving wheels of product,
mass
though space.
You
need something on your plate
at the
end.
copyright
pace
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 01:02:45 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: cancership or just boring bile
Patricia
Elliott wrote:
>
>
One of the interesting observations for me is the fear and loathing that
>
beat literature and beatophiles seem to bring out. I have to say i have
>
enjoyed the poetry posting that have been made but fear that they may
>
not be all be actually beat. yet i am
not a great one to know right off
>
what is beat.
>
Phil seems to think that any curtailing of his emotional tantrums is
>
somehow censorship. well here is a little story on me. when i am
>
nervous or have done something stupid i have a tendancy to go on and
>
compound the hell. once at a party things got weird and i got to
>
motormouthing it. wsb turned to me and with a great smile said shut up.
> it
was the perfect thing to say , it restored interest to the party and
> no
one in their right mind thought it was censorship. More air quality
>
control.
> So
if i like beat literature and read it all the time is the provincial
>
poetry i write somehow beat.
>
you judge.
>
>
Cowgirl blues
>
>
The castrating cow from wellman county
>
> A
young calf called Emily Ann
>
found a skirt hanging on the fence
>
next to the coyote skulls and hawk wings,
>
she puts it on over her horns.
> It's a magical skirt transforming her into a
cowgirl.
>
>
She is a sweet looking thing,
>
wide hips and long lashes,
>
She heads east along the river
>
tromping through elkins prairie
>
she eyes the bulls that team along the river.
>
>
She sways her thighs and
>
with a bawling voice says
>
Those city slicker gals, all they do is
>
they open up and just let them at it..
>
Well I aint that way.
>
>
She leans, leans on a young wild bull,
>
she leads him away with tales of corn.
>
She uses the name ann van
>
She eyes that bull like a tit,
>
She rolls her eyes and r's and says
>
>
those city gals, they just open their legs
>
and just let them at it,
> I
aint that way,
> I
let them because I'm a good cow girl.
>
>
Now I am a wild cow girl,
> I
let them, and Then
> I
cross my knees and it's over.
> I
steer them to me
> I
ain't like those city gals.
>
>
May 31, 1997
>
>
The candor bird
>
She had hair like sunshine and summer.
> In
front of the brick and stone house
>
stood dried catfish heads,
>
perched on each fence post
>
sentinels of naked bone.
>
>
Her youth was lean and hungry
>
striding across continents.
>
Her music the words of poets
> in
barns and on blankets.
>
She rhymed colors and verbs.
>
>
She flew in and out of the
>
phoenix flames, pulling out
>
long red embers,
>
taking them into her
>
until she glowed like a star.
>
>
Her heart turned warm,
> No
protection left,
>
her tongue melted,
>
Vomiting coals, she gave birth
>
and lived in the phoenix.
>
>
Government
>
Found callow
>
Hazardous house of rules and regulations
>
peopled by those who's star is control.
>
Callow soulless Honorlost and mean.
>
>
Business
>
The world of dimes,
>
driving wheels of product,
>
mass though space.
>
You need something on your plate
> at
the end.
>
>
copyright pace
that
one woke me up. i swear. i was asleep for an hour or more am
still
too asleep to type well. have to fix
every other letter.
i love
the b.b. story and the "shut up".
i'd
like a nice poster to hang on my wall with a smiling b.b. and the
words
"shut up" in big print.
james -
the thing you were asking about burroughs gun?
it seems that it
would
probably be a b.b. gun. hah
ahahahahahahaah
i'm
going back to leop sleep i hope.
night,
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 03:06:07 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leitha Sackmann
<lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Music...
At
04:05 AM 5/30/97 -0500, Jeff Taylor wrote:
>On
Sat, 24 May 1997, MORE OXY THAN MORON wrote:
>
>>
I agree with mc, the sound of Jack's voice has given me a much greater sense
> of
>>
his rhythm when I read his books. Not all writers have Jack's great
ability
or
>>
wonderful voice for reading but we are lucky to have tapes of Jack. I highly
>>
recomend to all beginning readers of Kerouac to grab a tape of Jack reading
>>
from his own work, nothing like it.
>
>I've
always been sorta puzzled by this. I've had several friends I showed
>some
Burroughs stuff to, and they were completely indifferent to
>it--until
I played a WSB recording to them, when they were suddenly
>ROTFL.
But it seems to me, if it's funny on the recording, it's funny on
>the
page too....can't you hear the words in your head when you read?
>
>One
of the most significant things about Kerouac's writing, IMHO, is its
>rhythm
and tempo, which often is so forceful that you can just hear it
>singing
right from the page. I was actually disappointed the first time I
>heard
the recordings....now, I love to listen to them, but I don't think
>they
really add anything to what's already there on paper and which can
>be
recreated in your own head.
>
>In
fact, having to take a breath sometimes interrupts a rhythm that may be
>distinctive
to writing....esp. long passages written without punctuation
>sometimes
seem like they ought to form one uninterrupted phrase, which it
>is
not possible to talk through in one breath. This perhaps makes a sort
>of
disruption between writing and speaking, but perhaps not between the
>writing
and music--there is such a thing, when playing a horn, as
>circular
breathing, i.e., breathing in thru the nose while blowing out
>thru
the mouth, and by means of which you can hold a note indefinitely.
>But
I never heard of circular talking.
>
>*******
>Jeff
Taylor
>taylorjb@ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu
>*******
Oh Man,
I think there is absoluteley nothing NOTHING better than Jack
reading
"I think of Dean Moriarty, I even think of old Dean Moriarty the
father
we never found. I think of Dean
Moriarty, I think of Dean
Mor-EE-AH-TEE." Jack reads with such an amazing grasp of the
BEAT. He's
got
rhythym all right. Now whenever i read
Jack its just that much more
powerful
because i can hear him talking to me. I
even appreciate it more
after
listening to the new Kerouac CD. Damn,
all these people with great
rhythm: Michael Stype, Patti Smith, Eddie Vedder,
but none of them can
bring
the words alive like Jack can. I dont
know if its because they didnt
write
it or what, but i find it absolutely amazing that none of these great
musicians
have control of the words like Jack does.
I don't
know Jeff, maybe you've just naturally got the rythym (lucky s.o.b),
but for
me at least, Jack really helps me feel the words when he reads aloud.
I do
agree with the idea about the continuity of the mind that speaking
disrupts,
but didn't jack mold his prose around this.
He did say that he
just
blew his sentences until he had to take a breath and then ended them
(or
something to that effect). I wonder if
it would be possible to
"circular
talk."
Breath
in through the nose and keep on talking.
Hmmm...i got a few
relatives
who would love to get their hands on that secret at my expense.
just
some late night thoughts.
matt
*****************************************************************
"Everyone
takes the limits of his own vision
for the limits of the world."
Arthur
Schopenhauer
*****************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 03:06:10 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leitha Sackmann <lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Music...
>Two
summers ago I read _Visions of Cody_ with (mostly) Parker and Billie
>Holliday
on, sipping a beer, and turned off the air conditioning and sat
>outside
of the open door in the heat and humidity of the 2am southern night.
>This
might seem silly at times, but it did seem to create an atmosphere
>that
enhanced the reading....
YES. Jack MUST be read outdoors. or in a car traveling. or a bus.
or a
train. I remember reading _Big Sur_ on a ferry to
alaska at 3 in the
morning
and i was sitting by the railing looking out into the water which
wasn't
there and all i saw was black--pure complete black. nothing
separating
the water from the sky and i really dug all of Jack's comments
about
the void and the immensity of it and i thought with just one jump i
could
dissapear into the blackness forever. I
really spooked myself out
(was
completely alone) and had to grasp the railing tightly as i walked back
to my
tent.
I've
shared some great times with Jack and nature at the same time. It's
weird
because at times i think it's much easier to read inside--you get
distracted
much less and can read more and sometimes it seems easier to lose
yourself
in the novel when you're locked up in your room. But i will always
prefer
reading outside. Sure you'll get
distracted, but eventually the
sights
and sounds of your environment will begin to blend with the sights
and
sounds in the novel and soon you lose all ability to distinguish between
the two
and you create a new novel that is even more powerful and personal
than
the one that you are reading.
matt
*****************************************************************
"Everyone
takes the limits of his own vision
for the limits of the world."
Arthur
Schopenhauer
*****************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 02:23:31 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Natalie Foster
<nfoster@SOUTHWIND.NET>
Subject: Re: Kerouac in the Top 40
Levi
Asher used to have a whole section of musical influences pertaining =
to the
Beats in Literary Kicks. Things like Steely Dan's name from WB =
and
many others. Some really obscure. I'm sure it is still there.
Oh, one
of my favorites is a THEY MIGHT BE GIANTS song that begins with =
"I
saw the best minds of my generation..." and talks about censorship "
=
I
should be allowed to hang my poster" or something.=20
I just
remember that there were literally hundreds of different =
refrences
in Kicks and that I was quite amazed.
----------
From: Diane M.
