=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 20:43:52 EST
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From: Surubu1 <Surubu1@AOL.COM>
Organization:
AOL (http://www.aol.com)
Subject: Looking for info. on Jack Kerouac School
for Disenchanted Poetics
@ Naropa
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Hello.
I am
looking at graduate schools and am very interested in finding out more
about
the creative writing department at Naropa in Boulder, CO. I have some
information
about it, but would like to know some inside scoop from anyone who
has
attended, visited, etc. etc.
Thanks
for any info..
Sundee
Bumgarner
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:01:26 +0000
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: Re: more beats on jeopardy!
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wsb.
hope i
won the the $$$$
mc
Jeff
Taylor wrote:
>
another beat question on jeopardy! today....
>
Category: "Author's odd jobs"...."He was a bartender,
> private
detective, and exterminator before he wrote Naked Lunch"
>
they got it right, fortunately
>
>
*******
>
Jeff Taylor
>
taylorjb@ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu
>
*******
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:02:20 +0000
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: Re: more beats on jeopardy!
MIME-Version:
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whoops.
misread.
mc
Jeff
Taylor wrote:
>
another beat question on jeopardy! today....
>
Category: "Author's odd jobs"...."He was a bartender,
>
private detective, and exterminator before he wrote Naked Lunch"
>
they got it right, fortunately
>
>
*******
>
Jeff Taylor
>
taylorjb@ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu
>
*******
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 19:20:15 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: "Derek A. Beaulieu"
<dabeauli@FREENET.CALGARY.AB.CA>
Organization:
Calgary Community Network Assoc.
Subject: Re: WSB, Wild Boys, Word=Virus
In-Reply-To: <34CF774A.1375@iclub.org>
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On Wed,
28 Jan 1998, Jeffrey Scott Holland wrote:
>
=== Which is why I am extremely disappointed that WSB never took the
>
next step into totally opaque communication, a la Joyce's "Finnegan's
>
Wake".
do you
reall ythink that FW is "opaque" or is actually an extremely
tightly
written narrative (try reading it aloud - esp the "shem the
penman"
and "anna livia" chapters and suddenly the jokes and accents that
jj used
are readily apparent (in my opinion) - this is word play at its
best -
multilingual puns, phonetic pronunciation of a dialect and accent
and
scholarly deconstruction of language and communication - all placed
with a
typically "small" (eg: ulysses" takes place all within one day
one
city)
narrative.
yrs
derek
(a small joyce fan ... )
ps:
does anyone know the listserv addresses for the joyce listserv as
well as
the Finnegans wake listserv? sure would like the addresses...
thanks
d
******************************************************************
Derek
Beaulieu
House
Press (limited ed. chapbooks, prints, etc)
#502-728
3rd Ave NW
Calgary,
Alberta, Canada, T2N 0J1
ph.
(403)270-4440, fax. 270-9357
"remove
literary, grammatical & syntactical inhibition" -Jack Kerouac
******************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:58:33 -0600
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
Subject: uh ahem
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notice,
unbeat request. i have returned to
university after oh, twenty
years, one of my courses is a creative writing
course. i haven't
every written short stories before and would like
any critique and
assistance
any one is willing to offer. I have two
pages of a set up,
due in
next Monday. So if any one is willing, let me know by back
channel
and i will send you the peice. It is a
set of a long story that
i have
been thinking about. Oh is i could just think of a cool beat
angle
to make this legitamate post.
so pardon
patricia
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 23:13:01 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Nancy B Brodsky
<nbb203@IS8.NYU.EDU>
Subject: Re: critical essays
In-Reply-To:
<19980129011636.3829.qmail@hotmail.com>
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Kimberly-
The
only one Im familiar with is something called "Kerouac's Crooked
Road",
written by Tim Hunt, I believe.
On Wed,
28 Jan 1998, Kimberly Yang wrote:
> Hi
Everyone.
>
>
I'm writing an essay about Kerouac and his novels. Do anyone know where
> I
can find critical essays about his work?
Thanks a lot!
>
>
Kim
>
>
______________________________________________________
>
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>
The
Absence of Sound, Clear and Pure, The Silence Now Heard In Heaven For
Sure-JK
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:27:15 -0600
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: jo grant <jgrant@BOOKZEN.COM>
Subject: Re: uh ahem
In-Reply-To: <34CFFE69.14A0@sunflower.com>
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P,
First
thing in the a.m. I'll see if I can locate a slim little pamphlet
Meridel
LeSueur put together many years ago. She used one of her short
stories.
Took it apaert and explained exactly what she was doing.
Described,
in detail, the parts of the story. The pamphlet was used by
workers,
out-of-workers, schools, universities, etc. as a teaching tool.
I'll
bet Charlie Plymell knows about it.
West
End Press usually has copies but I think they are back orderedd. If I
can
find my copuy I'll make you a copy and you can send John Crawfordf at
Wst End
a buck.
I envy
you back in school and wait for my class to start in February.
I can
barely see the screen. Tired and a little blasted after a big dinner
and
more work than I like.
Later.
j grant
>notice,
unbeat request. i have returned to university
after oh, twenty
>years, one of my courses is a creative writing
course. i haven't
>every written short stories before and would like
any critique and
>assistance
any one is willing to offer. I have two
pages of a set up,
>due
in next Monday. So if any one is willing, let me know by back
>channel
and i will send you the peice. It is a
set of a long story that
>i
have been thinking about. Oh is i could just think of a cool beat
>angle
to make this legitamate post.
>so
pardon
>patricia
HELP RECOVER THE MEMORY
BABE ARCHIVES
Details on-line at
http://www.bookzen.com
625,506 Visitors 07-01-96 to 11-28-97
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:35:00 -0600
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Patricia Elliott
<pelliott@SUNFLOWER.COM>
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jo
grant wrote:
> Jo
thanks. I appreciate hearing from you.
