=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 23:55:07 -0600
Reply-To: stand666@bitstream.net
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: R&R Houff <stand666@BITSTREAM.NET>
Subject: Summer of love
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
CALIFORNIA
DREAMING
(summer
of love, 30th anniversary poem: 1967-'97)
Mangled
names roll
over
& over
trivial
mind-
scapes
The
initiates
of
water & sun
learning
to forget
how too
forget
because
nothing
is just
that
anyway
Richard
Houff
Pariah
Press
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 00:57:31 -0400
Reply-To: Leitha Sackmann
<lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leitha Sackmann
<lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
MIME-version:
1.0
Content-type:
text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-transfer-encoding:
quoted-printable
Hello
all. I thought, what the hell, the list
is getting slow so i thought
i'd
post the paper that i wrote for my ind. study on the beats. Would love
to hear
comments/criticizms from you all. i
think this paper will never
really
be finished, so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
a
bunch!
Derek,
it's great to see you back!
Howard,
I got the Cd, but i lost your address, please email me so i can send
you my
comments. =20
as
ever,
matt =20
Finding America=92s Beat
A Personal
Essay=20
by Matthew S. Sackmann
=20
When I started this paper, it was
intended to be an objective piece
discussing
the Beats and their respective relations with America. Little
did I
know that this was an impossible task.
To write an objective piece on
America
and on the Beats is to lose the true spirit of both of these ideas.
At
first, I wanted to keep my own memories of America out of this; I wanted
to keep
the =93I=94 out of this, as any serious writer does, but I could not=
do
that to
America nor to myself because, for me, America is a mix of my
memories
and every other American=92s memories.
If these are separated, you
are
taking the very essence of America out of the paper. So what began as
an
objective, impersonal paper has become a personal poem for this country.
It=92s
become a Call to Arms for Americans to stand up and acknowledge the
corruption
that America has undergone at the hands of the evil, mechanistic,
materialistic
Moloch America. Once again a time has
come for Americans to
fight
for freedom, but now the enemy is within.
So what follows may be
regarded
as a song:=20
A song of America
A
song by America
A song for America.
=93I
wonder what the poor people are doing.=94
The
sound of my father=92s voice would echo from the cabin of the Winnebago
during
those wonderful childhood voyages across this great nation. To me,
that
was the most beautiful statement I=92ve ever heard. When I heard that=
I
knew
everything was going to be okay. That
statement brings tears to my
eyes
now. At twenty years old the time for
family vacations is long over,
but my
time on the road is really just beginning.
I was raised in a poor
family
that had to scrimp just to save enough money to hit the road for a
couple
of weeks every year. We had no luxuries
on vacations either. Never
once
did we take an airplane anywhere, we always slept in the camper or in
the VW
bus, it was very rare for my parents to buy us gift-shop presents,
and we
never ate out, always eating homemade sandwiches, but in my mind, in
our
minds, we were the richest people in America.
Not once did I feel like
a tourist
in America; wherever I went, I was a native. =20
I was brought up on the road. Well, not really, but all of my childhood
memories
seem to revolve around family vacations.
Everyone else=92s=
memories
revolve
around their homes, but not mine. At
last count I=92ve been to
forty-seven
of our wonderful fifty states. I=92ve
really seen this
country=97the
good and the bad. My relationship with
America is a love/hate
relationship. I just wish I had really appreciated the
vacations more.
There
was so much to learn. America had so
much to tell me. But now my
ears
are open and I=92m ready to listen to her song. I really think the=
road
is in
my soul=97I get antsy when I stay in one place too long. That=92s my=
big
problem
with college. It was so easy to take
weeks off in elementary school
to go
find America; sometimes really nice teachers, really good teachers,
wouldn=92t
even have me make up work, instead they=92d have me write about=
my
experiences
on the road. But now--yuck--most
teachers in college are
unwilling
to bend the rules, and so I=92m left with a feeling of=
imprisonment.
That=92s
where my boy Jack comes in the picture.
Without Jack Kerouac I=
would
have
dropped out of college a long time ago. =20
You might say=97=93What? Jack Kerouac kept you in college? I thought them
Beat
people make all kids want to drop out.=94
Nope, not me. When I=92m=
not
physically
on the road my soul can always escape with Jack and Neal.
=93America, I=92ve given you all and
now I=92m nothing=94 (Howl 32). This=
is
exactly
how I feel sometimes, but it isn=92t really =93nothing,=94 my self=
becomes
nothing
because I become America. There=92s
something about many places in
America
that make you lose yourself. Down here
in New Orleans, the humidity
blends
into your skin and you can no longer feel a separation between
yourself
and your environment. You just blend
into the air. And places
like
the Grand Canyon, Mesa Verde, Yellowstone, and others=97places where
nature
is so sublime and magnificent that you lose all feeling of your small
body
and you become the landscape. One must
put everything they have into
America. The result is that outsiders may think you
are nothing, but
really=97=93It
occurs to me that I am America.=94
There is a strange duality in America
between the native and the
frontiersman=97we
need both. A native who is always home
and a frontiersman
who is
always looking for a new home. We must
reconcile these two aspects
of
America. This is what the beats
did=97this is what I do. We must have=
the
frontier
spirit and search for America, but at the same time we must also
realize
that the real America is found in the searching. The Great Spirit
of the
Native Americans seems to be nothing more than America herself, and
Gary
Snyder and I believe that we are all Native Americans, we just need to
open up
to the native within us all.
I remember driving through Idaho,
following a river weaving through the
American
hills on little Highway 12. It was the
same trail that Lewis and
Clark
took when they first discovered America and there I was rediscovering
America.
An America that has forsaken its
national bird=97its national symbol.
The
American
Eagle, so rare a sight, but if you ever see it your faith in
America
will be restored. The American Eagle
that must =93really spread its
wings
and straighten up and fly right=94 (Coney Island 49). The eagle now
only
found in Alaska or=20
maybe, if you=92re lucky, on the sides of
semis racing across the country.
The
first time I ever saw an uncaged Bald Eagle, I knew that I =93must be
entering
the real America, all that=92s left of the original America=94 (My
Life). My journal contains numerous references to
the American Eagle: =93An=
d
the
Eagle is so gorgeous and wonderful when it flies & peaceful when it
soars
& strong and mighty looking when it=92s perched & it=92s no wonder=
that
it=92s
our national bird. If only more people
could see and remember this.=
=94
An America whose duality is further
emphasized by its national river=97the
Mighty
Muddy Mississippi. East versus
West. The West symbolizing
everything
beautiful in America. The constant race
against the sun in an
attempt
to find a world uncorrupted by wealth and free from time unlike the
East.
An America whose beautiful history is
destroyed by classrooms and boring
teachers. America, in all her glory, is our only real
classroom; when will
we get
that through our thick skulls. An
America who loves field trips
across
her body. So many kids skipping classes
because they really want to
learn=97really
want to see=97really want to hear. She
has so much potential
still=97even
with so much of her stripped away and bionic, the potential is
still
there.
America, there is still good in you, I
can feel it, Moloch hasn=92t driven=
it
from
you fully. America, you have become
Darth Vader. You are more machine
now
than human. It is time to throw Moloch
down the shaft and take your
place
as our mother once again.
An America that nourished, and
poisoned my idols. America, you are my=
idol.
Jack=92s dead. Is it true what Corso says, did you force
him to drink,
America?
(Corso 132). You tore him apart,
America, you and your
schizophrenia,
appearing beautiful one day and ugly the next.
Jack could
not
keep up with your facades, but that didn=92t keep him from loving you.
Neal=92s dead. The =93wild yea-saying ouburst of American
joy,=94 who was=
just
driven
too fast in ecstasy by America and ran out of gas (On The Road 10).
Now Allen. I thought he hated you most, America, I was wrong=97He loved=
you
despite
your incessant coughing under the covers at night (Howl 20).
America whose ideas are perfect, but
actuality destroys our perfect
imagination. Just look at the Declaration of
Independence. A =93Howl=94=
for
freedom
long before the infamous poem.
America, I am waiting for you to fight
back against all this =93progress.=
=94 I
am
prepared for earthquakes, volcanoes, floods, storms, tornadoes. I=92m
ready
for anything. I=92m ready for death, if
it will make you beautiful=
again.
Boddisatva Jack who found America in
his hero=97Dean Moriarty, Cody=
Pomeray.
An
America that would take him to IT, but would also leave him lying sick in
bed (On
The Road).
Jack brought back the beauty of
America. The Beauty left unacknowledged
by
the
Lost Generation, who ran away from America.
Ernest Hemingway says,
=93Let
the others come to America who did not know that they had come too
late. Our people had seen it at its best and
fought for it when it was
worth
fighting for. Now I would go someplace
else (Green Hills of Africa
285).=94 They were deceived by your artificial face,
America, and couldn=92=
t
see the
real you. America, I don=92t agree with
Hemingway or F. Scott
Fitzgerald. I=92ve seen your =93fresh, green breast,=94
and I believe it is=
still
worth
fighting for. Fitzgerald and Papa have
obviously never been to
Alaska,
or they too would have seen this potential.
As Ken Kesey describes
Alaska
in Sailor=92s Song, =93Alaska is the end, the finale, the Last Ditch=
of
the
Pioneer Dream. From Alaska there=92s no
place left to go. . . . So it
came
down to Alaska, the Final Frontier as far as this sick old ballgame
goes. Top of the ninth . . .=94 Nothing could prepare me for my first
experience
of Alaska. I=92ve seen many beautiful
places in America, but
Alaska
blew them all away, and it was as if I was seeing Beauty for the
first
time. =20
While the Lost Generation was busy
putting America down, a small voice came
in her
defense from Asheville, North Carolina.
Thomas Wolfe put America
back
into literature. Wolfe prophesized:
=93I believe we are lost in=
America,
but I
do believe we will be found . . . I think the true discovery of
America
is before us. I think the true
fulfillment of our spirit, of our
people,
of our mighty and immortal land, is yet to come.=94 Jack writes=
about
Thomas
Wolfe: =93He just woke me up to America as a poem instead of America=
=20
as a place to struggle around and sweat
in. Mainly this dark-eyed American
poet
made me want to prowl, and roam, and see the real America that was
there
and that had never been uttered.=94 And
these exact words could
perfectly
describe what Kerouac did for me.
Jack did not write his novels, America
wrote his novels. All Jack had to
do was
listen and transcribe America=92s song.
Gregory Corso knew this=
well:
=93Was
not so much our finding America as it was America finding its voice=
in
us=94
(Corso 126).