Homza[SMTP:ek242@cleveland.Freenet.Edu]
Sent: Friday, May 30, 1997 5:16 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list BEAT-L
Subject: Kerouac in the Top 40
Reply
to message from e.lytle@CED.UTAH.EDU of Thu, 29 May
>
>>
>>
andrew, what is 10,000 Maniacs? They do a song entitled Jack Kerouac.
>>
>
> 10,000 Maniacs broke up several years
ago. It's more likely to =
be
>Morphine, the three-man, sax-bass-drums combo,
from the Joy, Kicks
>CD.
There's
the 10,000 Maniacs song, the Morphine song...anyone know of any
other
songs referring to the Beats?
Diane.
--
"This
is Beat. Live your lives out? Naw, _love_ your lives out!"
--Jack
Kerouac
Diane
Marie Homza
ek242@cleveland.freenet.edu
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 03:39:13 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leitha Sackmann
<lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Music...
At
11:29 PM 5/30/97 -0400, Bruce Hartman wrote:
>How
about Kurt Vonnegut and light-hearted polka?
>
>Bruce
hmmm...i
just had an epiphany! My favorite Polka song is so perfectly made
for
Jack kerouac. And all this time ive
never realized this. ha. lyrics:
In heaven there is no beer
That's h-why we drink it here
And when we are gone from here
Our friends will be drinking all the
beer.
it's by
Li'l Wally. I forget what the name of
it is but those are the only
lyrics.
god, i
gotta go to bed
matt
*****************************************************************
"Everyone
takes the limits of his own vision
for the limits of the world."
Arthur
Schopenhauer
*****************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 04:06:05 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leitha Sackmann
<lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Subject: Ginsberg memorial
Okay. no one said that they were at the concert so
im gonna tel you all
about
it.
It was
AMAZING. First of all, many Tibetan
Buddhists came out and chanted a
prayer
and it was very beautiful and then a friend of Allen's read the
Kaddish
and some other stuff.
Then a
girl sang "Amazing Grace"
Then
Anne Waldman read. She's awesome.
Then
the poetry contest winner (coincidentally a friend of Allen's) read.
Then a
good friend of Allen's read "On Fame and Death" and "Gone gone
gone"
(another
poem allen wrote on his deathbed. yuck,
dont like that word)
Then
natalie merchant came out (YAY!!) and
spoke a little about allen. she
said
"well, a few years a go I made the poet's cardinal sin. I used a word
only
because it rymed. The word was
"jaded." The song was
"Hey Jack
Kerouac."
" So she goes on to say that she
eventually met allen and
realized
he was not jaded at all but before she met him he set her a copy of
_Howl_ Inscribed within:
"Jaded? Hardly."
With a
drawing of an "erect penis ejaculating triumphantly" (Natalie's
words)
So she
dedicated the first song to allen. it
was a song she had just
written
a week a go, and mind you, i am a BIG 10,000 Maniacs and Natalie
merchant
fan, but the song was the most beautiful song ive heard come from
this
wonderful woman's lips. Next she played
"These are Days" and then
"Wonder."
Patti
Smith came on next and said many kind words about Allen and actually
turned
the footnote to Howl into a song which was great.
After
the show my brother and i hung outside trying to talk to natalie
merchant. she finally came out and all the people
hounded her for pictures
and
autographs. I was going to ask her to
sign my copy of Howl but then i
thought
that was almost sacreligious and autographs are kinda stupid anyway.
So as
she was leaving i walked up to her and thanked her for clearing up the
whole
jaded business and i told her that it was her song "Hey Jack kerouac"
that
originally turned me on to the Beats (it did), and you could really see
her
eyes light up and she got happy and just started talking about allen and
said
sometimes he would say "Hey, I'm famous.
natalie merchant wrote a song
about
me." I forgot most of the rest of
the stuff she said cause i was so
damn
nervous and i was in such awe standing their talking to Natalie. it
was a
great night.
and
then after the show my brother and i smoked a little wacky tobaccy and
wandered
around Ann Arbor in the rain, splashing in fountains and just
acting
childish. it was such a great night
until we got pulled over by cops
and
they wanted to see my license and our registration which was in the
glovebox
along with some other stuff that they didnt want to see (Damn, i am
so
stupid to put stuff like that in the glovebox). So i leaned over and
quickly
opened the box and kinda his the pipe and the bag with my hand and
dug
under all the maps and stuff and grabbed the registration. Cop asked us
what we
were in Ann Arbor for and i told him we had just gone to the Allen
Ginsberg
tribute and at the time i thought "DOH, i shouldn't have told him
that. Now they'll surely give us
trouble." i could hear him saying
"OH, so
you're
one of those Beat folks. Please step
out of the car." And they
started
giving me trouble about not having shoes on and i thought we were in
for
it. But luckily they let us go with
only a warning. Must've been the
spirit
of Allen protecting us from the evil Moloch.
im babbling. good night.
matt
*****************************************************************
"Everyone
takes the limits of his own vision
for the limits of the world."
Arthur
Schopenhauer
*****************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 03:28:45 -0600
Reply-To: stand666@bitstream.net
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: R&R Houff
<stand666@BITSTREAM.NET>
Subject: Minneapolis and the Beats
Hello
Antoine,
I still
play a lot of slide guitar on a Circa, 1937, Dobro and a '31
National
Steel guitar. If picking, I play a J-51 Gibson Flat-top and
for
strumming open tunings, a Guild 12 string. I'm back playing after
a 17
year absence. Unfortunately, I took a knife wound thru my left
hand
outside of a Southside club in Chicago. After all these dormant
years
(I had no feeling in my hand) from nerve damage, I am now happy
to
report that some feeling has returned=97and I'm back on the stage! No
recordings=97yet,
but I'll keep you posted. In answer to the beat
influence
in the TC area way-back-when, I would have to say yes. As a
kid, I
packed up and ran away with Kenneth Patchen's Love Poems (City
Lights
edition) in my guitar case. In the middle '60's you could still
rent
one-dollar a night hotel rooms downtown. I was fortunate enough
to get
a room across from an old & rare book shop on the corner of 12 th
&
Nicollet. That's where I discovered the beats and from the local
coffeehouse
crowds I picked-up on Ginsberg whom I met in '72 (Madison,
WI)=97but
that's another story. In answer to reading and music gigs com-
bined,
yes, they were still happening but not as much I'm told. Tony
Glover
was real hip to the scene and a helluva good harp player. I can
play
harp=97but that cat would bury me! I dedicated my book After Hours
(poems)
to Leo Kottke and a flask of whiskey found outside the Scholar
on a
cold October night in '68. Now that the book is out of print, I
just
now realized that Leo never got a copy. The readings and music
are
back and it feels pretty good. The Turf Club in St. Paul, has a=20
Cabaret
scene. Hell, I can be playing slide while a lady juggles
machetes=97the
scene is wild and damn near anything goes.=20
Richard
Houff
Pariah
Press
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 06:47:11 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: Re: Words
In-Reply-To: <199705301742.KAA04132@freya.van.hookup.net>
and a
loverly bunch of words that is, james william
great
tour de force
mc
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 06:47:18 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: and the beat(ing) goes
on.(nicosia/chaput)
In-Reply-To:
<199705310017.RAA10975@italy.it.earthlink.net>
just
when i thought it was safe to tell beat-l refugees out there, fingers
virtually
gripping side of virtual life boats.....ready to call all outs in
free,
and again the posts begin
arrrhhhhgggghhhhhhhh!
mc
and all
the SHOUTING in the caps, giving me a
headache.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 06:47:22 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: Re: Ginsberg memorial
In-Reply-To:
<1.5.4.16.19970531040917.1ad77ae6@uoft02.utoledo.edu>
many
many thanks, matt
this
was wonderful to wake up to this morning.
mc
ps
whose leitha?
or,
thanks,
leitha!
who the
hell's matt?
mornng
came earlier than ussual today...
and i'm
outta coffee
(whine)
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 08:21:45 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Maya Gorton <Marioka7@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: this beat list
In a
message dated 97-05-30 23:16:27 EDT, you write:
<<
synapses twist through backyard memory
tangled and ending on empty >>
this is
how i would say it if you care....hope you don't mind the editing,
tell me
if it bothers you
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 08:44:19 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Maya Gorton <Marioka7@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: cancership or just boring bile
In a
message dated 97-05-31 03:08:52 EDT, you write:
<<
One of the interesting observations for me is
the fear and loathing that
beat literature and beatophiles seem to bring
out. I have to say i have
enjoyed the poetry posting that have been
made but fear that they may
not be all be actually beat. yet i am not a great one to know right off
what is beat. >>
Not
that I'm an expert, but as far as i can tell the thing that was most
important
to the beats was experimentation. So if
you experiment and once in
a while
you like what turns up and you keep it, and you believe in their
general
philosophy of art and writing, that is a very beat M.O.
However,
that is only my opinion, and i am not a Believer that there is a
unique
thing called "beat" that only belongs to 4 or 5 people, or however
many
beats there are supposed to be. Those
peoples' styles are very
different
and can also blur together with other poets from earlier and later
times.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 08:41:04 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "R. Bentz Kirby"
<bocelts@SCSN.NET>
Organization:
Law Office of R. Bentz Kirby
Subject: link page
If
anyone is interested, I have my beat link page under construction.