I wish i had keep some strange
pamplet i had once about dialogue. I will also go to my trusty library ( did i
ever tell you that my husband is cataloguer
at the ku library) I am very
nervous about enroling , i flunked out 20
years ago due to great bridge, dope
and sex, also at that time poor acedemic
skills. so here i am a young 49 year
old sophmore.
patricia
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:37:14 -0600
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: jo grant <jgrant@BOOKZEN.COM>
Subject: Re: Beat-Bob (was Re: backbeat)
In-Reply-To: <34CEE077.48F4@midusa.net>
Mime-Version:
1.0
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>i
must admit even more than my usual ignorance about this intriguing
>poet.
>can
anyone out there provide background/biographical insights and/or URL
>locations
to learn about this Beat-Bob?
>
>thanks
in advance,
>dbr
David,
Couple
of books with very little comment at:
http://www.bookzen.com/kkk.html
I
should add mare material, but you know how that goes. Nicosia edited
Cranial
Guitar. Was praised high and low for his work getting the material
together.
I'll check with him about the possibilkity of E-mailing whatever
he has.
Coffee
House Press sent me a pre pub copy. A great book. Excellent reviews
across
the board.
Argh.
Have to turn in.
Peace,
j grant
HELP RECOVER THE MEMORY
BABE ARCHIVES
Details on-line at
http://www.bookzen.com
625,506 Visitors 07-01-96 to 11-28-97
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:45:42 +0300
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa <race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Town & the City (was Re: critical
essays)
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Kimberly
Yang wrote:
>
> Hi
Everyone.
>
>
I'm writing an essay about Kerouac and his novels. Do anyone know where
> I
can find critical essays about his work?
Thanks a lot!
>
>
Kim
>
>
______________________________________________________
>
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
i was
very interested (but must admit to not following through) with the
citations
listed recently about Kerouac and Catholicism by Bill Gargan.
perhaps
one area for threads is to share bibliographical information of
critical
treatments. certainly some on the list
are not interested in
the
critical scholarship side of the beat generation - but it seems a
valid
avenue for development for those on the list with the more
scholarly
angle.
and the
collective power of the listmembers in creating bibliographical
listings
is probably pretty impressive.
one of
my Xmas gifts was Kerouac's first novel (that i've not yet
cracked)
The Town and the City. as a test of my
theories above, what
critical
reviews, book reviews, references in other writings and in
various
biographies can people share.
quotations
are not necessary - just normal bibliographical information
and in
information extracted from longer works page numbers would be
nice.
thanks
in advance,
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:39:23 +0300
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: uh ahem
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1.0
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Patricia
Elliott wrote:
>
> jo
grant wrote:
>
> Jo thanks. I appreciate hearing from you.
I wish i had keep some strange
> pamplet i had once about dialogue. I will also go to my trusty library ( did
i
> ever tell you that my husband is cataloguer
at the ku library) I am very
> nervous about enroling , i flunked out 20
years ago due to great bridge, dope
> and sex, also at that time poor acedemic
skills. so here i am a young 49 year
> old sophmore.
>
patricia
most of
my best students were in their forties.
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:43:17 +0300
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Beat-Bob (was Re: backbeat)
MIME-Version:
1.0
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text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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jo
grant wrote:
>
>
>i must admit even more than my usual ignorance about this intriguing
>
>poet.
>
>can anyone out there provide background/biographical insights and/or URL
>
>locations to learn about this Beat-Bob?
>
>
>
>thanks in advance,
>
>dbr
>
>
David,
>
>
Couple of books with very little comment at:
>
http://www.bookzen.com/kkk.html
>
> I
should add mare material, but you know how that goes. Nicosia edited
>
Cranial Guitar. Was praised high and low for his work getting the material
>
together. I'll check with him about the possibilkity of E-mailing whatever
> he
has.
>
>
Coffee House Press sent me a pre pub copy. A great book. Excellent reviews
>
across the board.
>
>
Argh. Have to turn in.
>
>
Peace,
>
> j
grant
>
> HELP RECOVER THE MEMORY
BABE ARCHIVES
> Details on-line at
>
http://www.bookzen.com
> 625,506 Visitors 07-01-96 to 11-28-97
don't
put too much effort into it. i really
have a lot on my plate
right
now. i need to try and focus in even
more on my writing right now
i
think.
i'm due
for another Zyprexa Blues tomorrow night.
I wonder how it will
come
out?
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 07:22:42 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Edward Desautels
<edesaute@BBNPLANET.COM>
Subject: Re: WSB, Wild Boys, Word=Virus
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
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I would
question the assertion regarding the "...totally opaque communication, a
la Joyce's "Finnegan's Wake." Hence
Burroughs' admitted resignation in the face
of a failed life-long attempt to break the
lines of association on which the
word-virus feeds. Communication based on
language will never be "totally
opaque," even when intensely stylized or
personalized. As Robbe-Grillet
observed in _For a New Novel_, form _is_
content.
Ed
At
07:22 PM 1/28/98 +0100, you wrote:
>On
Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Jeff Taylor wrote:
>>
>>
> When WSB attempts to cut the control lines by getting beyond words, he
>>
> must, qua writer, still use words.
>
>===
Which is why I am extremely disappointed that WSB never took the
>next
step into totally opaque communication, a la Joyce's "Finnegan's
>Wake".
>
>
>
>>
Burroughs was not writing *about* the end of language, he was writing to
>>
*bring about* the end of language. He recognized the impasse this brought
>>
about (Skerl notes this, from correspondance with wsb), and succumbed to
>>
it in his return to narrative in The Wild Boys.
>
>===
But the Wild Boys have their own language; so Burroughs is at least
>writing
about *sidestepping* conventional language.
>
>
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>Jeffrey
Scott Holland
>somewhere
in the wilderness of Kentucky
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
<center>************************************************************
Edward
Desautels
7
Hamilton Road
Somerville,
MA 02144
edesaute@bbnplanet.com
http://www.shore.net/~debra/ed/homepage.html
<smaller>"One
day I found my shirt lying across my knees,
I
called it Beauty. Since thenI've been a painter of shirts."