America needs to be changed from the
inside and that is a very hard
endeavor
to ask of anyone. To go inside Moloch
itself and risk losing
yourself
to it in hope that you can unplug it and open its eyes to its
beautiful
natural state. So hard to do this
because it is so much easier to
shut
the door and turn one=92s back on Moloch.
So much easier to drop out=
of
school,
create one=92s own perfect microcosmos, and be free. But one must
sacrifice
one=92s personal freedom in order to make this country worthy of=
the
premise
of its Declaration. Jack Kerouac could
not do this. He could not
live
inside Moloch and help change it. So he
escaped on the road and in the
mountains,
but he could not run away forever, and, face to face with Moloch
America,
he resorted to the bottle.
Allen Ginsberg really helped change
Moloch. He worked within the
institution,
trying to disable the institution rather than running from it.
While
Jack sings the song of America, Allen fights for America against the
evil
mechanistic Moloch. We need both of
these people to save America: one
to show
how beautiful our country is and that it is worth fighting for, and
the
other to fight for it and make this dream a reality.
Douglas Brinkley has definitely taken
Ginsberg=92s side. He is changing
America
by immersing himself in the Moloch that has darkened higher
education,
and he is trying to show us how to discover America, how to
discover
freedom: =93No matter how hard a teacher tries, freedom--to be=
one=92s
own
master, total and absolute--can not be taught in a classroom. And so we
take to
the open road=94 (Brinkley 502). He
describes his profession as=
being
full of
=93cynicism and narrowness,=94 but he doesn=92t run from this,=
instead he=20
attempts to destroy it by living within it
with out cynicism or narrowness.
He
believes that =93If we put our collective energy and capital and faith
behind
our schools, we might get them=97and America=97back on track=94=
(Brinkley
xv). Through his Majic Bus classes students begin
to really discover the
America
in themselves and the America on the road.
Sometimes I think it would be so much
easier to turn my back and drop out
of
school and become a bum and wander around this country, but the chances
of
really being able to put this country back on track by doing that seem
rather
slim so I am toughing it out, and I am actually able to remain happy
despite
all the stupid classes I=92m required to take.
Because I know that=
I
can do
something for this country, I can help free all these Americans
trapped
in Moloch=92s jaws. I don=92t know what
I=92d do if I didn=92t have=
my
regular
dose of Kerouac to keep me sane . . . or insane . . . or whatever .
. . but
definitely free.
=93Freedom=92s just another name for
nothing left to lose,=94 sings Janis=
Joplin.
Rock
and Roll was born in the pages of the Beat Generation. One can see the
similarities
between the above quote and Jack Kerouac=92s =93Everything=
belongs
to me
because I am poor=94 (Visions of Cody 33).
If only we had people with the guts to
really get into the American
government
and change it. The government is indeed
the scariest place for
free
American=92s to venture. It is so
anti-America, but it is there where
this
country can really be changed. We need
people like Jack and Bobby
Kennedy. People really dedicated to making America
live up to Thomas
Jefferson=92s
great expectations. I think Bill
Clinton is a step in the=
right
direction. Although we always wish that the government
would be changed
drastically,
we must understand that this is impossible, and the only way to
change
America is to go step by step as President Clinton is doing.
William S. Burroughs says, =93Now that
America has lost the Russians as an
enemy,
I don=92t know what we=92ll do. Without
enemies, nations can=92t=
exist=94
(Brinkley
209). The great WSB is wrong here;
America does have an enemy.
This
enemy stares at us when we look in the mirror.
This enemy is the
mirror
itself and Moloch is just a hideous funhouse reflection of America.
We must
look in the mirror and=20
realize that we are seeing the made-up
America, the fake America. An
America
smeared with make-up, covered with clothes.
We must get the courage
to wipe
off this fake face and take off this fake body and go out and really
face
the world in all our natural glory:
=93America, when will you be
angelic? When will you take off your clothes?=94
(Howl 31). And that
=93strange
American iron=94 that attempts to =93straighten and quell the=
long
wavering
spermy disorderliness of the boy=94 (Visions of Cody 48-9). It=92s
high
time that we peel off these pressed clothes.
And how true was it when I told my
brother: =93The Real America can only be
seen
while you=92re moving.=94 But it was
only until our hitch-hiking
experiences
that I realized how true it was. How beautiful a memory when my
brother
finally told me that he understood this philosophy on the back of a
pick-up
while we watched the sunset=92s dying light dancing on the mountains
behind us. America is always changing, because time is
always changing, so,
therefore
we must run to grasp America. America
is the =93IT=94 that Sal=
and
Dean
were chasing throughout On the Road.
Only catchable when moving, but
at the
same time it is always the same America, always the same IT. It only
appears
different because our senses are trapped in a temporal world. By
discovering
America, we transcend time into a world of pure imagination that
is so
much more perfect than the actual world ever was, but hopefully
someday,
the reality will be able to match our dreams.
=93There is no truth
but in
transit,=94 Emerson said.
It is time for Americans to
listen. America has been silent for all
these
years,
but now she has something to say. All
these people bragging about
how
much money they make. It=92s time for
America to shut these people up.
It=92s
time to listen to me because America wants me to tell you her story.
She
wants me to open your ears.
The title page to Jack Kerouac=92s
Visions of Cody reads: =93Dedicated to
America,
whatever that is.=94 Such a simple yet
beautiful description of
America. Jack then proceeds to find America in the
novel and he finds Cody
and he
realizes that you can=92t separate the Americans from their America.
The
inner and outer worlds are both important.
Jack realizes that the Real
America,
the Red Brick-Wall America, is hidden=20
behind the Red Neon Moloch America. And now, =93it=92s infinitely bleaker=
than
ever=94
(Visions of Cody 82). The Real America
=93hid behind the red neons=
of
our
frontward noticeable desperately advertised life=94 (79). It=92s only=
when
Jack
accepts loss forever that he is found.
Found by a =93wild sweet=
America=94
where
the =93dew is on the road again and as forever.=94 And when Cody=92s
=93American
Irish pioneer in him was mourning the loss of home, he realized=
he
never
had one=94 (386). All us Americans must
reach this understanding=
before
we can
ever find America. Cody =93represents
all that=92s left of America=
=94
(342). The only thing left of worth in America are
self-believing
individuals
and Mother Nature herself. When Jack
comes to this conclusion
at the
end of Visions of Cody, he can finally say that =93the holy road is
over=94
(397).
Gregory Corso realized that we, as
American individuals have become America
herself:
=93Yea the America the America unstained and never revolutionized=
for
liberty
ever in us free, the America in us--unboundaried and unhistoried, we
the
America, we the fathers of that America, the America you [Jack Kerouac]
Johnnyappleseeded,
the America I heralded, an America not there, an America
soon to
be.=94 An America soon to be. It
appears to me that the American
Dream
is really nothing more than hope. Hope
for an actual America as
beautiful
as the America in our dreams. Allen
Ginsberg also agrees with the
belief
that personal independence is one thing to fight for in America: =93T=
he
stakes
are too great=97an America gone mad with materialism, a police-state
America,
a sexless and soulless America prepared to battle the world in
defense
of a false image of its Authority. Not
the wild and beautiful
America
of the comrades of Whitman, not the historic America of Blake and
Thoreau
where the spiritual independence of each individual was an America,
a
universe, more huge and awesome than all the abstract bureaucracies and
Authoritative
Officialdoms of the World combined.=94
I want an America that is safe for hitch-hiking. Hitch-hiking is the
perfect
way to reinstall faith in one=92s country.
While hitch-hiking one
puts
everything out of their own hands and into the hands of America. One
relies
on America to get them where they are going.
There is nothing in the
world
sadder than watching cars pass you by as you stand on the side of the
road
holding your soul in your thumb, and=20
making eye contact with drivers who quickly
break the contact and look
away. This is what makes Big Sur so sad when Jack
reflects, =93This is the
first
time I=92ve hitch hiked in years and I soon began to see that things
have
changed in America, you can=92t get a ride anymore.=94 =20
Sometimes I wonder if there are any
remains of the Real America, of the
Kerouac
America. Sometimes I think this is just
a doomed attempt like
trying
to catch the sun, but it does not matter.
The Real America is found
only in
the process of searching for the Real America.
It is the journey
that
counts, not the destination. Even if
America will never be found again
that
does not give us reason to postpone our search. One Saturday night
over
Spring Break, a friend and I were cruising around Panama City Beach.
There
were thousands of college students all trying to find the center of
the
American Saturday Night. Cars were
bumper to bumper, and we drove about
ten
miles in two hours before the traffic started to die down again. We had
no idea
why the traffic died, all these people had to be going somewhere.
Then--BAM--an
epiphany came up and slapped my face: The actual cruising is
itself
the center of the American Saturday Night.
There is no place to go,
but we
gotsta go. And now I know that Jack was
wrong when he wrote: =93no=
guy
whether
he was a big drinker, or big fighter or big cocksman could ever find
the
center of Saturday Night in America=94 (Visions of Cody 57).=20
Allen Ginsberg describes Visions of
Cody as =93a dirge for America, for its
heroes
deaths too, but then who could know except in the Unconscious? -- A
dirge
for the American Hope that Jack (& his hero Neal) carried so valiently
after
Whitman -- An America of pioneers and generosity -- and selfish glooms
and
exploitations implicit in the pioneers=92 entry into foreign Indian and
Moose
lands -- But the great betrayal of that manly America of Love was made
by the
pseudo-heroic masculines of Army and Industry and Advertising and
Construction
and Transport and toilets and Wars.=94 (Visions of Cody 430).
We must never let the silence of
Moloch take over America. An America
who
wants
us to return to our childhood dreams of her, when we were young and
idealistic
and spent our time frolicking in dandelion patches. An America
who
will never end, and despite how hard Moloch tries, her original beauty=
will=20
always be there, and there will always be
hope, because the Real American
Dream
refuses to die. This song, which was
passed to me by Whitman,
Kerouac,
Wolfe, Ginsberg, etc., will soon be passed to others, and so the
song
goes on forever. There will always be
people whose ears are sensitive
to the
beauty of America and they will hear the song swelling inside of them
and
they will know that there is nothing left to do but sing
Works
Consulted
Primary
Sources:
Brinkley,
Douglas. _The Majic Bus: An American
Odyssey_. New York:
Doubleday,
1993.
Burroughs,
William S. _Naked Lunch_. New York: Grove-Atlantic, 1992.
Cassady,
Neal. _The First Third_. San Fransisco: City Lights, 1971.
Corso,
Gregory. _Mindfield, New and Selected
Poems_. New York: Thunder=92s
Mouth,
1989.
Ferlinghetti,
Lawrence. _A Coney Island of the
Mind_. New York: New
Directions,
1958.