It is
infantile in status, but is up nonetheless. I am trying out some
new
editors, Hot Metal Pro and HomeSite.
But it looks like I may break
down
and reinstall and use Hot Dog. It is
better than I think it is.
Peace,
Beat as
You Want to Beat is the link off the url below.
Peace,
--
Bentz
bocelts@scsn.net
http://www.scsn.net/users/sclaw
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 08:47:41 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Maya Gorton <Marioka7@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Music...
In a
message dated 97-05-31 06:53:42 EDT, you write:
<<
"Everyone takes the limits of his own
vision
for the limits of the world."
Arthur
Schopenhauer
>>
Schopenhauer
believed that women had a natural power of dissimulation and
that's
why men have beards.....to hide their facial features because without
them
they're such bad liars. At least that's
what i got out of his book.
Did i get it wrong?
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 08:56:09 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Maya Gorton <Marioka7@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: CENSORSHIP SUCKS THE BIG ONE
In a
message dated 97-05-31 02:33:11 EDT, you write:
<< I ask you- How
long did your father jerk off in the flower
pot to raise a blooming idiot
like you? You know what Gerry I don't give a
fiddler's fuck if I get thrown
off the list cause listening to you makes me
sick anyway. Take those rules
about censorship print it out, roll it into a
ball and SHOVE IT UP YOUR ASS.
A person can only take so much. UNCENSORED IN
LOWELL - Phil Chaput
>>
Why
don't you too faggots e-mail each other instead of bombarding us innocent
listees
with your petty drivel? Why do you, Phil, live in such a godforsaken
shithole
as Lowell mass.? Why bother with this
list if all you can do is
yell? why not just un-subscribe? Is your life so
dull that you need the
internet
to get your aggressions out? Why don't you just ignore or delete
Gerry's
messages and vice versa if you don't like him?
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 09:05:09 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "R. Bentz Kirby"
<bocelts@SCSN.NET>
Organization:
Law Office of R. Bentz Kirby
Subject: Re: Music...
Maya
Gorton wrote:
> In
a message dated 97-05-31 06:53:42 EDT, you write:
>
>
<<
> "Everyone takes the limits of his own
vision
> for the limits of the world."
>
> Arthur
Schopenhauer
> >>
> Schopenhauer
believed that women had a natural power of dissimulation
>
and
>
that's why men have beards.....to hide their facial features because
>
without
>
them they're such bad liars. At least
that's what i got out of his
>
book.
> Did i get it wrong?
Never read Schopy, but you post Maya has me
ROTFLMAO. But, personally,
I think
men are better liars than you give them credit for here. Well,
I was
lying but can you tell which part is the lie and which is the
truth. So come to think of it, email is as good as
a beard, only
better.
Peace,
:-)
--
Bentz
bocelts@scsn.net
http://www.scsn.net/users/sclaw
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 09:14:56 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Maya Gorton <Marioka7@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Music...
In a
message dated 97-05-31 09:11:39 EDT, you write:
<<
Never read Schopy, but you post Maya has me
ROTFLMAO. But, personally,
I think men are better liars than you give
them credit for here. Well,
I was lying but can you tell which part is
the lie and which is the
truth.
So come to think of it, email is as good as a beard, only
better.
>>
I
know..you''re not REALLY rotflmao! Right?
e-mail is better than a beard
for
sure...i've been told so many unsolicited tall tales already on the
internet. stories of murder and drug money, glamour
and wishful fame.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 08:22:20 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: this beat list
Maya
Gorton wrote:
>
> In
a message dated 97-05-30 23:16:27 EDT, you write:
>
>
<<
> synapses twist through backyard memory
> tangled and ending on empty >>
>
>
this is how i would say it if you care....hope you don't mind the editing,
>
tell me if it bothers you
if it
was me i don't recall what i typed in the first place.
synapses
twisted makes sense but not only twisting going on i wish
medicare
covered for a pet-scan ...:)
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 08:40:16 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and
Why?
May 31, 1997
Maya
Gorton writes:
>Why
don't you too faggots e-mail each other instead of bombarding us innocent
>listees
with your petty drivel?
Dear
Maya,
I have been happily married to my
second wife (a woman) for five years.
I don't care to exchange libelous exchanges
with Mr. Chaput on or
off the
list.
Mr. Gargan and several others,
including myself, have tried very
hard to
get the dialogue on this List back within legal and civilized
parameters,
i.e., to get rid of the libel, slander, defamation, and printing
of
people's private letters, which is also illegal.
Every time we do, Mr. Chaput or one of
his allies, like Mr. Maher,
comes
back with a tirade of verbal abuse and verbal assault against me--the
same
tactics, by the way, that were used to try to shut down Brad Parker and
his
independent Kerouac events in Lowell.
At the same time, Mr. Chaput and a few
others have been quick to
point
their finger at me as the person who is destroying the Beat-List.
The reality is: MR. CHAPUT AND HIS
COHORTS ARE THE PEOPLE WHO ARE
ENDANGERING
THIS LIST.
They are putting me in the untenable
position of 1) either having to
leave
the list myself; or 2) take legal action against Brooklyn College and
the
Beat-List for distributing this libelous material--NEITHER OF WHICH I
WANT TO
DO.
I.e., either I allow the bullies to
win yet another victory (like
the
victory they won when they dragged a 100-pound invalid, Jan Kerouac, out
of the
Jack Kerouac Conference at NYU) or I do possible harm to the Beat
forum
which all of you enjoy so much.
I do not like being put in this
position. And I suggest if you
really
care about the Beat-List--all of you--that you tell Mr. Chaput and
Mr.
Maher now that you want them TO IMMEDIATELY STOP CREATING THIS DANGEROUS
DILEMMA.
You might ask yourself, why are they
doing this?
As you say, if they don't like my
messages, they can simply delete
them. I am not writing anything that is a verbal
assault on their career,
their
personal life, etc., as they are doing to me.
The truth is, I believe, that they
(for certain very definite
political
reasons) cannot stand the idea that Gerald Nicosia is on the Beat
List
and able to speak to 200 Beat fans and scholars in a quiet, reasonable
forum.
So they have determined to get me off
in any way they can--and the
only
way they know how is to act as bullies.
It is the way that has worked
for
them so far. But I am determined it is
not going to work for them this
time.
Thanks for listening.
Best always, Gerry Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 11:58:09 EDT
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Mark Hemenway
<mhemenway@S1.DRC.COM>
Subject: Lowell Kerouac Festival
Lowell
Celebrates Kerouac!, Inc
P.O.
Box 1111, Lowell, MA 01853
10th ANNUAL
FESTIVAL CELEBRATES JACK KEROUAC'S VISION OF LOWELL
FOR
IMMEDIATE RELEASE
PRESS CONTACT:
MAY 27,
1997 Mark
Hemenway:
Day:
508-475-9090 ext 1239
Evening: 508-458-1721
PUBLIC
INQUIRIES:
1-800-443-3332
508-458-1721
(Lowell,
MA) The 10th Annual Lowell Celebrates Kerouac! Festival will take
place
2- 5 October in Lowell, MA. This year's theme will be Kerouac
Celebrates
Lowell. We will celebrate and explore the real and the mythic
Lowell.,
Massachusetts that Kerouac brought to life in his writing.
The
people and places of Lowell are central to Kerouac's work. Five of his
novels
describe his childhood and youth in the city, and images and
references
to his hometown appear in virtually every one of his works. His
descriptions
of Lowell are remarkable for their beauty, power and
timelessness.
Through them, millions of readers have come to know Lowell
as a
universal hometown. Join us as we walk the wrinkly tar sidewalks and
redbrick
alleys that Jack Kerouac wrote about in his novels and poetry.
Full
Press Release Attached
begin
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`
end
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 11:50:49 EST
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: MORE OXY THAN MORON
<breithau@KENYON.EDU>
Subject: Burroughs collection
In case
anyone is interested (for future reference), the special collections
dept at
Ohio State now has the biggest collection of Burroughs material in the
US.
James Grauerholtz, secretary to WSB is in town, dropping off a truckload of
boxes
(Maya, very little to do with anthropology). We had dinner last night
along
with John Giorno, David Ohle and John Geiger who is working on a
biography
of Brion Gysin. WSB is doing fine at the moment, John Giorno is
slated
to be in Louiseville this September (did you get him to come Ron?) and
is a
great performer if you have never seen him. Finally, the Burroughs
collection
should be available for use as soon as it is cataloged and sorted
which
might take 2 or three more months (at least).
Dave B.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 10:52:35 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Subject: Re: Burroughs collection
patricia
wrote,
great
news, i love it being in the midwest. what was for dinner.