Jacques
Rigaut
</smaller>************************************************************</center>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 07:23:55 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Edward Desautels
<edesaute@BBNPLANET.COM>
Subject: Re: more beats on jeopardy!
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/enriched; charset="us-ascii"
Jeopardy
is a virus from outer space.
Ed
At
06:21 PM 1/28/98 -0600, you wrote:
>another
beat question on jeopardy! today....
>Category:
"Author's odd jobs"...."He was a bartender,
>private
detective, and exterminator before he wrote Naked Lunch"
>they
got it right, fortunately
>
>*******
>Jeff
Taylor
>taylorjb@ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu
>*******
>
<center>************************************************************
Edward
Desautels
7
Hamilton Road
Somerville,
MA 02144
edesaute@bbnplanet.com
http://www.shore.net/~debra/ed/homepage.html
<smaller>"One
day I found my shirt lying across my knees,
I called
it Beauty. Since thenI've been a painter of shirts."
Jacques
Rigaut
</smaller>************************************************************</center>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:51:47 -0400
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Preston Whaley
<paw8670@MAILER.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: critical essays
Mime-Version:
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Content-Type:
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The
Spontaneous Poetics of Jack Kerouac by Regina Weinreich which is a
book-length
treatment of the entire Duluoz Legend.
Also, William Lhamon's
Deliberate
Speed contains helpful criticism on Kerouac's OTR and Visions of
Cody
-- personally, I think this is fine
work. And finally Michael
Davidson's
The
San
Francisco Renaissance weaves Kerouac and other Beats into that larger
scene
there.
Hope
this helps,
Preston
>Kimberly-
>The
only one Im familiar with is something called "Kerouac's Crooked
>Road",
written by Tim Hunt, I believe.
>On
Wed, 28 Jan 1998, Kimberly Yang wrote:
>
>>
Hi Everyone.
>>
>>
I'm writing an essay about Kerouac and his novels. Do anyone know where
>>
I can find critical essays about his work?
Thanks a lot!
>>
>>
Kim
>>
>>
______________________________________________________
>>
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>>
>
>The
Absence of Sound, Clear and Pure, The Silence Now Heard In Heaven For
>Sure-JK
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 07:43:13 -0600
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jym Mooney <jymmoon@EXECPC.COM>
Subject: Re: critical essays
MIME-Version:
1.0
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Kim
wrote:
>
> Hi Everyone.
>
>
>
> I'm writing an essay about Kerouac and his novels. Do anyone know
where
>
> I can find critical essays about his work? Thanks a lot!
>
>
>
> Kim
There's
a book called "The Spontaneous Poetics of Jack Kerouac" by Regina
Weinreich. Also "Passionate Opinions" and
"Representative Men" by John
Clellon
Holmes have several fascinating essays on Kerouac and his work
(among
others) by Jack's old friend Holmes.
For
more possibilities see the bibliography at the end of "The Portable
Beat
Reader" edited by Ann Charters.
Good
luck!
Jym
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 07:37:27 -0700
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: CARL PORTER <CPORTER@WEBER.EDU>
Subject: critical essays -Reply
Comments:
To: kjyang@HOTMAIL.COM
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain
Try The
Beat Generation Writers edited by A. Robert Lee. It includes the
critical
essay "I'm only a jolly storyteller: Jack Kerouac's On the Road and
Visions
of Cody"
carl
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 09:48:50 +0000
Reply-To: jhasbro@tezcat.com
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: John Hasbrouck
<jhasbro@TEZCAT.COM>
Subject: Re: Where's the beef? (was: Re: beat
weekend)
Comments:
To: Edward Desautels <edesaute@BBNPLANET.COM>
MIME-Version:
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Dear
Mr. Desautels,
Thank
you for posting your essay _Appropriation and Transmogrification_
on the
Beat List-serv. I have read it with profit.
I am
reminded that I never really appreciated the narrative tone of
JUNKY
until I read in THE MAMMOTH BOOK OF PULP FICTION, which contains
lots a
detective stories from the 20s, 30s and 40s. JUNKY, of course,
was
written very early in Burroughs' career. I understand that, at the
time of
writing JUNKY, Burroughs' deliberate appropriation of the
hard-balled
detective style was for very practical reasons - he needed
money
and sought to sell a product to a specific market. This is borne
out in
various biographical works and in comments by Burroughs' himself.
At some
point, however, between JUNKY and EXTERMINATOR, Burroughs'
methods
of appropriation appear to have become a conscious stylistic
device
whereby he upped the ante, so to speak, in his writing. That is,
he
began attempting to communicate a (for lack of a better word)
_message_,
be it moral, political or philosophical. It would be
difficult
to argue that there is a _message_ in JUNKY beyond its
entertainment
value.
Am I on
the right track here?
Again,
thanks,
John
Hasbrouck
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:14:27 +0100
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Re: WSB, Wild Boys, Word=Virus
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
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Derek
A. Beaulieu wrote:
> do
you reall ythink that FW is "opaque" or is actually an extremely
>
tightly written narrative (try reading it aloud - esp the "shem the
>
penman" and "anna livia" chapters and suddenly the jokes and accents
that
> jj
used are readily apparent (in my opinion) - this is word play at its
>
best - multilingual puns, phonetic pronunciation of a dialect and accent
>
and scholarly deconstruction of language and communication.
And
Edward Desautels also wrote:
> I
would question the assertion regarding the "...totally opaque
>
communication, a la Joyce's "Finnegan's Wake."
=== I
didn't mean that it was opaque to the people actively taking part
in the
communication, of course; then it wouldn't be much of a
communication.
No, I meant FW is opaque to those who
don't speak the secret code,
which
would be most everyday citizens. FW is a rorschach test for the
intelligentsia,
a sort of encoded trivia quiz. To the average reader who
does
not understand the method of the writing, nor the literary,
geographical,
historical and biblical references and allusions, and who
does
not know how to break words down to their Latin roots, FW is a work
written
in secret code that they can never crack without the codex of
education.