------. _These Are My Rivers: New and Selected Poems
1955-1993_. New York:
New
Directions, 1993.
Ginsberg,
Allen. _Howl and Other Poems_. San Fransisco: City Lights, 1956.
------. _Collected Poems 1947-1980_. New York: Harper & Row, 1985.
Kerouac,
Jack. _Mexico City Blues_. New York: Grove, 1959.
------. =93Is There a Beat Generation?=94 Recorded talk published as=
=93Origins
of the
Beat Generation,=94 Playboy, June
1959.
------. _Lonesome Traveler_. New York: Grove Press, 1960.
------. _Selected Letters 1940-1956_. New York: Viking Penguin, 1995.
------.
_The Dharma Bums_. New York: Viking Penguin, 1971
------. _Desolation Angels_. New York: Perigee, 1978.
------. _On The Road_. New York: Viking Penguin, 1991.
------. _Big Sur_.
New York: Viking Penguin, 1992.
------. _Tristessa_. New York: Viking Penguin, 1992.
------. _Pomes All Sizes_. San Fransisco: City Lights Books, 1992.
------. _Visions of Cody_. New York: Viking Penguin, 1993.
------. _Good Blonde & Others_. San Fransisco: Grey Fox Press, 1993.
------. _Vanity of Dulouz_. New York: Viking Penguin, 1994.
------. _The Scripture of the Golden Eternity_. San Fransisco: City
Lights,
1994.
Sackmann,
Matthew. _My Life: The Journal I Never
Kept_. Published in=
Heaven.
Snyder,
Gary. _Earth House Hold: Technical
Notes and Queries to Fellow
Dharma
Revolutionaries_. New York: New Directions, 1969.
------. _Mountains and Rivers Without End_. San Fransisco: Four Seasons
Foundation,
1996.
------. _No Nature: New and Selected Poems_. New York: Pantheon, 1992.
------. _Turtle Island_. Boston: Shambhala, 1993.
=20
Anthologies:
Charters,
Ann, ed. _The Portable Beat
Reader_. New York:Viking Penguin,=
1992.
Knight,
Brenda, ed. _Women of the Beat Generation_.
Berkeley: Conari Press,
1996.
Tonkinson,
Carole, ed. _Big Sky Mind: Buddhism and
the Beat Generation_.
New
York: Riverhead Books, 1995.
Waldeman,
Anne, ed. _The Beat Book_. Boston: Shambhala, 1996.
Bibliographies:
Charters,
Ann. _Kerouac: A Biography_. San Fransisco: Straight Arrow,=
1973.
Gifford,
Barry, and Lawrence Lee. _ Jack=92s Book: An Oral Biography of Jack
Kerouac_. New York,
Penguin, 1979.
Related
Texts:
Frank
Robert. _The Americans_. Introduction by Jack Kerouac. New York:
Grove,
1959.
Hunt,
Tim. _Kerouac=92s Crooked Road_. Hamden, CT: Archon Books, 1981.
Weinreich,
Regina. _The Spontaneous Poetics of
Jack Kerouac_. Carbondale:
Southern
Illinois University Press, 1987.
Films:
_Pull
My Daisy_. Narrated by Jack Kerouac,
with Gregory Corso, Peter
Orlovsky
, Larry Rivers, and David Amram.
Directed by Robert Frank and
A.
Leslie. Houston: Houston Museum of Art,
1958.
Audio
Recordings:
_The
Beat Generation_. Santa Monica, Calif.:
Rhino/Word Beat, 1992.
Ginsberg,
Allen. _Holy Soul, Jelly Roll: Poems
and Songs 1949-1993_. Santa
Monica,
Calif.: Rhino/Word Beat, 1994.
Kerouac,
Jack. _The Jack Kerouac
Collection_. Santa Monica, Calif.:
Rhino/Word
Beat, 1993.
*****************************************************************
"Everyone
takes the limits of his own vision
for the limits of the world."
Arthur
Schopenhauer
*****************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 04:11:51 EDT
Reply-To: Joe <100106.1102@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Joe <100106.1102@COMPUSERVE.COM>
-------------Forwarded
Message-----------------
From: Joe,
To: Beat-L, INTERNET:BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
Date: 06/06/97 18:17
RE: BEAT-L Digest - 4 Jun 1997 to 5 Jun 1997
-------------Forwarded
Message-----------------
From: Joe,
To: Automatic digest processor,
INTERNET:LISTSERV@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
Date: 06/06/97 15:47
RE: BEAT-L Digest - 4 Jun 1997 to 5 Jun 1997
Message
text written by Automatic digest processor
>listen
to a cricket
speak
for two hours
a day
until
you understand
the
melody
while
eating an apple
a day
and
keep those spiritual
advisors
at bay !!!!<
this
made me smile. one of the reasons i
asked for such
an
advisor is that i hit the road (with pc) alone in september
starting
in spain. when i've worked there in the
past the mountainside
apartment
is awash at night with the sound of crickets...also
one of
my personal goals is to eat more fruit.
always putting
off
such ideas until tomorrow i decided to wait until i got to
spain
where the sun shines & fruit becomes more appealing.
could
this be a prophesy of things to come?
eating apples
to the
sound of crickets! (we don't have many
crickets in
northern
uk incidently) hope my memory serves me
well & i
will
think of david should this happen
also,
as this is a 'literature' forum, i thought some of you may
appreciate
this...
The European Union commissioners have
announced that agreement
has been reached to adopt English as
the preferred language for
European communications, rather than German, which was the
other possibility. As part of the negotiations, Her Majesty's
Government conceded that English
spelling had some room for
improvement and has accepted a
five-year phased plan for what
will be known as EuroEnglish (Euro for
short).
In the first year, "s" will
be used instead of the soft "c".
Sertainly, sivil servants will resieve
this news with joy.
Also, the hard "c will be replaced with "k". Not only
will this
klear up konfusion, but typewriters kan
have one less letter.
There will be growing publik enthusiasm
in the sekond year,
when the troublesome "ph"
will be replaced by "f". This will
make words like "fotograf" 20
per sent shorter.
In the third year, publik akseptanse of
the new spelling kan be
expekted to reach the stage where more
komplikated changes are
possible. Governments will enkorage the removal of double
letters, which have always ben a
deterent to akurate speling.
Also, al wil agre that the horible mes
of silent "e"s in the
languag is disgrasful, and they would
go.
By the fourth year, peopl wil be
reseptiv to steps such as
replasing "th" by z" and
"w" by " v".
During ze fifz year, ze unesesary
"o" kan be dropd from vords
kontaining "ou",
and similar changes vud of kors be
aplid to ozer kombinations
of leters.
After zis fifz yer, ve vil hav a reli
sensibl riten styl. Zer
vil be no mor trubls or difikultis and
evrivun vil find it ezi
tu understand ech ozer. Ze drem vil finali kum tru.
REMEMBER
THIS IS A JOKE - DO NOT TAKE SERIOUSLY!!!!
joe
newcastleunitedkingdom
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 04:11:54 EDT
Reply-To: Joe <100106.1102@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Joe
<100106.1102@COMPUSERVE.COM>
-------------Forwarded
Message-----------------
From: Joe,
To: Beat-L, INTERNET:BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
Date: 06/06/97 18:16
RE: BEAT-L Digest - 29 May 1997 to 30 May
1997
-------------Forwarded
Message-----------------
From: Joe,
To: Automatic digest processor,
INTERNET:LISTSERV@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
Date: 06/06/97 17:33
RE: BEAT-L Digest - 29 May 1997 to 30 May
1997
>I
bet we all listen to music almost all the time. It'd be inneresting if
people
posted their soundtracks with their posts.
(ben neil)
<
i'd die
without music.
i'm
currently listening to a band called THE verve
a
couple of their lyrics are:
"where you gonna go when the music stops
and you're left alone in your mind
well i'll be hearing music till the day i
die"
(i interpret this as the singer meaning he'll
be hearing music
in his mind till the day he dies)
"dreamt of the future woke up with a
scream i was buying
some feelings from a vending machine."
now
there's a thought!
imagine
being able to buy a bar of cadbury's dairy milk kerouac from a vending
machine. once digested you too can understand the
emotion and knowledge
of
beat!
joe
newcastleunitedkingdom
actually,
thinking about it would probably be a can budweizer from a vending
machine
;-7
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 04:11:47 EDT
Reply-To: Joe <100106.1102@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Joe
<100106.1102@COMPUSERVE.COM>
-------------Forwarded
Message-----------------
From: Joe,
To: Beat-L, INTERNET:BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
Date: 06/06/97 18:17
RE: BEAT-L Digest - 28 May 1997 to 29 May
1997
-------------Forwarded
Message-----------------
From: Joe,
To: Automatic digest processor,
INTERNET:LISTSERV@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
Date: 06/06/97 17:11
RE: BEAT-L Digest - 28 May 1997 to 29 May
1997
>Just
tossing out a question for discussion that seems to me is always at the
root of
the "who is beat" issue, whis IS the most enduring topic for
discussion
on this list notwithstanding the Kerouac estate issue.
Is beat
a style, not confined to a specific time, place or set of people?
OR is
beat something that is now and forever the label for the work of Jack
Kerouac,
Allen Ginsberg, William Burroughs, Gregory Corso and the rest?
Howard
Park<
i'm
guilty of this 'who is beat' question too.
i first joined the list in
october
95 (and
haven't left & rejoined since!) and it wasn't too long before i asked
if
bukowski (an author i put up there with kerouac & burroughs) was beat.
needless
to say it wasn't long before i was singed (rather than flamed)
for
asking such a stupid question. this was
definetly a good thing for me
as it
made me question what beat meant to others as well as myself.
i don't
think we'll ever escape this question unless some kind soul cares
to
filter the archives and stick everyones opinion on this topic into an faq.
my
(current) view on the term beat is that it is a philosophy, a world-view,
a
lifestyle, a selfpreserving function of the brain. it is also a label used by
people
(who need a shortcut to thinking) in order to conceptualise a group of
writers,
poets, drug takers, outlaws and travellers.
for me it is all of these
and
more.
to
steal from william burroughs i'll offer the following for anyone reading:
1. you
have to first agree with people how you want to use the word.
2. a
word doesn't mean anything by itself, there's no built-in intrinsic
meaning,
it's
just how you want to use it.
3. it's
an abstraction like, "what is the truth?"
4. it's
a semantic blind-alley.
5. it
doesn't have a meaning except that which you assign to it, and if people
don't
agree
on the meaning then you're going to have endless feuds over nothing, which
is
what
happens all the time.
6. beat
is a four-letter word.
7. if
you agree on what you mean and how you want to use it, only then
can you
use it.