MORE
OXY THAN MORON wrote:
>
> In
case anyone is interested (for future reference), the special collections
>
dept at Ohio State now has the biggest collection of Burroughs material in the
>
US. James Grauerholtz, secretary to WSB is in town, dropping off a truckload
of
>
boxes (Maya, very little to do with anthropology). We had dinner last night
>
along with John Giorno, David Ohle and John Geiger who is working on a
>
biography of Brion Gysin. WSB is doing fine at the moment, John Giorno is
>
slated to be in Louiseville this September (did you get him to come Ron?) and
> is
a great performer if you have never seen him. Finally, the Burroughs
>
collection should be available for use as soon as it is cataloged and sorted
>
which might take 2 or three more months (at least).
>
>
Dave B.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 10:58:18 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Subject: Gerald Nicosia
Please
stay on the list, you showed strength, purpose and honor with
your
recent postings. I know it is hard to
pass up the response or the
aside
when you know that much that you love and care about is cheapened
or
slandered but oppinions of substance make this listing worthwhile,
you are
valuable to me.
patricia
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 09:15:47 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: James William Marshall
<iamio@MAIL.NETSHOP.NET>
Subject: Pulp Fiction
Sean,
I actually happen to know, or believe
that I know, what was in the
briefcase
in Pulp Fiction. The topic came up on
another list to which I belong.
A guy
who had a friend who interviewed Tarantino (<--this is why I
"believe"
that I
know") said that he asked Tarantino the same question. First I
should
mention that I love the movie and have seen it more times than I'd
care to
admit. I had noticed that the
combination for the briefcase was
'666'
and that everyone who got to look at it was mesmerized and seemed to
know
what it was: "Is that what I think
it is?". Anyway, it turns out that
the
briefcase holds the soul of the character Ving Rhames plays. Remember
all
those scenes with him having a Band-Aid on the back of his head?
Apparently
it's mentioned in the Bible somewhere that that's where the Devil
takes
your soul from. So you don't have to
feel bad when John Travolta and
Samuel
L. Jackson shoot up those kids in that appartment because they're
only
killing Satan's minions and I think that's justifiable homicide in most
states. Also, remember the theological discussion
Jackson and Travolta have
over
"divine intervention"? Well
Jackson was right.
An interesting side note: In Malaysia they apparently re-edited the
film to
try to create a linear narrative because they thought movie-goers
would
feel ripped off otherwise.
James M.
P.S. Don't know how this is beat. Apologies to everyone who isn't interested.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 12:26:31 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: henry <luckfry@NETWAY1.MDC.NET>
Subject: test only
test
only
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 12:31:59 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: henry <luckfry@NETWAY1.MDC.NET>
Subject: test
test
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 10:39:42 +0000
Reply-To: annie@rt66.com
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: annie shank <annie@RT66.COM>
Organization:
you can't be serious
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and
Why?
Hey, I
just got here. And I was hoping to find
further discourse of the
kind I
enjoyed with Lee Bartlett for an entire semester just past. And
what do
I find?
Usenet
Get a
grip, folks. Can we talk about the
literature for a change? Can
we try
fitting it against other things, and talking about the part that
just
won't fit and insists on slopping over the edges?
I feel
like I've walked in on a stock rehearsal of "Who's Afraid of
Virginia
Woolf".....
annie
annie@rt66.com
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 12:39:59 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "R. Bentz Kirby"
<bocelts@SCSN.NET>
Organization:
Law Office of R. Bentz Kirby
Subject: Re: Gerald Nicosia
Patricia
Elliott wrote:
>
Please stay on the list, you showed strength, purpose and honor with
>
your recent postings. I know it is hard
to pass up the response or
>
the
>
aside when you know that much that you love and care about is
>
cheapened
> or
slandered but oppinions of substance make this listing worthwhile,
>
you are valuable to me.
>
patricia
ditto, here, but I think you can let it
slide. It eventually will get
tiresome
for those who attack you and your work.
To the
list, if you have attacks to make on Gerry, or you want to say
something
to him about what a slime he is, then say it to him, not on
the
list.
To
Gerry:
Let it
slide, I have to shake my head in wonder each time I see someone
make
these bizarre statements about you.
Noone on the list, that I have
seen,
other than about three or so, seems to place any creedence in
these
posts.
To
Phil:
Some of
your posts are very good and I appreciate them. I do not want
you to
leave the list or get kicked off. But
you only harm yourself
every
time you do it, why as Jerry Jeff Walker said want to "Piss in the
wind,
cause then it's blowing on all your friends."
Whatever
effect you desire, it is personal, and if you are right, you
are
losing the opportunity to prove it as you embarrass yourself with
such
undignified comments.
Peace,
and I have begun revisions and revisions of my web site, you all
are
invited.
Peace,
--
Bentz
bocelts@scsn.net
http://www.scsn.net/users/sclaw
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 12:50:43 -0400
Reply-To: "Diane M. Homza"
<ek242@cleveland.Freenet.Edu>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Diane M. Homza"
<ek242@CLEVELAND.FREENET.EDU>
Subject: Be-Bop Do-Wap-Wap
To
everyone who provided me with info on Beat-related songs: thank you so
much! And yes, i did check out Levi's sight; I'm
printing off the 23 pages
of
music-related info right now. I had
this hair-brained idea to put
together
my own private collection of Beat-inspired songs during my lazy
hazy
(yeah, right!) days of summer; looks like I may have enough for my own
box-set. Now that would be a way to pay for grad
school...
If
anyone's interested in my progress, ask & I'll let you know how it goes.
:)
Diane.
--
"This
is Beat. Live your lives out? Naw, _love_ your lives out!"
--Jack
Kerouac
Diane
Marie Homza
ek242@cleveland.freenet.edu
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 13:15:51 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Cosmic Baseball Association
<cosmic@CLARK.NET>
Subject: Re: Current subscribers
Hello
Fred,
Thanks
for the post. Is this a record?
Regards,
Andrew
Lampert
cosmic@clark.net
>As
of this moment (9:36am EDT, May 30) there are 248 subscribers to
>beat-l.
>
>fred
>
>
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 10:51:19 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and
Why?
May
31, 1997
Annie
Shank writes:
>Hey,
I just got here. And I was hoping to
find further discourse of the
>kind
I enjoyed with Lee Bartlett for an entire semester just past...
... Can we talk about the literature for a
change?
Annie,
I couldn't agree with you more. But do you want to belong to a
Beat-List
where a gang of 2 or 3 bullies can force anyone off the list,
whenever
they so choose, just by applying an endless, unchecked stream of
verbal
abuse to that targeted person?
There's been a lot of hoo-ha about
free speech and censorship in Mr.
Chaput's
past few posts. There is nothing in the
U.S. Constitution that
guarantees
one person the right to verbally abuse and/or verbally damage
another
person. To claim that one has the right
to libel and verbally
assault
another person ("Hey, you dirty Jew!" "Hey, you dirty nigger!"
"Hey,
you dirty wop!") is a lot closer to fascism than the democracy I grew
up
learning about.
I want to talk about literature too,
but I also want a Beat-List
where
I'm free to speak sound, rational, level-headed opinions--even if it's
about
the Kerouac Estate--without two or three guys jumping at me with
vicious
verbal attacks on my career, my personal life, my income, and
anything
else they can think of.
Don't you want that too?
Respectfully, Gerald Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 13:33:05 +0000
Reply-To: jhasbro@tezcat.com
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: JWHasbrouck <jhasbro@TEZCAT.COM>
Subject: Re: All things
Gerald
Nicosia wrote:
>>John
Hasbrouck writes:
>> "All things considered, I think
the Beat-L list is far more
>>interesting
now than it has been at any time during the last two years or so
...."
> John,
> You mean I didn't murder the
Beat-List? I'm crushed.
> Yours in failure,
> Gerald Nicosia
Gerry,
On the
contrary - all issues, flames and partisanship aside - you, Mr.
Nicosia,
in your own inimitable and fabulously impudent way, have
resuscitated
and resurrected this list from a deathlike and dronish
blandness
consisting of <Is So-and-So Beat?>, <What Should I Read?> and
<Who's
The Greatest POvErT Of The 20th Century?>-type posts, all of
which
are eminently deletable. Any Devoted Reader Of Books who can't
deal
with the stench of dirty laundry coming from a Classic Legal
Dispute
over a great literary estate is no better than Mr. Sampas trying
to keep
the world from knowing that Kerouac sucked cock and drowned in
booze.
I hope
this rant doesn't kill my chances of being elected LurkMeister.
John
Hasbrouck, BiblioFool
Chicago
P.S.
Y'all read <The Scandal of Ulysses>?