I tried to read FW as a child, after
hearing of John Lennon's 1965-1966
books
of prose being compared to Joyce. As a child, I thought the book
was
fantastic, but more as a surrealist object - I was certain that it
was
nothing more than stream-of-consciousness gobbledygook with only an
occasional
snatch of punny broken English floating to the surface. Now
of
course, I know better, but for millions of people out there, FW is as
impenetrable
now as it was for me as a child. Even the most educated
rabid
Joycean scholars still find new meanings constantly in FW, and
squabble,
debate and argue endlessly about the details.
This is, to me, the logical next step
that WSB should have taken after
his cutups,
because they are in the same spirit of code, tongues, Cant
language,
cyphers. "Naked Lunch" made no sense to me as a child either.
To WSB,
however, and those in his circle of influence it made sense -
more
and more sense, in fact, the deeper inside that circle you were,
and
understood the references to his own life. The irony of all this is
that
even as WSB claimed to want to break down language, smashing all
barriers
and "systems of control", he was actually using the broken
pieces
to build his *own* barrier, his own barricade against the world.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey
Scott Holland
somewhere
in the wilderness of Kentucky
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 10:10:45 -0600
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: jo grant <jgrant@BOOKZEN.COM>
Subject: Re: BOB KAUFMAN
In-Reply-To: <199801281711.MAA07107@pike.sover.net>
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>
>WIND,
SEA,
>SKY,
STARS,
>SURROUND
>US
>
>BOB
KAUFMAN
>
>
>ps
to jo grant: all caps are kaufman's :)
>mc
MC,
Alan
Kornbloom (Coffee House Press, Mpls) sent me a pre pub copy of CRANIAL
GUITAR,
and later the book so I'd have the cover art. Interesting how BK
used
type. There doesn't seem to be a pattern. I should ask Nicosia about
that.
He's a wealth of information when it comes to Bob Kaufman.
j grant
HELP RECOVER THE MEMORY
BABE ARCHIVES
Details on-line at
http://www.bookzen.com
625,506 Visitors 07-01-96 to 11-28-97
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 11:42:10 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Edward Desautels
<edesaute@BBNPLANET.COM>
Subject: Re: Where's the beef? (was: Re: beat
weekend)
Comments:
To: jhasbro@tezcat.com
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Dear
Mr. Hasbrouck:
Thanks
for the comments. I would agree with you that there was a shift in=
Burroughs' motivation between the writing of
_Junky_ and _Exterminator!_.
I do
would argue, however, that despite his desire to write something=
"publishable," Burroughs'
examination of the topic of addiction (whether=
intentional or not) runs somewhat deeper than
an exploitation of the junk=
experience to entertain the readers
"dime-store" detective fiction. (As I=
recall, _Junky_ was originally published
back-to-back with the "memoirs" of=
a law enforcement official whose career was
spent "busting" drug
addicts.)=
I think, in _Junky_, we see the seeds of the
overarching, rhetorical=
question informing _Naked Lunch_:
"Wouldn't You?" Even, perhaps, without=
consciousness of thematic development,
Burroughs is beginning, in _Junky_,=
to explore the nature of addiction, the
notion of its ubiquity, and the=
insidious process by which one addiction
easily stands in for or supplants=
another. "Don't assume a standpoint of
righteousness, " he seems to be=
saying, "when examining my addiction to
junk. It happened to me, and it=
could easily happen to you. Now, what say we
pop over to that little bar=
across the street, drink a coupla strong
Martinis, smoke a coupla expensive=
cigars, an' get us a piece of ass. Doesn't
that sound tasty?"
As regards tone, I see Burroughs' early work
as strongly influenced by the=
"autobiography" of a character
named Jack Black titled _You Can't Win_. The=
book purports to be an insider's look at the
yeggs, hobos, and criminal=
underworld in the turn-of-the-century U.S.
and Canada. Burroughs speaks of=
reading this book at an early age and describes
the heavy influence it had=
on his life. It's an interesting work
(whether genuine or faux), and a good=
project might be to read the early works of
Burroughs "through" _You Can't=
Win_. I read an original edition of this book
several years ago and was=
fascinated by Burroughs' appropriation of
Black's voice and tone. I=
recently acquired a copy of my own, published
in 1992 by an outfit called=
Omnium Press. Try Amazon.com if you're
interested, but, be warned, this=
edition is rife with distracting typos!
Best
Regards,
Ed
At
09:48 AM 1/29/98 +0000, you wrote:
>Dear
Mr. Desautels,
>
>Thank
you for posting your essay _Appropriation and Transmogrification_
>on
the Beat List-serv. I have read it with profit.
>
>I
am reminded that I never really appreciated the narrative tone of
>JUNKY
until I read in THE MAMMOTH BOOK OF PULP FICTION, which contains
>lots
a detective stories from the 20s, 30s and 40s. JUNKY, of course,
>was
written very early in Burroughs' career. I understand that, at the
>time
of writing JUNKY, Burroughs' deliberate appropriation of the
>hard-balled
detective style was for very practical reasons - he needed
>money
and sought to sell a product to a specific market. This is borne
>out
in various biographical works and in comments by Burroughs' himself.
>At
some point, however, between JUNKY and EXTERMINATOR, Burroughs'
>methods
of appropriation appear to have become a conscious stylistic
>device
whereby he upped the ante, so to speak, in his writing. That is,
>he
began attempting to communicate a (for lack of a better word)
>_message_,
be it moral, political or philosophical. It would be
>difficult
to argue that there is a _message_ in JUNKY beyond its
>entertainment
value.
>
>Am
I on the right track here?
>
>Again,
thanks,
>
>John
Hasbrouck
>
<center>************************************************************
Edward
Desautels
7
Hamilton Road
Somerville,
MA 02144
edesaute@bbnplanet.com
http://www.shore.net/~debra/ed/homepage.html
<smaller>"One
day I found my shirt lying across my knees,=20
I
called it Beauty. Since thenI've been a painter of shirts."