8. to
say that it has an absolute inherent meaning one way or an absolute
inherent
meaning
the other way, is a semantic problem.
9. dont
ask a large question using a large word which can mean anything, and
then
expect
somebody to give you a sensible answer.
for me
beat is a philosophy that is an ideal rather than an idea
for me
beat is an ever lasting emotion - anyone who can understand & emphasize
with
this
specific eMotion is beat
for me
beat is jack kerouac neal cassady herbet huncke ad lib to fade
for me
beat is lying in the gutter yet still reaching for the stars
for me
beat is this list
thats
enough for me
joe
newcastleunitedkingdom
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 05:02:24 -0500
Reply-To: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: wisdoms from wise creators
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Maya
Gorton wrote:
>
>
"The most beautiful emotion we can experience is the mystical. It is the
>
sower of all true art and science. Those to whom this emotion is a
>
stranger . . . are as good as dead. To know that what is impenetrable to us
>
really exists --- manifesting itself as the highest wisdom and the most
>
radiant beauty, which our dull facilities can comprehend only in their most
>
primitive forms --- this knowledge, this feeling, is at the centre to true
>
religiousness. In this sense, and this sense only, I belong to the ranks of
>
devoutly religious man." Albert Einstein
he also
said
"i
have my best ideas while shaving."
:)
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 05:31:13 -0500
Reply-To: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Traveling dream
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
to the
tune of "Pack up your sorrows"
awoke
in Salina from dream of trip to kansas city.
stopped
in lawrence on way.
met
patricia and company.
wish
Lena would let me play "Q" now and then.
wedding
visions.
tears
streaming like ghost of bride's great grandmother twice removed.
weep.
vision
of three old Rhaesa's and trunkload of trash.
back at
patricia's.
or
billy p's.
same
room many places.
no
watches.
highway
scenes. varied.
food. good.
smell
of chicken burritos.
terrific
& terrify
two
terms of travel tune.
smell
of burning rubber.
car
shaking.
steering
column jerks.
cars
passing.
passing.
passing.
leaving
me behind like ugly samarai warrior.
pit
crew and Indy descends and my Uncle Babe in charge.
i'm
awake now. slept for three days and
have ressurected. quite a
dream. no place like home.
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 07:38:09 -0400
Reply-To: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: some thoughts on the list
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
it
seems since beat-l is going down the tubes in some fashion, here. it's
like
everybody's personal planner, sec'ty etc since bill did what he had to
do to
make us think about what we send. and yet, not so much thinking
goinn'
on
private
posts proliferate.
maybe
if people could take their more personal correspondence off list, we
could
again go into full swing again. ie, focus on literature.
and
yes, i do also send personal posts to list sometimes. this is for all,
includ.
me, to think about.
however, most of my personal posts i send off list
with list friends vs
spamming
all with details of who sat on whos terlet seat or whatever.
and
that is not an allusion/illusion to any previous poster.
mc
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 14:54:51 +0200
Reply-To: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Subject: Re: X
In-Reply-To: <339B1FB0.79B5@update.uu.se>
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
X is
black--
amiri baraka (Leroi Jones)
---
yrs
Rinaldo
* sorry
this has no beat connection *
* i'm a beetle beated *
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 10:01:08 -0400
Reply-To: Marioka7@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Maya Gorton <Marioka7@AOL.COM>
Subject: attn all beat-l members!
I am
seeking collaborators for a 'Zine' project.
It will consist of the
following:
---poetry,
poetic prose
---social
ciriticism
---sociology
of art and literature
---music
and book and film reviews
---artwork
(photos, drawings, paintings, ideas)
The end
product will be printed on actual paper (remember that stuff?) in
black
and white with color pages and real binding (not staples!!). I would
like to
work on it this summer and print it in September, as I am leaving
country
indefinitely in October.
I am
open to all kinds of submissions, not only beat-related. Please send
things
by e-mail to Marioka7@aol.com or by
regular mail to: (wait a minute,
i don't
wanna post my addres, so just e-mail me and I'll send it to you if
you
need it)
Though
I'm not looking for any particular flavor of writing, some selectivity
may be
necessary, depending on the volume of submissions. Thanks and I look
forward
to hearing from you.---------------------------------------------maya
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 09:34:46 -0500
Reply-To: Bob Fox <bfox@SIU.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Bob Fox <bfox@SIU.EDU>
Subject: LeRoi Jones/Amiri Baraka
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
With regard to Rinaldo Rasa's comment
that his posting of a quote
from
Amiri Baraka (LeRoi Jones) "has no beat connection," it is necessary
to note
that before he became a black cultural nationalist and changed his
name to
Amiri Baraka ("blessed prince") in 1967, LeRoi Jones was very
closely
associated with the Beats. He was the
only black writer included
in
Donald Allen's seminal anthology THE NEW AMERICAN POETRY 1945-1960,
which
included many of the Beats. Jones also
published (along with his
first
wife Hettie Cohen) a magazine called YUGEN (1958-1963), which
published
many Beat writers. He was close friends
with Allen Ginsberg and
others
before repudiating his relationships with white people (something he
is
critical of today). The full story of
the beats would have to include
African
Americans like LeRoi Jones and Ted Joans, as well as Bob Kaufman.
If
anyone knows of any others, I'd like to have the information.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 08:00:21 -0700
Reply-To: Jo Ann Collins
<joannc@CSUFRESNO.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jo Ann Collins
<joannc@CSUFRESNO.EDU>
Subject: Jazz Poetry
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I'll
try again to see if anyone might be interested in providing some advice
on
comparing jazz poetry (most of the poems I'm discussing are either
dedicated
to or called by the artist's name - - i.e. Charlie Parker,
Thelonius
Monk, Charles Mingus, John Coltrane, etc. ) to jazz. I'm
specifically
discussing the poetry of Lawson Inada.
I was referred to your
list by
someone who said there were knowledgeable people on this BEAT list.
But
maybe I'm in the wrong genre. Questions
would be how the structure of
the
poem relates to the way the music is written and performed; how the
words
may make you think of the artist's music, etc.
Thanks for any help
that
may be offered. Jo Ann
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 11:01:26 -0400
Reply-To: Waterrow@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeffrey Weinberg
<Waterrow@AOL.COM>
Subject: Beat-L T-Shirt Update
Check
out the Beat-L T-shirt at http://www.waterrow.com
---------------------
Forwarded
message:
Subj: Beat-L T-Shirt Update
Date: 97-06-02 15:54:02 EDT
From: Waterrow
To: Beat-L@cunyvm.cuny.edu
CC: Waterrow
Dear
Beat-L members:
Thanks
to all of you who have emailed or phoned me to place your order for
the
official Beat-L T-shirt which will be ready to ship in a few weeks....
But to
all of you out there who placed your name on the list back in April to
reserve
your T-shirts - Now is the time to honor your committment....
The
T-shirt has been custom designed by artist S.Clay Wilson and is available
in
Large- Extra Large- and Extra Extra Large Sizes. White ink on black 100%
super
deluxe quality cotton preshrunk T-shirt...$18.00 (no shipping or
handling
charges).
Satisfaction
guaranteed.
Master
Card / Visa / Money Order / or Check....
C'Mon
Gerry Nicosia! - If you really care about this Beat-L and promoting it
to the
world, Order a T-shirt!! And how about
you - Jerry C. - How come you
won't
buy a shirt to help promote this list??? And what about you, Paul
Maher?
You can give a shirt to Sampas as a gift!
(only kidding!!!! - don't
be
soooo sensitive, you guys!)
Seriously,
folks - please honor your T-shirt committment as soon as possible.
We
ordered the quantity of shirts and sizes based on your reservations....
You can
view the S. Clay Wilson artwork for the Beat-L shirt at:
http://www.waterrowbooks.com
Thanks
-
Jeffrey
Weinberg
Beat-L
T-shirt Committee
c/o
Water Row Books
PO Box
438
Sudbury
MA 01776
Tel
508-485-8515
Fax
508-229-0885
EMail
Waterrow@aol.com
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 10:00:47 -0500
Reply-To: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: A note from MEAN John
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
multipart/mixed; boundary="------------181235B01C22"
This is
a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------181235B01C22
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
a note
from MEAN John.
I have
no recollection if this was posted during the great flood of
tribute
postings.
here it
comes .... straight in from California
where
grapes are picked
and the
grape pickers are
grape
pickers.
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
--------------181235B01C22
Content-Type:
message/rfc822
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Content-Disposition:
inline
Received:
from emout19.mail.aol.com (emout19.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.45])
by services.midusa.net (8.8.5/8.8.5)
with ESMTP id EAA05321
for <race@midusa.net>; Sat, 7
Jun 1997 04:35:33 -0500 (CDT)
From:
JKM1993@aol.com
Received:
(from root@localhost)
by emout19.mail.aol.com
(8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0)
id FAA23536 for race@midusa.net;
Sat, 7 Jun 1997 05:46:09 -0400 (EDT)
Date:
Sat, 7 Jun 1997 05:46:09 -0400 (EDT)
Message-ID:
<970607054609_-1296137460@emout19.mail.aol.com>
To:
race@midusa.net
Subject:
Ginsberg tribute
David,
I don't
know if you saw this...thought I would send it along...
John
Allen
Ginsberg: A Moment of Grieving
Diane
di Prima
Allen's
face stares up at me from a dozen newspapers,
Never
to give his stiff and upright form another hug!
No more
vegetarian concoction dinners at Varsity Town Houses!
No more
lucid, humorous analysis of puzzling political climate!
Not to
be buddies again on some committee to spring a friend from prison
or
raise
bucks for yet another civil liberties trial!
No more
late hours in punk dives readis together for lamas or dharma
centers, or expounding Buddhist theory 2
a.m. into green room mikes for
Pacifica Radio!
No time
to fuss that he doesn't take care of himself!
No more
presentation copies with funny drawings of flowers, suns, and
Buddhas!
No
chance to meet next generation of pretty boy poetry groupies, borrow
coffee
on
Boulder summer mornings!
No one
to ask me about my sex life, my kids', my grandkids' sex lives!
No more
that warm, deep, beautiful voice coming between us poets and our
Troubles---real or mind-created!
No
rich, funny gossip, latest literary news from around the world,
grandfatherly
unlooked-for and unused poetry advice.
No
warrior of outspoken directness, unabashed songs of the most detailed,
embarrassing and personal moments of all our
lives.