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 14:33:25 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jerry Cimino
<Bigsurs4me@AOL.COM>
Subject: Posey
- Ode to NJ
As
everyone is posting their Posey this week and there's been discussion
about
loving/hating New York I thought I'd drop one on you I wrote in 1990
after
taking a one year temporary assignment to the East. I worked in NY and
lived
in NJ where we had a very pleasant stay. Here is what I saw:
ODE TO NJ
With
your smoke stacked belchers by the river
And
your drivers in cars nasty
And
forever honking tho nowhere near as bad
As them
New Yorkers cross river
With
your tiny towns and full treed spaces
And two
lane roads where little animals
Try to
cross and get nailed
By
furious drivers too lazy to swerve
I watch
you New Jersey
I watch
and I listen and I learn
As only
a dispassionate temporary citizen
Can do
I watch
you New Jersey
As your
inhabitants claw at one another
And
snipe at one another
And
want to screw one another
But
don't because of AIDS
I watch
as pitiful old people
Take
their savings to AC casinos
Only to
come home drunk and stupid
On the
bus
I watch
as those haughty New Yorkers
Try to
impress upon you
How
superior they are to you
And you
believe them
I watch
As
every one of your kids
Has an
angle and has a plan
And
nothing comes to nothing
What is
it with you New Jersey?
Are you
really the doormat
Of the
Tri-State area
Or the
doormat of America instead?
Do you
represent
All
that is good and bad
In the
country? The world?
In
Life?
America
needs you New Jersey
America
needs a place that will take all the shit
And
live in the squalor
And
keep on smiling
Keep on
smiling New Jersey
What
care you that they laugh at you
And
they snort at you
And
look down their noses at you
What
care you that you're always trying
And
always hustling
Only to
be left lying supine
Creamed
on
Like a
teenage princess of the night
Every
whore has her reasons
Jerry
Cimino
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 14:53:50 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Dawn B. Sova"
<DawnDR@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Posey - Ode to NJ
Dear
Jerry:
>From
the great state of New Jersey -- I salute you (having lived here -- can
you be
sure of my meaning and manner of my salute????)
Truly,
the home of Walt Whitman and of Allen Ginsberg (to name only two --
but the
two whose cadence and rhythm you seem to have captured very well in
your
"Ode to NJ") has found a new champion -- why did you omit the
"big hair"
of
which we are also so very proud???
NOW -
SHIFTING GEARS--
Wish
you could join us for the Allen memorial in Paterson on June 8th --- a
coup
after all of the anti-Allen hype that flowed from politicos following
his
death when such a memorial was proposed.
Sometimes right triumphs.
Dawn
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 15:14:42 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "M. Cakebread"
<cake@IONLINE.NET>
Subject: Ginsberg tribute in new Shambhala Sun
There's
a great tribute to AG in the new (July 97) issue
of
Shambhala Sun. Check it out folx. Also, one in the
new
issue of Tricyclic.
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 14:30:58 -0600
Reply-To: stand666@bitstream.net
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: R&R Houff
<stand666@BITSTREAM.NET>
Subject: Delta
Hello
John,
Leo is
a real nice guy and it's good to hear that you're a Bukka
White
fan. I met Bukka in Cleveland, MS, a number of years ago and
could
that man play a slide-pure fire. The guy I'm referring to is
Catfish
McDaris the poet and storyteller. He's got an excellent
read
out from Angelflesh Press, called "Catfish In The Pecos."
Richard
Houff
Pariah
Press
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 15:39:06 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "M. Cakebread"
<cake@IONLINE.NET>
Subject: Ginsberg tribute in new Shambhala Sun
Hmm,
sent this and got a notice I'm not subscribed
(directly
after I downloaded my beat-l mail), so I'll
try
again, in case it is lost in the void.
The new
issue (July 97) of Shambhala Sun has a
great
AG tribute in it (quite lengthy). Check
it out folx.
Also,
the new Tricyclic does as well (very short though).
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 15:20:26 -0600
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: John Mitchell
<mitchell@AUGSBURG.EDU>
Subject: Cranial Guitar
In-Reply-To: <338FEF4B.102C@bitstream.net>
True to
the virus that is my word, I put on my Birkenstocks (pale feet,
unglued
soles at the tips) this Sat. morn and went to the Hungry Mind,
there got
the only copy of Cranial Guitar.
1. Scholarly question: I had not heard of the publication until the
past
few
days on the BList, and the copyright date says 1996. Has the book been
out for
months, or just delayed in release and distribution? If out for
long,
why no previous reference on the BList?
"ENGPOP,
ENGPOP, BOP, PLOLO, PLOLO, BOP, BOP."
Bob
Kauffmann, "Crootey Songo"
Great! Am loooking forward to loving the book (got
Solitudes Crowded with
Loneliness
long ago at City Lights, & have always loved the Frank O'Hara
type
title, Golden Sardine--just great with silver crackers and beer).
Thanks
to all who've helped keep this solitary Beat strumming.
2. Scholarly (M. A.--in English!)
question: Gerry Nicosia (I love you,
man.),
who chose the title for these Selected Poems you edited--you,
Kauffmann,
who? Why, beyond the obvious, etc.?
Then I
went across the hall to The Table of Contents to sip and browse
$1.25
plus
.09 tax
FRESH
ROASTED COFFEE
(A
BOTTOMLESS MUG OF OUR OWN BLEND)
when
what to my wondering eyes these lines:
I
dreamed I went to John Mitchell's poetry party
in my
maidenform brain
Holy!
Cow
3. Scholarly question: Who is this interloper, me? (A joke; my poetry
always
wears bras, but I was shocked to discover it had been outted! I
always
knew I would be a famous Beat someday, but should have known it
would
not be the real me.)
I
unsubscribe tomorrow, so please answer scholarly questions soon. (And no
flames,
unless scholarly marshmellows are provided.)
John M.
Also I
wrote this pome on the sack while sitting at the counter.
It's Up
To You
Whatever
it was I am
I am
happy to be
Even
childhood sores
Butterflies
for several days
Thousands
Just
flapping/black & orange
Wherever
they have gone
I want
to go
And be
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 17:45:49 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leitha Sackmann
<lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Music...
At
08:47 AM 5/31/97 -0400, Maya Gorton wrote:
>In
a message dated 97-05-31 06:53:42 EDT, you write:
>
><<
>
"Everyone takes the limits of his own vision
> for the limits of the world."
>
> Arthur
Schopenhauer
> >>
>Schopenhauer
believed that women had a natural power of dissimulation and
>that's
why men have beards.....to hide their facial features because without
>them
they're such bad liars. At least that's
what i got out of his book.
>
Did i get it wrong?
>
hmmm...I
don't know. that's my mom's signature
file, i dont really know
Schopenhauer
at all.
but
sounds interesting...
matt
*****************************************************************
"Everyone
takes the limits of his own vision
for the limits of the world."
Arthur
Schopenhauer
*****************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 18:09:20 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeanne Vaccaro
<SlugBug747@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Posey - Ode to NJ
Well I
also live in Jersey (my brain's small and my hairs tall). Jersey
really
is the most awful place on earth. I live about 7 minuets from NYC, so
naturally
I spend all my time their, including going to school their. You
forgot
to mention that Springstien wrote about Jersey. The GW Bridge is my
nemesiss.
Later.
love(and
other indoor sports)jeanne.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 17:56:57 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: talk dirty to me
<mutton@JANE.PENN.COM>
Subject: Re: Pulp Fiction
thanks
i was
very interested
that
makes that scene so much cooler
again,
gratzi
jeremy
----------
: From:
James William Marshall <iamio@MAIL.NETSHOP.NET>
: To:
Multiple recipients of list BEAT-L <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
:
Subject: Pulp Fiction
: Date:
Saturday, May 31, 1997 11:15 AM
:
: Sean,
: I actually happen to know, or believe
that I know, what was in the
:
briefcase in Pulp Fiction. The topic
came up on another list to which I
belong.
: A guy
who had a friend who interviewed Tarantino (<--this is why I
"believe"
: that
I know") said that he asked Tarantino the same question. First I
:
should mention that I love the movie and have seen it more times than I'd
: care
to admit. I had noticed that the
combination for the briefcase was
: '666'
and that everyone who got to look at it was mesmerized and seemed
to
: know
what it was: "Is that what I think
it is?". Anyway, it turns out
that
: the
briefcase holds the soul of the character Ving Rhames plays.
Remember
: all
those scenes with him having a Band-Aid on the back of his head?
:
Apparently it's mentioned in the Bible somewhere that that's where the
Devil
: takes
your soul from. So you don't have to
feel bad when John Travolta
and
:
Samuel L. Jackson shoot up those kids in that appartment because they're
: only
killing Satan's minions and I think that's justifiable homicide in
most
:
states. Also, remember the theological
discussion Jackson and Travolta
have
: over
"divine intervention"? Well
Jackson was right.
: An interesting side note: In Malaysia they apparently re-edited the
: film
to try to create a linear narrative because they thought movie-goers
: would
feel ripped off otherwise.
:
James M.
:
P.S. Don't know how this is beat. Apologies to everyone who isn't
interested.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 18:36:11 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Dawn B. Sova"
<DawnDR@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Posey - Ode to NJ
RE: Jeanne Vaccaro's mention of Springsteen also
writing about NJ -- true --
but
Jerry's C.'s cadences don't match his, so despite my deep and desperate
love
for BRUUUUUUUCE (who retains his Rumson mansion, but spends too many
months
in his L.A. mansion -- complete with separate cottage for nanny and
little
Springsteen's), he seemed "unmentionable."
However
-- the fantastic PATERSON - written by Wm. Carlos Wms. - fits in.