Jacques
Rigaut
</smaller>************************************************************</cent=
er>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:31:24 -0800
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From: Diane Carter
<dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Subject: Re: WSB, Wild Boys, Word=Virus
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>
Jeffrey Scott Holland wrote:
>
>
No, I meant FW is opaque to those who don't speak the secret code,
>
which would be most everyday citizens. FW is a rorschach test for the
>
intelligentsia, a sort of encoded trivia quiz. To the average reader
>
who
>
does not understand the method of the writing, nor the literary,
>
geographical, historical and biblical references and allusions, and who
>
does not know how to break words down to their Latin roots, FW is a
>
work
>
written in secret code that they can never crack without the codex of
>
education.
I
vigorously oppose the theory that Finnegans Wake (FW) is written in a
secret
code and that in order to understand FW it is necessary to
decipher
the code, to translate it into English, as the theory implies.
In
fact, the reason that FW is unapproachable to many readers is because
they
grasp hold onto this theory. For years
even literary critics
approached
the work with the theory that deciphering it would make it
more
understandable. In pre-occupation with
linguistic analysis, critics
and
readers miss the overall meaning and value of FW. It is necessary
first
of all to give up conventional notions of language for the language
of the
dream--the language of the unconscious cannot be read in a
traditional
manner. In the dream, language becomes
blurred, the edges of
words
slide away, time disappears; words, syllables recall other words
and
syllables, perhaps similar in sound but not in meaning. People spend
lifetimes
on exegesis and miss the the overall meaning of the Wake, which
exists
in a broader examination of myth, cycles, dream and being.
Finnegans
Wake is not Rorschach. It is a unique
and FULLY INTENTIONAL
world.
>
This is, to me, the logical next step that WSB should have taken after
>
his cutups, because they are in the same spirit of code, tongues, Cant
>
language, cyphers. "Naked Lunch" made no sense to me as a child
either.
> To
WSB, however, and those in his circle of influence it made sense -
>
more and more sense, in fact, the deeper inside that circle you were,
>
and understood the references to his own life. The irony of all this is
>
that even as WSB claimed to want to break down language, smashing all
>
barriers and "systems of control", he was actually using the broken
>
pieces to build his *own* barrier, his own barricade against the world.
What I
perceive as one of the differences between Joyce and Burroughs is
that
Joyce did not intend to break down language, he took language into
the
unconscious, a point beyond which it had ever been taken before. In
the
unconscious, words run together and it is the images that reveal
meaning
and multiple meanings. Where Burroughs
tried to subvert or play
as
creator with the control language has on its own, he didn't go into
the
place beyond language. Joyce's
conscious use of etymology, allusions
to
other words, events, personages, puns, use of Dublin pub talk, long
lines
of catalogues, newspaper headlines, and recurrent use of dream
images
and thematic material form part of a huge flowing substance that
is
created and controlled by Joyce the artist.
Joyce has created a
universe
in which everything fits--the book as world.
In FW even
language
is part of this creation out of nothing process--a process of
being
and becoming.
DC
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 13:56:19 +0300
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From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Lowell 1998
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could
someone backchannel me with likely dates for any Kerouac
Celebration
in the Fall of 1998 in Lowell?
thanks
in advance,
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:56:58 +0100
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From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Joyce, WSB, word play about word play
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Diane
Carter wrote:
>
> I
vigorously oppose the theory that Finnegans Wake (FW) is written in a
>
secret code and that in order to understand FW it is necessary to
>
decipher the code, to translate it into English, as the theory implies.
> In
fact, the reason that FW is unapproachable to many readers is because
>
they grasp hold onto this theory.
=== By
'code' I simply mean an invented manner of speech which the
reader
is not familiar with. James Joyce knew what he meant by
"spidsiest
hem of her trikkikant". I don't. Thus, it is a code of sorts,
certainly
secret to me; a Cant language. So are Algebra and Quantum
Physics,
to those who are not fluent in them.
> It
is necessary
>
first of all to give up conventional notions of language for the language
> of
the dream--the language of the unconscious cannot be read in a
>
traditional manner.
=== In
another words, a code.
>
words, syllables recall other words
>
and syllables, perhaps similar in sound but not in meaning.
===
this is literally the textbook definition of a code.
>
Finnegans Wake is not Rorschach. It is
a unique and FULLY INTENTIONAL
>
world.
=== All
of human experience is a Rorschach test in a sense, in that no
two
human beings can see the same thing exactly. FW is more so than
others
because it is a dense web of puns, riddles, spoonerisms,
deliberate
malapropisms, slang, and references that are over many
readers'
heads, thus the book makes greater demands of its reader and
there
is plenty of room for interpretation, "wrong" or not. What Joyce
actually
intended is immaterial, almost quaintly so. No one, including
you or
myself, will ever fully know what Joyce intended. As with the
Bible,
people will eternally be squabbling over the meanings of FW, and
as
Lewis Carroll observed, "Who's to be the Master - the reader or the
word?"
>
What I perceive as one of the differences between Joyce and Burroughs is
> that
Joyce did not intend to break down language, he took language into
>
the unconscious, a point beyond which it had ever been taken before.
===
Agreed. WSB probably should have just let his cut-up work stand on
its own
without his Dada-esque grandiose claims that he was trying to
destroy
language, the idea of which seems even more foolish now than it
did
then. Oddly, though WSB almost always had the gift of gab, his
attempts
to explain and defend his cut-up process never came off very
convincingly
articulated.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey
Scott Holland
somewhere
in the wilderness of Kentucky
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:16:31 +0100
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From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Re: Where's the beef? (was: Re: beat
weekend)
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Edward
Desautels wrote:
>
Burroughs' examination of the topic of addiction
>
(whether intentional or not) runs somewhat deeper than an exploitation
> of
the junk experience to entertain the readers "dime-store" detective
>
fiction.
===
Agreed. Burroughs didn't really see himself as writing lurid
dime-store
trash, and his writing was far more honest than the
armchair-lowlifes
who tried in vain to imagine "the seedy underbelly" in
their
dime novels.
> As
regards tone, I see Burroughs' early work as strongly influenced by
>
the "autobiography" of a character named Jack Black titled _You Can't
>
Win_.