John
Meany
Claremont
Colleges
--------------181235B01C22--
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 10:58:32 -0400
Reply-To: "Michael L. Buchenroth"
<mike@INFINET.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Michael L. Buchenroth"
<mike@INFINET.COM>
Subject: Ray Bremser
Comments:
cc: cveditions@aol.com
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Charlie:
Last
Friday talking to Jeffrey at Water Row books (I ordered my Beat-L
T-shirts),
Jeffrey talked of Ray Bremser and of Bonnie Bremser's book
"Troia"
and that Bonnie intends to rewrite it and add pages. Saturday
night
at work, I read the Ray Bremser section in "Portable Beat Reader."
Anyway,
Jeffrey suggested that I ask you about Ray and Bonnie
Bremser--that
you might have some personal antidotes regarding these two
writers
that you might share?
Thank
you...
Michael
L. Buchenroth
mike@buchenroth.com
www.buchenroth.com
To view
Columbus'
Electronic Literary Magazine
go to
www.buchenroth.com/magazine.html
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 12:17:57 -0400
Reply-To: "Michael L. Buchenroth"
<mike@INFINET.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Michael L. Buchenroth" <mike@INFINET.COM>
Subject: Illness' remedy
Comments:
cc: cveditions@aol.com
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Charley:
I meant
to ask for personal anecdotes not some herbal remedy, perhaps
ephedrined
ma haung stem tea antidote to fatigue and a whacked out spell
check'n
less Monday homonymal service! -- "God be with thee folks--Praise
the day
and the father and the mother and yer ghost--that shadow trail'n ya
there
to too two an and there they're their bare-Not Owsley-bear, bow
tie ya
heads, let's pray -- Some benzedrine or another
amphetamine
would do it! I'd rather have the antidote than the
anecdote
if the antidote was speed and the condition was me...
Antidote
us... I suppose
But I
meant anecdote...
Michael
L. Buchenroth
mike@buchenroth.com
www.buchenroth.com
To view
Columbus'
Electronic Literary Magazine
go to
www.buchenroth.com/magazine.html
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 19:10:49 +0200
Reply-To: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Subject: old times--questions--questions...
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
DEAR
friends,
how
many are we? 150... 250... who he does it know?
i
download for myself the Beat-L archive
month
by month & here there's all
the
answers we/i need (?),
yes,
man,
we
posters are the wired point
of
what? dawn/twilight of
the
millenium,
'bout
what's we can write
'cuz
beat is a feeling
---
yrs
Rinaldo
* a not
competent beat *
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 19:15:45 +0200
Reply-To: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Subject: Re: LeRoi Jones/Amiri Baraka
In-Reply-To:
<l03010d00afc17c743039@[131.230.145.137]>
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At
09.34 09/06/97 -0500, Bob Fox wrote:
> With regard to Rinaldo Rasa's comment
that his posting of a quote
>from
Amiri Baraka (LeRoi Jones) "has no beat connection," it is necessary
>to
note that before he became a black cultural nationalist and changed his
>name
to Amiri Baraka ("blessed prince") in 1967, LeRoi Jones was very
>closely
associated with the Beats. He was the
only black writer included
>in
Donald Allen's seminal anthology THE NEW AMERICAN POETRY 1945-1960,
>which
included many of the Beats. Jones also
published (along with his
>first
wife Hettie Cohen) a magazine called YUGEN (1958-1963), which
>published
many Beat writers. He was close friends
with Allen Ginsberg and
>others
before repudiating his relationships with white people (something he
>is
critical of today). The full story of
the beats would have to include
>African
Americans like LeRoi Jones and Ted Joans, as well as Bob Kaufman.
>If
anyone knows of any others, I'd like to have the information.
>
>
i agree
with u, LeRoi Jones IS a beat,
apologies
for the mistake,
i love
u friends, indeed,
yrs
Rinaldo
from
venice,italy.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 11:04:24 -0400
Reply-To: MATT HANNAN
<MATT.HANNAN@OTC.USOC.CCHUB.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: MATT HANNAN
<MATT.HANNAN@OTC.USOC.CCHUB.COM>
Subject: Re[2]: So, I got up this morning and...
Comments:
To: Leitha Sackmann <lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
<SNIP>
> If you really hate hemingway, then why are
you reading TSAR? Maybe it's
>required
for the bartending diploma? Actually, I
can't think of any other
>book
that would be a better read for a bartender.
How
about Big Sur, anything by Bukowski and, at my most facetious, anything
you can
get your hands on from the LBJ Presidential Library (there weren't
no milk
in that milk truck).
To keep
this mildly near-topic I know Ginsberg wrote love letters to
Eisenhower,
does anyone know if he wrote any to LBJ?
Sorry,
Had to be said :)
Matt Hannan
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 13:35:12 -0400
Reply-To: "Michael L. Buchenroth"
<mike@INFINET.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Michael L. Buchenroth"
<mike@INFINET.COM>
Subject: Leroie Jones/Amiri Baraka
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon
June 9th, Bob Fox wrote:
...LeRoi
Jones was very closely related to the Beats...
In case
anyone hasn't yet viewed the Mystic Fire video, "Cooked Shoes,
Fried
Diamonds" (Fried Shoes, Cooked Diamonds???) filmed in part at that
Jack
Kerouac Naropi Institute for Disembodied Poets in Boulder CO
has
LeRoi Jones reading poetry, Corso reading, Ann Waldeman reading, Ann
Waldeman
swimming in a bikini in a swimming pool being interviewed, Wm S
Burroughs
talking to Tim Leary, Ginsberg playing some odd
accordian
device reading a poem about his father's death,
folks
get'n arrested and hauled off inna gray school-bus jail wagon, etc....
I
bought the video from Zane Kesey's K-Zey production
and
Water Row also has it I believe....
Michael
L. Buchenroth
mike@buchenroth.com
www.buchenroth.com
To view
Columbus'
Electronic Literary Magazine
go to
www.buchenroth.com/magazine.html
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 14:10:58 -0500
Reply-To: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: So, I got up this morning and...
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
MATT
HANNAN wrote:
I know
Ginsberg wrote love letters to
>
Eisenhower, does anyone know if he wrote any to LBJ?
>
rumours
of a trist-de-la-soul in Lincoln bedroom.
Ladybird turned into
Parakeet
and flew the coup.
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 15:18:22 -0500
Reply-To: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Looking for a word i dreamed i read last
night
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
dream
of reading about Don Juan.
don
juan dreaming of reading to me.
one
word tonal is remembered.
other
word
nogunal
is peeeering through a curtain
spelling
is
unclear.
meaning
appears
related to where i live.
anyone
who KNOWS of the etymology of this WORD could help me out.
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
to the
tune of "Goodnight Irene" by the Beach Boys
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 23:04:44 +0200
Reply-To: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Subject: Beat generation.
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
DEAR
friends,
I think
a lot of people knows that Jack Kerouac himself denied
to be a
beat. "Duluoz" his last book (& other last
articles
circa 1968-1969) they are more explicit on this side of JK
thought.
JK:because I writes about beatniks do not make me a beat.
JK:I am
independent and do not want to appear in anthology with
writers
with whom I disagree.
this
sentences are a bit disappointing, why JK speaks so?
thanx
for yr friendship,
---
yrs
Rinaldo.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 17:20:37 -0400
Reply-To: Michael Stutz <stutz@DSL.ORG>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Michael Stutz <stutz@DSL.ORG>
Subject: Re: So, I got up this morning and...
Comments:
To: "Diane M. Homza" <ek242@cleveland.Freenet.Edu>
In-Reply-To:
<199706081738.NAA17204@owl.INS.CWRU.Edu>
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Sun,
8 Jun 1997, Diane M. Homza wrote:
>
Maybe once I get my bartending diploma & finish TSAR I'll have some
>
insightful things to say (God, how I hate Hemmingway!!) about TSAR & OTR,
>
since comparisions have been made before.
[snip]
> In
teh meantime, any comments on my scholarly quest?
Been a
while since reading either, but the protagonist in TSAR was impotent
&
felt impotent with his relations; how does this compare (does it even)
with
Sal's feelings, espcially those toward Dean?
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 17:28:16 -0400
Reply-To: CVEditions@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Eliot & Ginsberg
In a
message dated 97-06-08 22:21:20 EDT, you write:
<<
oo
concerned with style, I think. Take something like pissing as a perfect
example.
Eliot would try to make a work of art about pissing. >>
A good
example, Diane, and yes style was / is a concern. The only problem I
have
with Ginsy's didactict of pissing is that he would wait for pissing to
become
a trend. Peter used to bring his own piss to drink when they were
doing
their back to earth routine. It wasn't a new thing. I found it in one
of my
mother's old "underground" medical books. Anyway Allen was eager to
demonstrate
to a local here in C.V. how the running water method of "wiping"
asses
is better than our western paper method. i don't think the local (who
ran the
liquor store) was quite ready for the lesson as we all gathered at
our
tiolet. But he watched the experiment. I agreed with Allen on this one.
But
back to style..hmmm where was I. Oh yeah the book just came in from the
publisher,
T. Diventi, 409 Kent Ave., Bklyn, NY 11211 whom I was just on the
phone
with. Wants me to come down to do a reading. Anyway the book cover is
by the
same artist who did Jack Black. I've read the book through, almost,
and
gave it to my son, Billy who won't let go of it. Good sign. Someone asked
whose
writing now that is up to the beats. This is an example. The author
Carl
Watson's, vision is one I have been seeing since those works of the
beats
many years ago. I wish I had written it down. It would have been much
like
this book. When I can get my hands on it again, I'll try to be more
definitive.
Sorry no e-mail for Diventi.
Charles
Plymell
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 17:33:52 -0400
Reply-To: CVEditions@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: wisdoms from wise creators
In a
message dated 97-06-08 21:40:52 EDT, you write:
<<
Terence McKenna >>
Didn't
he write a letter to Hofstedtler? Sheldrake's another good example. I
think
he is onto something with the morphic resonance and its thread through
the
universe.
Charles
Plymell
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 17:44:41 -0400
Reply-To: CVEditions@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Eliot & Ginsberg
In a
message dated 97-06-09 01:11:03 EDT, you write:
<<
or to get out my actual feelings, heartthrobs, I'm
> not concerned with creating a work of
art, because that's only a
> three-letter word, anyway, plus the
four-letter word work. >>
Well, I
think Genet did a little better in the "heartthrob" genre. What
feelings
aren't actual anyway?
Charles
Plymell
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 17:48:30 -0400
Reply-To: Marioka7@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Maya Gorton <Marioka7@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: attn all beat-l members!
In a
message dated 97-06-09 15:40:45 EDT, you write:
<<
> Though I'm not looking for any
particular flavor of writing, some
selectivity
> may be necessary, depending on the
volume of submissions. Thanks and I
look
> forward to hearing from
you.---------------------------------------------maya
it would assist me greatly if you could hint
at a flavour ... that will
give me a grail to search for in my mountains
of paper scraps.
yours,
david rhaesa
salina, Kansas >>
OK....do
you have anything resembling cut-ups?