But Philip Roth (Jersey Fresh) doesn't), and
so on.
Anyway
- I thought that Jerry C. had the sound.
Dawn
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 18:47:33 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jerry Cimino
<Bigsurs4me@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Posey - Ode to NJ
I
mis-spent my senior year at college listening to Greetings from Asbury Park
and The
Wild The Innocent & The E Street Shuffle.
We danced to Rosalita 'til
dawn
many 'a night! The first date my wife
and I had was to a Bruce concert
in
DC. Discovery of JK came a year later.
JC
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 18:57:20 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Robert H. Sapp"
<rhs4@CRYSTAL.PALACE.NET>
Subject: jeopardy and them crazy beat-niks
Hello,
surprised no one mentioned this but then again not --
a few
nights ago, on the game show jeopardy, one of the questions was:
(something
like) This author of Howl released a CD entitled Ballad of the
Skeletons
in 1996.
answer(response):
Who is
Allen Ginsberg?
Eric
personal
recommendation: don't watch jeopardy stoned.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 16:05:42 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: Cranial Guitar
At
03:20 PM 5/31/97 -0600, you wrote:
>True
to the virus that is my word, I put on my Birkenstocks (pale feet,
>unglued
soles at the tips) this Sat. morn and went to the Hungry Mind,
>there
got the only copy of Cranial Guitar.
>
>1. Scholarly question: I had not heard of the publication until the
past
>few
days on the BList, and the copyright date says 1996. Has the book been
>out
for months, or just delayed in release and distribution? If out for
>long,
why no previous reference on the BList?
>
>"ENGPOP,
ENGPOP, BOP, PLOLO, PLOLO, BOP, BOP."
>
>Bob
Kauffmann, "Crootey Songo"
>
>Great! Am loooking forward to loving the book (got
Solitudes Crowded with
>Loneliness
long ago at City Lights, & have always loved the Frank O'Hara
>type
title, Golden Sardine--just great with silver crackers and beer).
>Thanks
to all who've helped keep this solitary Beat strumming.
>
>2. Scholarly (M. A.--in English!)
question: Gerry Nicosia (I love you,
>man.),
who chose the title for these Selected Poems you edited--you,
>Kauffmann,
who? Why, beyond the obvious, etc.?
>
>Then
I went across the hall to The Table of Contents to sip and browse
>$1.25
>plus
.09 tax
>FRESH
ROASTED COFFEE
>(A
BOTTOMLESS MUG OF OUR OWN BLEND)
>when
what to my wondering eyes these lines:
>
>I
dreamed I went to John Mitchell's poetry party
>in
my maidenform brain
>
>Holy!
Cow
>
>3. Scholarly question: Who is this interloper, me? (A joke; my poetry
>always
wears bras, but I was shocked to discover it had been outted! I
>always
knew I would be a famous Beat someday, but should have known it
>would
not be the real me.)
>
>I
unsubscribe tomorrow, so please answer scholarly questions soon. (And no
>flames,
unless scholarly marshmellows are provided.)
>
>John
M.
Dear
John, May 31, 1997
Eileen Kaufman, Bob's widow, picked
out about six or seven possible
titles
from lines in Bob's poems. Her favorite
was "INTO CRACKLING
BLUENESS,"
which is a Kaufman paraphrase of one of his own favorite poets,
Lorca. But the publisher preferred "CRANIAL
GUITAR," from a poem where Bob
says
"My head is a cranial guitar," etc.
(Forgot which poem.)
Don't know who the John Mitchell was
that Bob refers to--surely one
of the
many North Beach pre-Beatniks of the late 50's, and there were many.
Maybe
I'll ask Eileen next time I see her.
What city do you live in, anyway?
As for no mention of it on the Beat
List, I haven't seen mention of
Ferlinghetti's
latest either--A FAR ROCKAWAY OF THE HEART, which was just
released
from New Directions. I haven't been a
big fan of Lawrence's recent
stuff,
last few years, but this book IS DYNAMITE, THE BEST STUFF HE'S
WRITTEN
IN 30-40 YEARS. There's a four-page
poem to Ezra Pound that is ONE
OF THE
FINEST POEMS OLD LARRY HAS EVER PENNED (IMHO).
A few lines:
"At worst an old man's mumbled
jumble
of erudicities and profundities
by turns noble and incoherent
Scatter of rain on a mansard roof
mixed with antique gossip
ancient Tuscan account books
and yesterday's conversations
A garrulous gabble of
crackerbarrel colloquial
cobbled into the typography of poetry
in canti that couldn't possibly be
sung...."
Here's
my favorite Kaufman poem from CRANIAL GUITAR:
"My body is a torn mattress
Disheveled throbbing place
For the comings and goings
Of loveless transients.
The whole of me
Is an unfurnished room
FIlled with dank breath
Escaping in gasps of nowhere.
Before completely objective mirrors
I have shot myself with my eyes,
But death refused my advances.
I have walked on my walls each night
Through strange landscapes in my head.
I have brushed my teeth with orange
peel,
Iced with cold blood from the dripping
faucets.
My face is covered with maps of dead
nations;
My hair is littered with drying
ragweed.
Bitter raisins drip from my nostrils
While schools of glowing minnows swim
from my mouth.
The nipples of my breast are
sun-browned cockleburrs;
Long-forgotten Indian tribes fight
battles on my chest
Unaware of the sunken ships rotting in
my stomach.
My legs are charred remains of burned
cypress trees;
My feet are covered with moss from
bayous, flowing across my floor.
I can't go out anymore.
I shall sit on my ceiling.
Would you wear my eyes?"
Tell me that's not grrrreeaaattt
poetry!
Best always, Gerry Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 20:14:22 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Diane Carter
<dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and
Why?
Gerald
Nicosia wrote:
>
> I
couldn't agree with you more. But do
you want to belong to a
>
Beat-List where a gang of 2 or 3 bullies can force anyone off the list,
>
whenever they so choose, just by applying an endless, unchecked stream of
>
verbal abuse to that targeted person?
> There's been a lot of hoo-ha about
free speech and censorship in Mr.
>
Chaput's past few posts. There is
nothing in the U.S. Constitution that
>
guarantees one person the right to verbally abuse and/or verbally damage
>
another person. To claim that one has
the right to libel and verbally
>
assault another person ("Hey, you dirty Jew!" "Hey, you dirty nigger!"
>
"Hey, you dirty wop!") is a lot closer to fascism than the democracy
I grew
> up
learning about.
> I want to talk about literature too,
but I also want a Beat-List
>
where I'm free to speak sound, rational, level-headed opinions--even if it's
>
about the Kerouac Estate--without two or three guys jumping at me with
>
vicious verbal attacks on my career, my personal life, my income, and
>
anything else they can think of.
> Don't you want that too?
> Respectfully, Gerald Nicosia
No one
will ever kill the beat list because it will refuse to die in the
same
way beat literature refuses to die.
What you don't seem to realize
is that
no one can "verbally damage" you unless "you" let
them. No
one can
drive anyone off the list. You can only
leave of your own
free
will. I hope you don't. But you have to lighten up a bit. You
should
respect the intelligence of the people on the list. You don't
have to
refute everything that is said. Most
people can recognize
bullshit
when they see it. Let your book and
your scholarship stand on
their
own. How can ignoring someone who calls
you names possibly
damage
your career? In another post, you said
you talked about two
options.
"
They are putting me in the untenable position of 1) either having to
leave
the list myself; or 2) take legal action against Brooklyn College
and
the
Beat-List for distributing this libelous material--NEITHER OF WHICH I
WANT TO
DO."
I've
got to say that when I see the words "take legal action against
Brooklyn
College and the Beat-List," it upsets me.
This is a public
forum
and the people at Brooklyn College have been generous in their time
and
commitment in giving the list a home.
Why don't you erase the anger
from
your own posts and only respond in a rational, level-headed way. If
you
truly want to be respected here, stop engaging in the battle.
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 1997 00:47:38 +0100
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Olly Ruff <or205@HERMES.CAM.AC.UK>
Subject: the sniveler
well,
it's saturday night, it's sunday morning, & I've still got
a beer,
whatever, so here's some bukowski for you good people, at least
for
those of you who haven't heard it already.
"THE
SNIVELER", charles bukowski
"you're
a sniveler, she said
you
snivel when she doesn't call,
I phone
you and you're shit-faced on wine.
I'm a
baby, I said, then too I can't figure out
how
anybody can live without me.
my god,
she said, you really mean that ?
yes, I
said.
oh my
god, you're impossible, you big soft
baby's
ass !
suck me
off and maybe I can forget, help me
forget.
you big
soft baby's ass !
I'm
sensitive, yes, and how can anybody live
without
me ?
she
hung up.
well, I
thought, there's two who can live without me.
there
might be 2000, 2 million, 2 million
billion.
it was
one of the most depressing thoughts I'd had
in
years.
I went
into my bedroom and stretched out and looked at
the
ceiling.