===
Yes, it's virtually the standard by which WSB measured all writing.
It's
loaded with colorful characters not unlike his own, and in fact his
Salt
Chunk Mary character is lifted straight from YCW, as well as some
text
verbatim.
> I
read an original
>
edition of this book several years ago and was fascinated by
>
Burroughs' appropriation of Black's voice and tone. I recently
>
acquired a copy of my own, published in 1992 by an outfit called
>
Omnium Press. Try Amazon.com if you're interested, but, be warned,
>
this edition is rife with distracting typos!
===
Omnium's is out of print, and Amazon thinks it's just "on
backorder".
If you can, find a used copy of the Amok Press version, also
sadly
out of print, with a gruesome Joe Coleman painting on the cover.
Amok's
version was reprinted directly from the original, so you could
read it
laid out in the same typography the young WSB saw it in.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey
Scott Holland
somewhere
in the wilderness of Kentucky
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 15:29:56 +0000
Reply-To: jhasbro@tezcat.com
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: John Hasbrouck <jhasbro@TEZCAT.COM>
Subject: Re: Where's the beef? (was: Re: beat
weekend)
Comments:
To: Edward Desautels <edesaute@bbnplanet.com>
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Edward
Desautels wrote:
>
>
Dear Mr. Hasbrouck:
>
>
Thanks for the comments. I would agree with you that there was a shift
> in
Burroughs' motivation between the writing of _Junky_ and
>
_Exterminator!_.
-snip-
Dear
Ed,
For my
money, the key to the common reader's grasping Burroughs' voice
lies in
reading of WSB's published correspondence, including _The
Selected
Letters of William S. Burroughs: 1945-1959_ and, to a lesser
extent,
_The Yage Letters_.
The
_shift_ we've been discussing was not, I think, abrupt, but gradual.
By
1953, (where TYL begins), Burroughs has achieved an odd sort of
freedom.
By this time he had kissed the U.S. goodbye (for some years,
anyway)
and was free from U.S. law enforcement. He'd written _Junky_ and
_Queer_,
and had escaped jail time in the accidental shooting death of
his
wife Joan - ultimately by leaving Mexico. He'd also come to accept
his
drug addiction as something that was most likely to be with him for
a
while. He was, at least for the moment, oddly free from the idea that
kicking
was something he MUST do.
At this
point, his writing (which we possess in his correspondence,
principally
with Ginsberg) also achieves remarkable freedom. TYL begins
with
some of WSB's first attempts at what is to become perhaps his main
vehicle
of cultural commentary, satire and moralising: the routine.
To read
Selected Letters (which I maintain is the crucial prerequisite
to
persuring the early novels, certainly the best possible key to
unlocking
_Naked Lunch_) one observes - in fast forward motion - the
gradual
but steady development of Burroughs' voice and identity as a
writer.
Ed:
when you say:
_Even,
perhaps, without consciousness of thematic development, Burroughs
is
beginning, in _Junky_, to explore the nature of addiction, the notion
of its
ubiquity, and the insidious process by which one addiction easily
stands
in for or supplants another._
I
wonder about the legitimacy of my asking just when WSB's exploration
of the
nature of addiction became a conscious theme in his work. I
wonder
this because I only have the books, bios and interviews to go on,
and am
concerned that I may be attempting to psychoanalyse the author
rather
than interpret his work. Actually I'm interested in Burroughs'
life
AND work - I am able to distinguish the two (some of my friends
can't -
or won't). Now, I ain't no literary theorist - I calls 'em as I
sees
'em. And I can appreciate _tendencies_ in the novels, but...am I
getting
into deep water here?
John
Hasbrouck,
Common
Reader
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:39:59 -0700
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From: Sean Young <Sean.Young@DSW.COM>
Subject: Re: Looking for info. on Jack Kerouac
School for Disenchante
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Hey Sundee and all,
I have visited the Jack Kerouac School of
"DISEMBODIED" Poetics a
couple of times. Once in July '93 to see
Allen read and then again in
the summer of '94 for the tribute to
Allen Ginsberg. I found the
school to be inspiring. I talked to a
number of students in the MFA
writing and poetics programs and the one
thing that stands out for
them is diversity in the program. As in,
the opportunity to really
shape your own journey through the program
through the exposure to
diverse points of view. I would attend
Naropa in a second if I had my
shit together. For me the best advantage
of attending Naropa is the
respect that is given emerging and living
poetics.
Is there anyone on the list who has
attended Naropa? If only for a
summer program? I would also appreciate
any input that a more indepth
experience could offer.
Thanks,
Sean D. Young
______________________________
Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject:
Looking for info. on Jack Kerouac School for Disenchanted Po
Author: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU> at Internet
Date: 1/28/98 8:43 PM
Hello.
I am
looking at graduate schools and am very interested in finding out more
about
the creative writing department at Naropa in Boulder, CO. I have some
information
about it, but would like to know some inside scoop from anyone who
has
attended, visited, etc. etc.
Thanks
for any info..
Sundee
Bumgarner
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 14:04:22 -0800
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Maggie Gerrity
<u2ginsberg@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: Looking for info. on Jack Kerouac
School for Disenchanted
Poetics @ Naropa
MIME-Version:
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it the Jack Kerouac School for
DisEMBODIED
Poetics? I hardly think anyone would accuse JK of being
disenchanted!
If it's info on Naropa you want, Sundee, check out their
website
at www.naropa.edu
Maggie
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU
YAHOO!?
Get
your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:17:24 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Edward Desautels
<edesaute@BBNPLANET.COM>
Subject: Re: Lowell 1998
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I've
attended a couple of the Lowell Celebrates Jack Kerouac festivals, as well
as the concurrent Beat Lit Symposia. Unless
they've radically rescheduled,
these events usually take place in the first
weeks of October (Kerouac's
favorite month, they say). I believe this
information is posted on a City of
Lowell Web site. You can also get
information, I believe, at the UMass Lowell
Web site. I'll dig into my records at home
and see if I can turn up a phone
number from the department at UML that
sponsors the Symposium.