Words thrown together that
just
aren't meant to be?(strange page-fellows)?
What
about something that explores how we perceive words and try to make
SENSE
of them? I mean, literally, how we attach sensation to sounds/language.
To
narrow it down even further, do you have anything with nonsense words?
Words
you've made up yourself? Or maybe words you threw together and got a
secondary
meaning that you liked?
If this
is still too general, send me anything with the word "spicy" in it.
-----------------------maya--------------------------
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 18:20:03 -0400
Reply-To: CVEditions@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Leroie Jones/Amiri Baraka
In a
message dated 97-06-09 13:53:32 EDT, you write:
<<
Ginsberg playing some odd
accordian device reading a poem about his
father's death >>
It
would be a harmonium. (Harmoniums were made in Cherry Valley in 19th cent.
Dylan
gave him the one he had.) Is that the same time that Allen told me
about
he and Anne sat naked in a lotus position?
Charles
Plymell
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 09:16:53 -0400
Reply-To: MARK NOFERI
<NOFERI.MARK@EPAMAIL.EPA.GOV>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: MARK NOFERI
<NOFERI.MARK@EPAMAIL.EPA.GOV>
Subject: Dizzy & Kerouac
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain
> Question for Mark. Do you remember
very much about the details of
>Gillespie
picking up on Kerouac's name for the composition that he and
>Charlie
Christian called "Kerouac"? It's a fascinating topic. Players did
>occasionally
name songs after fans and Jack was around listening, watching
>and
doing the occasional jazz review.
> Antoine
>
Voice contact at (514) 933-4956 in
Montreal
Antoine,
I think
you're pretty on target. I _think_ -
and this is coming from a jazz
book, not a Kerouac bio, I remember -
that
someone had suggested it to Dizzy, possibly Kerouac's friend/record company
man Jerry Newman, as Gerry
Nicosia
said, and since Dizzy simply liked the sound of the name, he named the
arrangement after Jack.
I
haven't heard the song myself - I don't think the song is centered around any
conception of Jack's personality or
anything
like that. I'm not sure if it's avaliable on CD at all, as I don't
think it became a very big hit - but of
course, if
anyone
knows better than I, please elaborate...
Mark
Noferi
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 19:32:27 -0400
Reply-To: Michael Stutz <stutz@DSL.ORG>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Michael Stutz <stutz@DSL.ORG>
Subject: Re: Beat generation.
Comments:
To: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19970609230444.00cdf204@pop.gpnet.it>
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon,
9 Jun 1997, Rinaldo Rasa wrote:
>
JK:I am independent and do not want to appear in anthology with
>
writers with whom I disagree.
Who was
Jack talking about here I wonder. I finally took a look at the
Portable
Jack Kerouac this weekend at my sister's place; inside the cover it
says
something to the effect that the book was prepared in accordance to a
design
the author had assembled before his death. Was this the intended
Duluoz
mega-work he was always talking about, or something else entirely?
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 16:45:16 -0700
Reply-To: Gerald Nicosia <gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Kerouac Week in Lowell
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
June 9, 1997
Mark Hemenway tells us that this year,
during Kerouac Week in
Lowell,
the official Kerouac Committee will give tributes to Allen Ginsberg
(who
died this year) and Herbert Huncke (who died last year). He also says
there
will be another memorial mass for Jack Kerouac's soul at St. Louis de
France
church in Lowell, Kerouac's boyhood church, as there was last year.
I was there last year, and was stirred
by the candlelight procession
after
the Mass. But I was puzzled that no
mention was made at that Mass of
Jack's
daughter Jan, who had just died a few months earlier. Now it puzzles
me even
more that the official Kerouac Committee will memorialize Herbert
Huncke
and Allen Ginsberg, but again, no reference whatsoever to Jack's
daughter
having just died.
Since I am not a part of the official
Kerouac Committee, I can only
suggest
that it would be appropriate that some acknowledgement of Jan's
passing
be made during Kerouac Week this year.
And if a Mass is to be held
for
Jack's soul, would it also not be appropriate to have Jan's soul
remembered
there too?
Respectfully, Gerald Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 19:57:00 -0400
Reply-To: CVEditions@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: wisdoms from wise creators
The
Pythagorians, hence Egytians knew nothing else than that which is
sensory;
for them there is scarcely any
delineation which is not a body.
C.
Plymell
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 19:13:36 -0500
Reply-To: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Subject: Re: Kerouac Week in Lowell
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Gerald
Nicosia wrote:
>
>
June 9, 1997
>
> Mark Hemenway tells us that this
year, during Kerouac Week in
>
Lowell, the official Kerouac Committee will give tributes to Allen Ginsberg
>
(who died this year) and Herbert Huncke (who died last year). He also says
>
there will be another memorial mass for Jack Kerouac's soul at St. Louis de
>
France church in Lowell, Kerouac's boyhood church, as there was last year.
> I was there last year, and was
stirred by the candlelight procession
>
after the Mass. But I was puzzled that
no mention was made at that Mass of
>
Jack's daughter Jan, who had just died a few months earlier. Now it puzzles
> me
even more that the official Kerouac Committee will memorialize Herbert
>
Huncke and Allen Ginsberg, but again, no reference whatsoever to Jack's
>
daughter having just died.
> Since I am not a part of the official
Kerouac Committee, I can only
>
suggest that it would be appropriate that some acknowledgement of Jan's
>
passing be made during Kerouac Week this year.
And if a Mass is to be held
>
for Jack's soul, would it also not be appropriate to have Jan's soul
>
remembered there too?
> Respectfully, Gerald Nicosia
Gerald,
do you know if Edie K-Parkers autobiography got published?
nice to
hear your voice on the list.
patricia
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 20:24:34 -0400
Reply-To: CVEditions@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Ray Bremser
In a
message dated 97-06-09 11:00:24 EDT, you write:
<<
Anyway, Jeffrey suggested that I ask you about Ray and Bonnie
Bremser--that you might have some personal
antidotes regarding these two
writers that you might share?
>>
I
haven'y seen Bonnie since we all lived at the Committee. I have a farm
photo I
can send. I understand Bonnnie is ill. I see their daughter
occasionally,
who stops by Cherry Valley. The last time I saw Ray, he was
crying
at the committee at a crash scene (the last one) going on there.
Before
that, some years ago, we did a reading in Albany with Janine. I went
to his
pad in Utica to find him. No house number on the door. Had to ask
around
by description found him. I needed to take a piss; he pointed to the
kitchen
sink which had grown over, moss-like. I found my way to a chair. The
floor
was lined with bottles. He was on a bare mattress. The kitchen table
was
piled high with empty bottles and cans and cigarette butts piled in
everything.
On top of the heap was several thousand dollars in cash from a
welfare
suit or something. He gave me a thousand and said someting like, now
we're
square, don't ever say I owe you anything. Which he didn't. Just nickle
and
dimed me for years. Everyday we hit drugstores when Turpin Hydrate
Codiene.
was legal. I paid for the daily trip. He scored at two or three drug
stores.
We split the drink and drove home. That lasted about two or three
years,
so I guess the expense was about a thou. Too bad that still isn't on
the
market. Sure helped us old timers not get the grip. They say it (Laudnum,
about
the same) was advised by Coleridge's chemist. It is surely needed for
the
long winters (and summers). Now the Pharmaceutical cartel can't let
anything
that simple and inexpensive be on the market for the masses. They
would
rather have them take something that will eventually lead to other
problems
that they can realize more profits from. Simple low maintenance
addiction
is not lucrative enought for the Industry. They prefer transplants,
hookups
to oxygen, etc. for those with insurance. Ray did give me a mss he
finished-sd
he'd like to see it in print but it didn't have anything to do
with
the money. I sent the mss to Jeff.
Charles
Plymell
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 20:32:08 -0400
Reply-To: CVEditions@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Fwd: buchenroth
Thought
this might be of interest to the beat-l, proust etc. We're trying to
encourage
Bob to join the list. He is a great
critic.
Pam
Plymell
---------------------
Forwarded
message:
From: baculum@mci2000.com (baculum)
Reply-to: baculum@mci2000.com
To: CVEditions@aol.com (charles plymell)
Date:
97-06-09 20:29:22 EDT
Dear
Charley,
I finally figured out how to pull up the
Buchenroth site. Yes, it's all
fascinating,
and I wonder how many people have zeroed in to see it. Isn't
there a
way of telling how many websites have been examined over a given
time?
That's still what eludes me--the chances of being seen even if you
are
goven a webpage, etc. But then if there is no webpage you won't be
seen,
period. I'll send an e-mail to buchenroth to see if he'd like some
books.
wouldn't it be neat to have a Peters site on his set up, along side
the cp
site?
Spent nearly 3 hours in dentist's chair
this a.m. dealing with decay
under a
capped tooth, etc. And wll go back Th for more. Even with dental
plan he
is fuckin expensive.
Reading a strange book by a Froggie
living in England Alain De Boton,
HOW
PROUST CAN CHAGE YOUR LIFE. If you'd ever want to know a lot about
Proust
this would be a good place to start. My
daughter sent it to me from
Switz.
She's now ordering books from Amazon! Might check that out, too. Are
you
books on there? I know some of mine are, but lots of their details
about
them need to be cleaned up.
So much to do: revise a long interview I
once did with R duncan that
was
supposed to have appeared in a book years ago; ms. for CELEBRITIES a
book of
poems that needs lots of revisions, work; onwards with 1970's book;
occasional
sex with friend Larry; helping Paul with the dictionary; and
going
back to long o.p. books to see if there aren't poems in there, now
totally
lost, I can send around to mags for a second life.
For now
Bob P.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 19:30:52 -0500
Reply-To: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: bill
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
bill.
by
david rhaesa
6-9-97
eyes
sparkle golden
reflection
of k-mart
blue
light special headbands...
eyes
glow
simple
awareness
of
Godot's own old gardener....
several
times
sees
my
twisting synapse
or
gesture
and
unties
knots
left
tangled
since
preschool days....
this
film to be shot in a bridge scene at sunday overlooking strawberry
fields.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 22:21:26 -0700
Reply-To: Diane Carter <dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Diane Carter
<dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Subject: Re: Eliot & Ginsberg
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Pamela
Beach Plymell wrote:
>
>
The only problem I have with Ginsy's didactict of pissing is that he
>would
wait for pissing to become a trend.
Can you
elaborate further on what you see as his "trendiness" as opposed
to his
"originality?"