I
thought, well, I can masturbate, I can look at television,
and
then there's suicide.
having
already masturbated twice that day
I had
two options left and
being a
big soft baby's ass I
switched
on the tv."
enjoy life,
Olly R.
_______________________________________________________________________________
"Survival
of the... *fittest* ? Was that the proper word ? Had Darwin ever
considered
the idea of *temporary* unfitness ? Like "temporary insanity."
Could
the Doctor have made room in his theory for a thing like LSD ?"
_______________________________________________________________________________
or205@hermes.cam.ac.uk
skink@imrryr.org
_______________________________________________________________________________
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 16:47:14 -0800
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Richard Miller
<richard@EMF.NET>
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and
Why?
As a
relative newcomer to Beat-L, I have to say how wonderful its been to
discover
a bunch of people who share my passion and interests. At the same
time
its been somewhat like hopping a train where the club car is filled
with
boistrous shouting and at times near fist fights while the rest of us
look on
with varying degress of fascination and horror. Initially I loved
it but
now feel increasingly alarmed by the possibility that a few people
could
derail the entire train. I tend to see the best in people and suspect
that
its not maliciousness so much as overheated emotion and a belief that
"God
is on my side" type of thinking that has gotten us to this dismal
state
of personal attack and name calling. My wish is for the train to stay
on
track without anyone needing to be thrown (or jumping) off board.
Because
I support you, Gerry, in what you're trying to accomplish, I also
want to
support what others have implied or said: bullies have your number
when
they can so easily and predictably get a response by saying "your
mother
wears a mustache." When left alone or not responded to, they are
revealed
to be for what they are. I quite understand that you don't wish to
be
slandered but for all of our sakes, please don't save the village by
destroying
it. Your good name will not be endangered by stepping aside from
taunts
and provocations and in fact will be enhanced. I encourage you to
continue
to resist the temptation to counter attack (grace under fire?) and
to rise
above it and let the flames die down so the real business at hand
can be
addressed. It's not a question (IMHO) of honor but of keeping
presence
of mind and one's eye on the ball. Sorry this first post is so
windy
and I hope it can be taken in the spirit its intended. Richard
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 20:48:33 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jerry Cimino
<Bigsurs4me@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and
Why?
To
Richard and Diane and others who recently responded to this thread:
Ladies
and Gentlemen I agree with much of what you've said. I am on record
on a
number of occassions as saying I wish Gerry Nicosia would tone things
down
sometimes in his responses. I think he
hurts his cause by answering his
attackers
in kind. Although I have been called
Gerry's "Lackey" and been
accused
of "genuflecting at his feet" I have not to my knowledge been
excommunicated
from the cause of wanting to save Jack's archives because I
sometimes
disagree with it's Champion.
I would
like to point something out, however.
It is very easy to sit on the
sidelines
watching a fight and say, "Isn't that terrible? They should stop
that
fighting. Look at those three bullies
ganging up on that one guy. He
should
turn the other cheek and maybe they'll stop."
I have
made my position known in this situation for quite a while. And while
I try
my level best to be even handed I must admit I have lost my cool a few
times
as well. When Jeffrey Weinberg called
me a "liar" because I had the
"audacity"
to innocently mention a $50,000 raincoat Jeffrey came at me with
both
barrels saying I was a "liar" for the simple reason that he's one of
the
few
people on the planet who knows for a fact that the raincoat did NOT cost
exactly
$50,000. I asked Jeffrey how I should
refer to this raincoat... as
"the
raincoat that did NOT cost $50,000?" ... as "the raincoat that cost
something
OTHER than $50,000?". Jeffrey, of
course, did not respond, he
simply
told us all on a later post that I am "destroying the spirit of the
Beat-l"
because I said Rod Anstee was "Off Base" to use the private
correspondance
between himself and Gerry Nicosia to try to win a point in an
argument. This, of course, being the action that
caused Gerry to call on
Bill
Gargan to force Anstee to stop quoting private correspondance which may
in fact
even be illegal.
The
point I'm trying to make here is I have been defamed in a minor way and
it
pissed me off enormously! Gerry Nicosia
has literally been ASSAULTED by
many
many people, one of them even under a phantom screen-name! How do you
expect
him to react? How would YOU react if
somebody shouted at you time and
again
with remarks like, "How long did your father jerk off in the flower pot
to
raise a blooming idiot like you? You
know what Gerry I don't give a
fiddler's
fuck if I get thrown off this list cause listening to you makes me
sick
anyway. Take those rules about
censorship print it out, roll it into a
ball
and SHOVE IT UP YOU ASS." This treasure trove of scintilating "free
speech"
was of course compliments of our very own Phil Chaput who counts
among
his heroes the Reverend Martin Luther King!
I've
said it before and I'll say it again:
IF YOU PEOPLE WANT TO BRING PEACE
TO THIS
LIST YOU SHOULD BE CARPET BOMBING PHIL CHAPUT FOR SAYING THESE
THINGS! He's the one who is raising his voice time
and time again along with
Paul
Maher and also Rod Anstee.
Has
anyone else noticed how one or two of these guys takes a break for a
while
but one of them is constantly there with their sickening drone of how
Gerry
Nicosia is a monster? We haven't heard
from Maher and Anstee for a few
days
but they'll be back. And before that it
was Anstee who was keeping the
decible
level high while Phil took a break.
Who's
on Nicosia's side? He's standing there
alone taking a hammering and
people
post to HIM that HE should turn the other cheek! That's nonsense!
You walk in his shoes for a while and see how
long you'd keep silent. Every
time
one of these people shoots these flames toward Gerry substitute YOUR
NAME
where his is and see how long you could stand it. You're living in a
dream
world if you expect Gerry to stay silent on this. He's not going to do
it! I wouldn't!
And I bet you wouldn't either!
The way
to bring PEACE to this list is to silence the attackers. Try doing
that
for a while and see what the results are.
Peace!
Jerry Cimino
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 21:08:44 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Howard Park <Hpark4@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: All Things
No,
Gerry did not kill the beat list. Nor
did Rod or Phil.
But
there were times that the prospect of "distroying the village in order to
save
it" seemed possible (A phrase that some Vietnam-era General or somebody
used to
explain the distruction of a real village, know who Gerry?). There
is a
time to let fly, even to threaten peacefully.
I never
said much during our most notable (and I suspect most enduring) flame
war,
because I had no first hand knowledge to contribute. Now that things
have
settled just a bit, my opinion is that in the best of all possible
worlds
I support the vision of Gerry Nicosea.
All of Jack's papers in one
accessable
place to promote Kerouac scholarship and study throughout the
ages. I think that is Gerry's vision. If not, I humbly apologize for
misstating
your vision. A place where the best of
the Kerouac sprit endures
without
whitewashing or censoring ANYTHING. A
place where the Kerouac papers
are
preserved and REAL to people, including non-scholars" long after all but
tight
assed people like George Will have forgotten Norman Podheritz, Irving
Kristol
and that little weasel Truman Capote.
Some people think that Mr.
Nicosea's
vision is different from the way I have characterized it. They
have
not convinced me of anything other than the fact that well-meaning
people
often don't get along. Of course, we
have never heard from Mr. Sampas
directly.
If that
vision remains a mirage I'm not going to lose a whole lot of sleep
over
it. Ya just got to pick your fights
carefully, and this ain't my fight.
So flame away...just don't burn the other
things that some of us
non-combatants
value about our little online community.
Those values include
civility
and mutual respect. I also reject the
notion that "if you are not
part of
the solution, you are part of the problem." That might be true of a
time of
war or revolution, but not about a civil suit concerning the Kerouac
estate
which IS important but hardly a matter of life or death, or even about
basic
principles. At its core, Mr. Nicosea's
dispute with Mr. Sampas is a
legal
matter, to be decided by a judge or jury.
Let justice prevail, an
occasional
outcome of our legal system. Nobody has
convinced me that there
is
ANYTHING that I can do to affect the outcome of that dispute in ANY way.
Howard
Park
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 20:10:41 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and
Why?
Diane
Carter wrote:
>
I've got to say that when I see the words "take legal action against
>
Brooklyn College and the Beat-List," it upsets me.
i found
this quoted line 'odd' myself. also
'odd' that some seem to
read
past lines like this and only see 'fault' (for lack of a better
word at
the moment) in the camp of CA&M. it
would be a 'shame' if such
words
as the quoted line were to become more than empty threats. it is
a
'shame' in my opinion that the individuals providing the service for
this
list and its administration even need to consider such a
possibility. i've been known to heat-up myself now and
then. sometimes
i
forget to count to 500 or to wait 24 hours or whatever rule-of-thumb
one
chooses to use. but this is bordering
on senseless.
in
another direction, i don't think that jerry c. comprehends what is
being
suggested when he likens it to 'turning the other cheek'. i think
it is
much more 'picking your punches'. gerry
n. seems to counter-punch
at the
stupidest comments with full rhetorical flare.
it is difficult
for me
to distinguish which comments he finds credible and which he
senses
are made of straw when the power of the replies is the same
regardless
of the content of the previous posts.
i mean
to defame or libel no one with this message.
or slander for that
matter. 'shame' that such caveats seem necessary.