Ed
Desautels
At
01:56 PM 1/29/98 +0300, you wrote:
>could
someone backchannel me with likely dates for any Kerouac
>Celebration
in the Fall of 1998 in Lowell?
>
>thanks
in advance,
>dbr
>
<center>************************************************************
Edward
Desautels
7
Hamilton Road
Somerville,
MA 02144
edesaute@bbnplanet.com
http://www.shore.net/~debra/ed/homepage.html
<smaller>"One
day I found my shirt lying across my knees,
I
called it Beauty. Since thenI've been a painter of shirts."
Jacques
Rigaut
</smaller>************************************************************</center>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:12:05 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Edward Desautels <edesaute@BBNPLANET.COM>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
Mime-Version:
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>
>
>
>>
What I perceive as one of the differences between Joyce and Burroughs is
>>
that Joyce did not intend to break down language, he took language into
>>
the unconscious, a point beyond which it had ever been taken before.
>
>===
Agreed. WSB probably should have just let his cut-up work stand on
>its
own without his Dada-esque grandiose claims that he was trying to
>destroy
language, the idea of which seems even more foolish now than it
>did
then. Oddly, though WSB almost always had the gift of gab, his
>attempts
to explain and defend his cut-up process never came off very
>convincingly
articulated.
Minor
point: I don't think the Dadas were so much interested in _destroying_
language as wresting it from the control of
the bourgeoisie. Whether or not
these two aims are merely iterations of each
other is open to speculation.
Andre
Codrescu has an interesting essay titled "The Triumphant Shipwreck of Dada
and Surrealism" in which he discusses
Dada, Surrealism, Burroughs/Gysin cut-up
and the appropriation (and vulgarization?) of
these by popular culture. I think
it's contained in a collection called _The
Disappearance of the Outside_. It's
worth having a look at.
Ed
<center>************************************************************
<bigger>Edward
Desautels
7
Hamilton Road
Somerville,
MA 02144
edesaute@bbnplanet.com
http://www.shore.net/~debra/ed/homepage.html
"One
day I found my shirt lying across my knees,
I
called it Beauty. Since thenI've been a painter of shirts."
Jacques
Rigaut
</bigger>************************************************************</center>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:40:20 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: TKQ <mapaul@PIPELINE.COM>
Subject: Re: critical essays
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At
05:16 PM 1/28/98 PST, you wrote:
>Hi
Everyone.
>
>I'm
writing an essay about Kerouac and his novels.
Do anyone know where
>I
can find critical essays about his work?
Thanks a lot!
>
>Kim
>The
Kerouac Quarterly my friend....Paul.
>______________________________________________________
>Get
Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>
"We
cannot well do without our sins; they are the highway to our virtues."
Henry David Thoreau
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:40:23 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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The
Kerouac Quarterly!
http://www.freeyellow.com/members/upstartcrow/KerouacQuarterly.html
"We
cannot well do without our sins; they are the highway to our virtues."
Henry David Thoreau
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:00:05 +0300
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From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Herbert Huncke
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Nancy B
Brodsky wrote:
>
>
Right now, Im reading the Herbert Huncke Reader, which I got for Chanukah
>
and its very interesting to see how casually he refers to the more famous
>
members of the BG. He never uses AG's last name but refers to 'Allen'
>
quite often and its obvious who he is talking about. Also, the references
> to
'Bill' or 'Old Bull Lee'. Its a really good book. What do you all
>
think?
>
~Nancy
>
>
The Absence of Sound, Clear and Pure, The Silence Now Heard In Heaven For
>
Sure-JK
i think
somebody should give it to me! i saw
him on a couple different
videos
and i believe his words on paper would be fascinating. If Neal
was the
genius of the visible Beat Generation, Huncke was the genius of
the seedy
underbelly.
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:05:16 +0000
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: Re: BOB KAUFMAN
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yo,
joe: have you asked yet? what an enigmatic person he seems to have been.
mc
jo
grant wrote:
>
>
>
>WIND, SEA,
>
>SKY, STARS,
>
>SURROUND
>
>US
>
>
>
>BOB KAUFMAN
>
>
>
>
>
>ps to jo grant: all caps are kaufman's
:)
>
>mc
>
>
MC,
>
Alan Kornbloom (Coffee House Press, Mpls) sent me a pre pub copy of CRANIAL
>
GUITAR, and later the book so I'd have the cover art. Interesting how BK
>
used type. There doesn't seem to be a pattern. I should ask Nicosia about
>
that. He's a wealth of information when it comes to Bob Kaufman.
> j
grant
>
> HELP RECOVER THE MEMORY
BABE ARCHIVES
> Details on-line at
>
http://www.bookzen.com
> 625,506 Visitors
07-01-96 to 11-28-97
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:47:52 +0300
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From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Zyprexa Blues #335
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Lost in
a monopoly game about to lose my mind, i am the sports car, cash
short,
property only decaying slums, Simon leGreeeedmonster sits across
licking
his chops and counting his deeds as he polishes his keys, keys
to the
City, County and Universe and me with a rusty old skeleton key in
a
rusting out rambler sportser with Idaho plates. SURVIVAL! that's the
only
word with meaning as Carlos Santana skips in my head. Survival is
all i
have this sacred second. "Monopoly
is so much fun i'd hate to
blow
the game" i hear Phil Ochs ringing in my ear in Outside a small
circle
of friends. hey phil, what's up? remember me he says? sure i
was
just listening to your broadside interviews today. you're wrong
about
blonde on blonde by the way. i was
wrong about a few things he
admits. is it true the fbi and cia pushed you to
suicide i wonder
aloud? no man i hung myself pure and simple. that's a shame i say.
shoulda
kept your eye on the word ... survival ... yep he agrees. you
do it
for me he says and vanishes.