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 19:59:32 -0700
Reply-To: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Edie Parker
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
June 9, 1997
Patricia
Elliott wrote:
>Gerald,
do you know if Edie K-Parkers autobiography got published?
>nice
to hear your voice on the list.
>patricia
>
Dear
Patricia:
No, Edie's book has not been
published. Edie appointed a friend of
hers
named Tim Moran her literary executor, and he was given ownership of
all her
manuscripts and extensive Beat archives.
Tim was a tall, quiet guy
who
used to accompany Edie at all the Beat gatherings. I have not heard
from
him since the 1994 Beat symposium at NYU, and I have wondered myself
what he
plans to do with Edie's things.
I did hear that Creative Arts in
Berkeley plans to publish Joan
Haverty's
memoir, NOBODY'S WIFE. So it would seem the time is ripe for
Edie's
book too. Poor Edie always felt left
out, and it would be a final
irony
if her book has to wait till every other memoir is published
first--and
here she was, the first wife and also the one Jack called his
"life's
wife." As you may know, in
September, 1969, when Jack went to see
his
lawyer Fred Bryson about divorcing Stella, he wrote to Edie a couple of
times
to come down to Florida and join him and to "hash out whatever future
they
might still have together" (paraphrase).
But then Jack got beaten up
in the
black Cactus bar in St. Pete, got his ribs busted and lots of
internal
bleeding (which may have hastened his death), and he wrote her back
not to
come down as planned.
Then, on October 21, any chance of
Jack and Edie getting back
together
was killed permanently. Instead of
meeting him in Florida, Edie
saw him
laid out at Archembault Funeral Home in Lowell, where she brought
him a
funeral bouquet that read (at least as she remembered it to me): "Beat
the
Heat." Supposedly Ginsberg sent
one that said: "Guard the Heart."
Best, Gerry Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 20:16:42 -0700
Reply-To: stauffer@pacbell.net
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: James Stauffer
<stauffer@PACBELL.NET>
Subject: Re: Ray Bremser
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Pamela
Beach Plymell wrote
. . .
Everyday we hit drugstores when Turpin Hydrate
>
Codiene. was legal. I paid for the daily trip. He scored at two or three drug
>
stores. We split the drink and drove home. That lasted about two or three
>
years, so I guess the expense was about a thou. Too bad that still isn't on
>
the market. Sure helped us old timers not get the grip. They say it (Laudnum,
>
about the same) was advised by Coleridge's chemist. It is surely needed for
>
the long winters (and summers). Now the Pharmaceutical cartel can't let
>
anything that simple and inexpensive be on the market for the masses. They
>
would rather have them take something that will eventually lead to other
>
problems that they can realize more profits from. Simple low maintenance
>
addiction is not lucrative enought for the Industry. They prefer transplants,
>
hookups to oxygen, etc. for those with insurance.
Charles,
Thanks
for the memory. I'd forgotten Turpin
Hydrate. We could get it
still
in Washington State until sometime in the early 70's as I recall.
A
favorite of hipper loggers, treeplanters, fisherman and other
undesirables. Now you can't even get codienettas over the
counter in
TJ. Can get Valium relatives tho. There is something wrong in the
world
when simple, inexpensive low level opiates are that unavailable.
Makes
the world safe for the smack cartels and the medico's I guess.
J
Stauffer
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 23:16:09 -0400
Reply-To: CVEditions@AOL.COM
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Pamela Beach Plymell
<CVEditions@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Beat generation.
Rinaldo,
Maybe
he sensed that the center is always the edge that is. Nufzentonite?
C.
Plymell
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 22:28:50 -0500
Reply-To: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: RACE --- <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Subject: Re: Eliot & Ginsberg
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Diane
Carter wrote:
>
>
Pamela Beach Plymell wrote:
>
>
>
> The only problem I have with Ginsy's didactict of pissing is that he
>
>would wait for pissing to become a trend.
>
>
Can you elaborate further on what you see as his "trendiness" as
opposed
> to
his "originality?"
not
certain who has claim to originality of human elimination processes.
elimination
seems a Constant. don't quite fathom
notion of trendyness
either.
david
rhaesa
salina,
Kansas
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 22:30:00 -0500
Reply-To: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Subject: Re: Edie Parker
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Gerald
Nicosia wrote:
>
> June 9, 1997
>
Patricia Elliott wrote:
>
>Gerald, do you know if Edie K-Parkers autobiography got published?
>
>nice to hear your voice on the list.
> >patricia
>
>
>
Dear Patricia:
> No, Edie's book has not been
published. Edie appointed a friend of
>
hers named Tim Moran her literary executor, and he was given ownership of
>
all her manuscripts and extensive Beat archives. Tim was a tall, quiet guy
>
who used to accompany Edie at all the Beat gatherings. I have not heard
>
from him since the 1994 Beat symposium at NYU, and I have wondered myself
>
what he plans to do with Edie's things.
> I did hear that Creative Arts in Berkeley
plans to publish Joan
>
Haverty's memoir, NOBODY'S WIFE. So it would seem the time is ripe for
>
Edie's book too. Poor Edie always felt
left out, and it would be a final
>
irony if her book has to wait till every other memoir is published
>
first--and here she was, the first wife and also the one Jack called his
>
"life's wife." As you may
know, in September, 1969, when Jack went to see
>
his lawyer Fred Bryson about divorcing Stella, he wrote to Edie a couple of
>
times to come down to Florida and join him and to "hash out whatever
future
>
they might still have together" (paraphrase). But then Jack got beaten up
> in
the black Cactus bar in St. Pete, got his ribs busted and lots of
>
internal bleeding (which may have hastened his death), and he wrote her back
>
not to come down as planned.
> Then, on October 21, any chance of
Jack and Edie getting back
>
together was killed permanently.
Instead of meeting him in Florida, Edie
>
saw him laid out at Archembault Funeral Home in Lowell, where she brought
>
him a funeral bouquet that read (at least as she remembered it to me):
"Beat
>
the Heat." Supposedly Ginsberg
sent one that said: "Guard the Heart."
> Best, Gerry Nicosia
o thank
you for your post. I met Edie and liked
her, she was a natural
person. I agree with the impression that she was his
true wife. I hope
the
biography comes out. She told me some
unique stories from a
perspective
that was not literary but gripping and passionate. I
noticed
that the burroughs contingent were inclusive to her which is
part of
the dignity and elegance that comes from those folks. I would
like to
say that your writing means a lot to me and i am i have to say
thrilled
to be able to actually communicate with you on some of the
subjects
that are of such great interest to me.
patricia
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 00:31:21 -0700
Reply-To: Diane Carter <dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Diane Carter
<dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Subject: Re: Eliot & Ginsberg
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
RACE
--- wrote:
>
>
Diane Carter wrote:
>
>
>
> Pamela Beach Plymell wrote:
>
> >
>
> > The only problem I have with Ginsy's didactict of pissing is that he
>
> >would wait for pissing to become a trend.
>
>
>
> Can you elaborate further on what you see as his "trendiness" as
opposed
>
> to his "originality?"
>
>
not certain who has claim to originality of human elimination processes.
>
elimination seems a Constant. don't
quite fathom notion of trendyness
>
either.
>
>
david rhaesa
>
salina, Kansas
Actually,
don't you see human elmination processes, I would rather say
excrement,
real or in the mind, as being the constant in the writing
process
that binds together the consciousness of all writers from the
beginning
of time to now?
DC
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 00:59:39 -0700
Reply-To: Diane Carter <dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Diane Carter <dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Subject: Re: Excrement & the writing process
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
RACE
--- wrote:
>
>
Diane Carter wrote:
>
>
>>
Actually, don't you see humann elmination processes, I would rather
>>say
>
> excrement, real or in the mind, as being the constant in the writing
>
> process that binds together the consciousness of all writers from the
>
> beginning of time to now?
>
> DC
>
>
not just writers.
> it
is the great equalizer that the Pope and you and Mother Theresa and I
>
all share.
>
>
david rhaesa
>
salina, Kansas
Nice to
know we all have something in common in addition to our
craving
for beat literature. Everytime I think
of excrement in a way
connected
to literature, I think of James Joyce, no disrespect intended,
just
sort of the flow of thought/dream comes to mind. Bodily functions
and the
process of writing. Union of physical
body and intellect being
necessary
in the creative process. I'm sure we
can somehow relate this
back to
beat writers. Any thoughts on excrement
and Kerouac?
DC
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 02:29:06 -0400
Reply-To: Leitha Sackmann
<lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leitha Sackmann
<lsackma@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Edie Parker
Comments:
To: Patricia Elliott <pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
MIME-version:
1.0
Content-type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At
10:30 PM 6/9/97 -0500, Patricia Elliott wrote:
>Gerald
Nicosia wrote:
>>
>> June 9, 1997
>>
Patricia Elliott wrote:
>>
>Gerald, do you know if Edie K-Parkers autobiography got published?
>>
>nice to hear your voice on the list.
>>
>patricia
>>
>
>>
Dear Patricia:
>> No, Edie's book has not been
published. Edie appointed a friend of
>>
hers named Tim Moran her literary executor, and he was given ownership of
>>
all her manuscripts and extensive Beat archives. Tim was a tall, quiet guy
>>
who used to accompany Edie at all the Beat gatherings. I have not heard
>>
from him since the 1994 Beat symposium at NYU, and I have wondered myself
>>
what he plans to do with Edie's things.
>> I did hear that Creative Arts in
Berkeley plans to publish Joan
>>
Haverty's memoir, NOBODY'S WIFE. So it would seem the time is ripe for
>>
Edie's book too. Poor Edie always felt
left out, and it would be a final
>>
irony if her book has to wait till every other memoir is published
>>
first--and here she was, the first wife and also the one Jack called his
>>
"life's wife." As you may
know, in September, 1969, when Jack went to see
>>
his lawyer Fred Bryson about divorcing Stella, he wrote to Edie a couple of
>>
times to come down to Florida and join him and to "hash out whatever
future
>>
they might still have together" (paraphrase). But then Jack got beaten up
>>
in the black Cactus bar in St. Pete, got his ribs busted and lots of
>>
internal bleeding (which may have hastened his death), and he wrote her back
>>
not to come down as planned.
>> Then, on October 21, any chance of
Jack and Edie getting back
>>
together was killed permanently.
Instead of meeting him in Florida, Edie
>>
saw him laid out at Archembault Funeral Home in Lowell, where she brought
>>
him a funeral bouquet that read (at least as she remembered it to me):
"Beat
>>
the Heat." Supposedly Ginsberg
sent one that said: "Guard the Heart."