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 18:14:26 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and Why?
May 31, 1997
Diane
Carter writes:
. Why don't you erase the anger
>from
your own posts and only respond in a rational, level-headed way. If
>you
truly want to be respected here, stop engaging in the battle.
>
Diane, I have erased my anger. But that doesn't mean I want or should be
subjected
to a stream of abuse every time I turn on my computer.
Imagine, can you, how you would feel
if every day when you went to
log
onto the Beat List, people were accusing you of various actual crimes
you
didn't commit, insulting you and your family, telling you you dare not
mention
the name of a famous man without "disgracing" him from your polluted
lips,
etc.
This cannot be allowed to go on, if
this list is not to become the
property
of a few arrogant individuals who feel they can intimidate and
drive
off any discussion they do not like--drive if off, not with cogent,
intelligent
argument, but drive it off with the most vicious and disgusting
tactics.
I am pursuing the gentlest means
possible to end this kind of
coercion--for
that is what it is--but I will not give up until it is indeed
ended.
And yes, by the way, slander does
hurt. It hurt Jan's cause a good
deal
while she lived, and it is hurting my efforts to carry on her cause:
which
is the saving of Jack Kerouac's archive for posterity.
Yours truly, Gerald Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 21:12:48 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "R. Bentz Kirby"
<bocelts@SCSN.NET>
Organization:
Law Office of R. Bentz Kirby
Subject: Re: Music...
Maya
Gorton wrote:
> In
a message dated 97-05-31 09:11:39 EDT, you write:
>
>
<<
> Never read Schopy, but you post Maya has me
ROTFLMAO. But,
>
personally,
> I think men are better liars than you give
them credit for here.
>
Well,
> I was lying but can you tell which part is
the lie and which is the
> truth.
So come to think of it, email is as good as a beard, only
> better.
> >>
> I
know..you''re not REALLY rotflmao! Right?
e-mail is better than a
>
beard
>
for sure...i've been told so many unsolicited tall tales already on
>
the
>
internet. stories of murder and drug
money, glamour and wishful fame.
No, but I was lol and FELT like rolling on
the floor. :-)
--
Bentz
bocelts@scsn.net
http://www.scsn.net/users/sclaw
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 21:14:31 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "R. Bentz Kirby"
<bocelts@SCSN.NET>
Organization:
Law Office of R. Bentz Kirby
Subject: Re: All things
Comments:
To: jhasbro@tezcat.com
JWHasbrouck
wrote:
>
Gerald Nicosia wrote:
>
>
>>John Hasbrouck writes:
>
>> "All things
considered, I think the Beat-L list is far more
>
>>interesting now than it has been at any time during the last two
>
years or so
>
...."
>
>
> John,
>
> You mean I didn't murder the
Beat-List? I'm crushed.
>
> Yours in failure,
>
> Gerald Nicosia
>
>
Gerry,
> On
the contrary - all issues, flames and partisanship aside - you, Mr.
>
>
Nicosia, in your own inimitable and fabulously impudent way, have
> resuscitated
and resurrected this list from a deathlike and dronish
>
blandness consisting of <Is So-and-So Beat?>, <What Should I Read?>
>
and
>
<Who's The Greatest POvErT Of The 20th Century?>-type posts, all of
>
which are eminently deletable. Any Devoted Reader Of Books who can't
>
deal with the stench of dirty laundry coming from a Classic Legal
>
Dispute over a great literary estate is no better than Mr. Sampas
>
trying
> to
keep the world from knowing that Kerouac sucked cock and drowned in
>
>
booze.
>
> I
hope this rant doesn't kill my chances of being elected LurkMeister.
>
>
John Hasbrouck, BiblioFool
>
Chicago
>
>
P.S. Y'all read <The Scandal of Ulysses>?
NOT in mho.
I still believe it is part of the first post, so you
really
haven't delurked yet, have you.
Peace,
--
Bentz
bocelts@scsn.net
http://www.scsn.net/users/sclaw
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 21:31:14 -0000
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: west <anwest@UP.NET>
Subject: Re: Bob Kaufman and Martin Luther King
>GREATEST
BLACK POET OF THE BEAT GENERATION: BOB KAUFMAN
Bob
Kaufman was black? I am out of the loop, course I also wasn't born
until
1980 so to me the beats are only words in books there isn't any
flesh
blood or memories. Damn.
west
I
belong to the blank generation
and I
can take or leave it each time
-Richard
Hell
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 21:39:27 -0000
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: west <anwest@UP.NET>
Subject: Re: Music...
>I
bet we all listen to music almost all the time. It'd be inneresting if
>people
posted their soundtracks with their posts.
(ben neil)
I just
purchased Horses by Patti Smith (IMHO very beat)
west
I
belong to the blank generation
and I
can take or leave it each time
-Richard
Hell
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 21:33:22 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "R. Bentz Kirby"
<bocelts@SCSN.NET>
Organization:
Law Office of R. Bentz Kirby
Subject: Re: Posey - Ode to NJ
Jerry
Cimino wrote:
> I
mis-spent my senior year at college listening to Greetings from
>
Asbury Park
>
and The Wild The Innocent & The E Street Shuffle. We danced to
>
Rosalita 'til
>
dawn many 'a night! The first date my
wife and I had was to a Bruce
>
concert
> in
DC. Discovery of JK came a year later.
>
> JC
Jerry:
I saw
the born to run tour in a small auditorium here in Columbia, great
show. Years later on the Born in the USA tour, my
wife, who was
pregnant
8 months worth and I went. Richard
jumped around the whole
show.
Before
he could talk we were pulling him around the neighborhood in a
wagon. He was right at a year old. He was doing this sing song thing
all the
time and it was driving us batty. One
of neighbors mentioned as
we
walked by that we had a little "Bruce" in our wagon. We looked at
each
other and realized that he was singing the chorus to Born in the
USA. It was heard every damn moringing on the way to day care for 4
years. In utero no less.
Peace,
--
Bentz
bocelts@scsn.net
http://www.scsn.net/users/sclaw
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 21:52:02 -0000
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: west <anwest@UP.NET>
Subject: Re: Who is Killing the Beat-List and
Why?
>alarmed
by the possibility that a few people
>could
derail the entire train
people
can only derail beat-l if the rest of us let them, but i really
don't
see that happening.
west
I
belong to the blank generation
and I
can take or leave it each time
-Richard
Hell
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 22:02:35 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: "R. Bentz Kirby"
<bocelts@SCSN.NET>
Organization:
Law Office of R. Bentz Kirby
Subject: In response
While I
agree that Gerry should not come back to these sick attacks, I
also
agree that we on the list should help put a stop to them. I am
still
awaiting Mr. Anstee's proof the Gerry illegally sold Columbia
University
papers to UMASS at Lowell. We also know
that Gerry has not
been
invited to the service for Jan, that is a travesty. We also must
ask why
it is so important for a seemingly unending attacks go on
against
Gerry and when Jerry, Jo Grant or myself defend him, we are then
attacked,
and for me it has been privately too.
I dealt
with the last round off the list.
But I
believe that it is important that Phil, Rod, or anyone else
understand
that they should not, and will not be allowed to personally
attack
people on the list. From what I see, we
have already lost one
very
valuable member because of these attacks.
We must stand up as a
group
and let them know that such behavior is uncivilized, not beat and
not
allowed.
I have
not seen Gerry go out on his own after anyone, and if I do, I
will be
one of the first to lay into him for that.
On the other hand, I
have
requested that he allow the list to deal with this, and not take it
on.
But
where do you stand, is it ok for someone to say things like Phil
said in
his post? I will not repeat them here.
Is it
ok for Rod to accuse Gerry of selling Columbia Univesity papers to
UMASS
Lowell when he has no proof of such?
What is
ok, if you do not stand up, you will let the list "die". I am
not
saying to flame anyone, or to take Gerry's side. Just a firm
private
note, or one to the list telling the posters of such trash to
stop. That is all. Take a stand and keep Gerry, heh, maybe we can get
that
other poet back then. Maybe we could
get poets on the list as a
cool
place to hang. Would Ferlinghetti, Snyder, McClure, or other poets
come on
this list and watch Gerry get attacked like this and want to
stay
on? We have an opportunity, I have a
vision.
NO,
I HAVE A VISION!!!!!!!!
I see
men and women like Ferlinghetti, Snyder, Kerouac, Ginsberg, Jan
Kerouac,
Michael McClure, Corson, Patchen, Natalie Merchent, Joni
Mitchell
can all sit at their list and communicate on the beat list with
us
all. Maybe who knows might come. But who will come to a space
filled
with personal attacks of the like we have seen lately, no one.
Take a
stand, if we build it, they will come.
Peace,
--
Bentz
bocelts@scsn.net
http://www.scsn.net/users/sclaw
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 23:56:51 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeffrey Weinberg
<Waterrow@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Burroughs collection
Dave:
I
thought Arizona State University (Tempe) had the officialWSB collection -
What's
up? Did James give any details?....
JW