>> Best, Gerry Nicosia
>o
thank you for your post. I met Edie and
liked her, she was a natural
>person. I agree with the impression that she was his
true wife. I hope
>the
biography comes out. She told me some
unique stories from a
>perspective
that was not literary but gripping and passionate. I
>noticed
that the burroughs contingent were inclusive to her which is
>part
of the dignity and elegance that comes from those folks. I would
>like
to say that your writing means a lot to me and i am i have to say
>thrilled
to be able to actually communicate with you on some of the
>subjects
that are of such great interest to me.
>patricia
Yeah,
Edie seems to me to as one of the coolest gals that ole jack got
involved
with. I love Jack's description of her
in a letter to neal when he
tells
Neal something to the effect of:
"You need someone like Edie,
giggling under the covers in the morning."
She
just sounds real cute and fun and sweet from what I've read about her.
I too
am waiting for her book.
matt
*****************************************************************
"Everyone
takes the limits of his own vision
for the limits of the world."
Arthur Schopenhauer
*****************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 13:45:07 +0200
Reply-To: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Subject: GHETTO DEFENDANT (the Clash)
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
DEAR
friends,
i found
likes:
"One
night at the Bond's shows on Broadway,
Allen
Ginseberg got up on stage and started
to
recite something, and the band came up
with an
impromptu musical backing to it. I
think
that he may have done it with them a
couple
of nights later as well... When we
were
recording Combat Rock, Ginsberg came
down to
the studio with Pete Orlofsky (sp?).
He
wanted to get the Clash to back him on a
record
he was going to make, but ended up on
our
record instead... Some people have said
he was Joe's
lyric coach on that record, but
I think
that's a bit overplayed."---KOSMO VINYL
---
yrs
Rinaldo.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 00:53:58 -0700
Reply-To: "Lisa M. Rabey"
<lisar@NET-LINK.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Lisa M. Rabey"
<lisar@NET-LINK.NET>
Subject: Re: So, I got up this morning and...
In-Reply-To: <339ACC15.4C3462D@scsn.net>
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
hmmm....
simple.
the
list that i sent out a few days ago about what to do when waiting for
the
beat-l mail to download?
Add
that to real life.
I've
been yaking on the phone to various bukowski enthusists as well as
bopping
around san francisco.
does
the hotel "The Utah" ring any bells to any beat enthusiests out
there?
ttfn.
lisa
--
Lisa M. Rabey Computer Consultant UIN: 1231211
************************************************************
words...1000's of words.. wrapped
together like wire
how easy it would be to
hate you
and yet that is all i can
show you -me
http://the.art.of.sekurity.org/simunye
mirror->
http://www.interlog.com/~lisa
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 19:31:58 +0200
Reply-To: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Subject: Ann Charters
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
DEAR
friends,
is here
Ann Charters on the B-List? i'm reading his
introduction
to JK "On The Road" (ya, re-re-re-reading summer...),
btw if
also are here some Beat Brit (living in London)
can say
me hello?
love,
peace & freelin'life,
yrs
Rinaldo
from venice,italy.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 15:05:57 -0500
Reply-To: Ron Guest
<rguest@SUNSET.BACKBONE.OLEMISS.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Ron Guest <rguest@SUNSET.BACKBONE.OLEMISS.EDU>
Subject: Gary Snyder
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I'm not
familiar with Gary Snyder's work but I am constantly seeing
references
to him when I read about other beats.
It is the usual, his
influence
on Kerouac and Ginsburg, being one of the original beats at the
Six
Gallery reading, THE Dharma Bum etc. and I was wondering why I rarely
ever
see a post about him. Seems that he
should be mentioned along with
Kerouac,
Ginsberg and Burroughs. Did he somehow distance himself from the
other
beats?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 17:04:56 -0400
Reply-To: Ted Harms
<tmharms@LIBRARY.UWATERLOO.CA>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Ted Harms
<tmharms@LIBRARY.UWATERLOO.CA>
Subject: Re: Gary Snyder
In-Reply-To:
<1.5.4.32.19970610200557.00675a28@sunset.backbone.olemiss.edu>
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Tue,
10 Jun 1997, Ron Guest wrote:
>
I'm not familiar with Gary Snyder's work but I am constantly seeing
>
references to him when I read about other beats...I was wondering why I
>
rarely ever see a post about him. Seems
that he should be mentioned
>
along with Kerouac, Ginsberg and Burroughs. Did he somehow distance
>
himself from the other beats?
Well, I
think Gary is kinda an uber-beat in that he was an inspiration and
an
observer but not an active, regular participant. Sure, "Japhy" plays a
pretty
big part in _The Dharma Bums_, but I think his own interests in
Japan
in general and Zen in particular, kept him on the periphery of the
'Beat'
scene.
I think
much of this has to do with Snyder himself.
It would be very easy
for him
to loudly proclaim his Beat-ness but he's quietly gone about his
excellent
poetry (won the Pulitzer for _Turtle Island_ and _Mountains and
Rivers
Without End_ got great reviews everywhere) and teaching (does
anybody
know if he is still on staff at Univ. Cal. at Davis and what
courses
does/did he teach?).
Yeah, I
wish there'd be more Snyder-talk; there are fans of his on the
list,
but I think we're a little more on the quiet side...;)
Ted
Harms Library,
Univ. of Waterloo
tmharms@library.uwaterloo.ca 519.888.4567 x3761
"...it's
elephants all the way down." - from Hindu cosmology
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 14:28:59 -0400
Reply-To: MATT HANNAN
<MATT.HANNAN@OTC.USOC.CCHUB.COM>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: MATT HANNAN
<MATT.HANNAN@OTC.USOC.CCHUB.COM>
Subject: Re: Gary Snyder
Comments:
To: Ron Guest <rguest@SUNSET.BACKBONE.OLEMISS.EDU>
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
I saw Snyder here in Colorado recently so
he's certainly still doing
the lecture circuit. It was an SRO crowd, we teeming masses well
overflowed the too small lecture hall he
was given. He's very much
continuing his ecology-bent poetry as
well as speaking on his
eco-political stance (basing political
boundaries on watersheds vs
other means). I believe he has a new work out (not sure).
Snyder's poetry was an influence on my
leaving the military (much to
do with Right Occupation/Action). Now I live in the shadow of "NORADs
Rapture Mountain" to quote Ginsberg,
trying to fight/right a lot of
negative Karma.
Back to your point, he didn't speak at
all on the Beats, but then
again he only delved into his own past as
deep as the 1970s (Turtle
Island is base Snyder, a definite first
read). You're right though,
he is as much a Beat individual as an
influence on them. I'm not up
on him personally, maybe someone else on
the list, PROBABLY someone
else on the list, is much more
knowledgeable than I.
Matt Hannan
______________________________
Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject:
Gary Snyder
Author: Ron Guest
<rguest@SUNSET.BACKBONE.OLEMISS.EDU> at Internet
Date: 6/10/97 3:05 PM
I'm not
familiar with Gary Snyder's work but I am constantly seeing
references
to him when I read about other beats.
It is the usual, his
influence
on Kerouac and Ginsburg, being one of the original beats at the
Six
Gallery reading, THE Dharma Bum etc. and I was wondering why I rarely
ever
see a post about him. Seems that he
should be mentioned along with
Kerouac,
Ginsberg and Burroughs. Did he somehow distance himself from the
other
beats?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 14:15:50 -0700
Reply-To: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Gerald Nicosia
<gnicosia@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: So, I got up this morning and...
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At
12:53 AM 6/10/97 -0700, you wrote:
>hmmm....
simple.
>the
list that i sent out a few days ago about what to do when waiting for
>the
beat-l mail to download?
>Add
that to real life.
>
>I've
been yaking on the phone to various bukowski enthusists as well as
>bopping
around san francisco.
>
>does
the hotel "The Utah" ring any bells to any beat enthusiests out
there?
>
>ttfn.
>
>lisa
>--
>
> Lisa M. Rabey Computer Consultant UIN: 1231211
>
************************************************************
> words...1000's of words.. wrapped
together like wire
> how easy it would be to
hate you
> and yet that is all i can show
you -me
>
>http://the.art.of.sekurity.org/simunye
> mirror->
http://www.interlog.com/~lisa
>
Lisa, June 10, 1997
Jack Micheline used to hang around the
Utah, other Beat characters
too. Seems there was some new wave music there
too a few years ago.
While you're in San Francisco, bop up
to the North Beach fair on
Grant
Avenue on Saturday. I'll be doing a
tribute to Jan Kerouac at the
bandstand,
upper Grant at Filbert, around 3 PM.
Introduce yourself!
Best, Gerry Nicosia
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 23:19:00 +0200
Reply-To: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Subject: Re: Beat generation.
In-Reply-To:
<970609231546_-194754051@emout16.mail.aol.com>
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
C.
Plymell writes:
>Rinaldo,
>Maybe
he sensed that the center is always the edge that is. Nufzentonite?
>C.
Plymell
>
>
DEAR C.
Plymell & other friends,
not
only JK had difficulties to embracing the BEAT,
but
even GREGORY CORSO & others. so the focus of BEAT is fading,
in the
charter JK AG & WSB are only a banner, & works 'bout
modern
artists american/european et coetera, i hope became more
beat-spotting
than usually. for example the past estate battle
was (if
i'm wrong beat me as a beetle!) concerning the true manuscript
of
"On The Road" & that seem hidden in some place in the UsOfAm,
the
book we enjoy are snipped from a longest book written by
many
hands & Jack became the "focus" of this experience, & when he
was 47
he don't care anymore, i'm sure if JK disagree with BEAT
there's
no dimishing of the past BUT a sort of emphasis of a
collective
works maked in lost years,
love
& happiness,
yrs
Rinaldo.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 18:06:10 -0400
Reply-To: "Robert H. Sapp"
<rhs4@CRYSTAL.PALACE.NET>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Robert H. Sapp"
<rhs4@CRYSTAL.PALACE.NET>
Subject: Re: Excrement & the writing process
Comments:
To: Diane Carter <dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
In-Reply-To: <339D096B.71D9@together.net>
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
when i
first read, seems so long ago mentally, the section of the
beginning
of Visions of Cody, where Jack discusses the drawbacks of
beating
off sittong on a toilet seat, i thought "whooly shit, you can
write
that in a novel?!"
just
kickin
the shit,
Eric
On Tue,
10 Jun 1997, Diane Carter wrote:
>
RACE --- wrote:
>
>
>
> Diane Carter wrote:
>
> >
>
>> Actually, don't you see humann elmination processes, I would rather
>
>>say
>
> > excrement, real or in the mind, as being the constant in the writing
nn>
> > process that binds together the consciousness of all writers from the
>
> > beginning of time to now?