"Monopoly is so much fun i'd hate to
blow
the game" do it for me says the vanishing wordman...simon
leGreedymonster
is breathing his garlicladen vampire breath down my neck
from
the other side of the table and i'd hate to blow the game caught in
phil's
lyrics momentarily and then - Heck, i says to myself, i says Heck
I've
thrown many a game of Monopoly back in the days when the most
notorious
set of Original Gangstas used to meet on claflin holler to
plot the
future of parallel universe takeovers.
I've thrown him might
as well
blow 'em i think -- after all it's a matter of survival of
sooner
or later pick sooner everytime and i'm standing over William's
casket,
beautiful vestage his can, hat on the top he winks and says i
gotta
go kid you hold the fort, meaning Survive i suppose and so it's
SimonMonster
vs. me and the name is survival with a burroughsian spin,
k-9
shift coordinate points, copy, k-9 shit to fe-line in all cases,
copy,
let the cat out of the bag, copy, survive it can be done, i flash
to star
wars yoda plastered behind a doorway not a curtain and the way
of the
wizard reveals itself to me through the FoRcE of Muses Mill.
The
dice roll revealing the next Universe I will exist within and the
double
hexes land me not in Jail but smack damnitt right on Park Place
with
Seven Hotels each with a different name.
YIKES!
my interior landscape screams primally and my pistons lock in
panic
anxiety disorder overwhelming Zyprexa-Tegretol stew
instantaneously
but momentarily. I pull a Joker out of
my sleeve slap
it on
the table double means roll again this time into parallel universe
for all
place Re-Place with Street not owned by LeGreedmonster but by
Lamar's
neighbor.
<http://www.mapblast.com/yt.hm?&CMD=MAP&SEC=blast&FAM=mapblast&GC=X:-97.61925|Y:
38.84414|LT:38.84421|LN:-97.61919|LS:10000|c:Salina|s:KS|z:67401|d:678|p:USA&IC
=38.84414:-97.61925:8:Potential+Home&GAD2=817+Park+St&GAD3=Salina%2c+KS++67401-
2170&MA=2&LV=3>
sounds like
a fair defense and a sweet survival offense i think humming
one
flew east and one flew west and one converted park place to a place
called
West Park Street and found home without Ruby slippers but rather
only
red converse allstars.
1-29-98
copyright
david b. rhaesa
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 09:35:11 -0800
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From: Diane Carter
<dcarter@TOGETHER.NET>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
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>
Jeffrey Scott Holland wrote:
>
>
=== this is literally the textbook definition of a code.
The
thing is, you need only to experience the language of this world
(FW),
not translate it. You can take whatever
background you have and
read FW
and get something out of it. It's true
that the more knowledge
you
have about various subjects, the more you are able to penetrate to
deeper
levels in the work. I don't think
changing the way one
experiences
language or words is the same as cracking a code. It
has
more to do with the reader's participation in the dream world.
Perhaps
in the same way understanding the process of cut-ups doesn't have
much to
do with experiencing the images or meaning one gets from the
individual
words or various combinations of words.
DC
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:03:35 +0100
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From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
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Diane
Carter wrote:
>
The thing is, you need only to experience the language of this world
>
(FW), not translate it.
===
That *is* one very valid way of approaching it, but not the only way
and,
arguably, not the primary way. When I read it, I cannot help but
pick it
apart hyperanalytically - the encoded deeper meanings were put
there
to be read - but when I get to a passage that I can't fathom (and
there
are plenty), then I revert into the mode I think you're talking
about,
experiencing the beauty of the dream language strictly for its
own
sake.
>
You can take whatever background you have and
>
read FW and get something out of it.
=== If
you had the average person on the street read it, and ask them
what
they got out of it, they'd probably say not much, except maybe that
confirmation
that placing a monkey in front of a typewriter does not
produce
"Hamlet". The masses do not get it. I've spent years trying to
convince
people that FW isn't useless random nonsense. I don't think
ANYTHING
is nonsense, myself, but that's a whole 'nother thread.
> I don't think changing the way one
>
experiences language or words is the same as cracking a code.
=== I
don't see what the difference is, especially when we're talking
about
changing the way one experiences the MEANING of words, as well as
coining
new ones. Double meanings are the very definition of code.
Any
foreign language is a secret code to anyone who hasn't learned to
speak
it, and that includes the dream language of FW.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey
Scott Holland
somewhere
in the wilderness of Kentucky
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 21:07:34 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Nancy B Brodsky
<nbb203@IS8.NYU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Herbert Huncke
In-Reply-To: <34D09975.5636@midusa.net>
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Yeah,Im
really enjoying the book. Its got a whole bunch of stuff in it,
like
The Evening Sun Turned Crimson and his journal. Its really easy to
read.
On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, David Bruce Rhaesa
wrote:
>
Nancy B Brodsky wrote:
>
>
>
> Right now, Im reading the Herbert Huncke Reader, which I got for Chanukah
>
> and its very interesting to see how casually he refers to the more famous
>
> members of the BG. He never uses AG's last name but refers to 'Allen'
>
> quite often and its obvious who he is talking about. Also, the references
>
> to 'Bill' or 'Old Bull Lee'. Its a really good book. What do you all
>
> think?
>
> ~Nancy
>
>
>
> The Absence of Sound, Clear and Pure, The Silence Now Heard In Heaven For
>
> Sure-JK
>
> i
think somebody should give it to me! i
saw him on a couple different
>
videos and i believe his words on paper would be fascinating. If Neal
>
was the genius of the visible Beat Generation, Huncke was the genius of
> the
seedy underbelly.
>
>
dbr
>
The
Absence of Sound, Clear and Pure, The Silence Now Heard In Heaven For
Sure-JK
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 21:06:19 EST
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From: Maggie Dharma <IDDHI@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
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In a
message dated 29-Jan-98 6:00:15 PM Pacific Standard Time,
jholland@ICLUB.ORG
writes:
<<
The masses do not get it. I've spent years trying to
convince people that FW isn't useless random
nonsense. I don't think
ANYTHING is nonsense, myself, but that's a
whole 'nother thread. >>
Boy,
ain't that the truth? And thanks to everyone for contributing to a thread
that's
very interesting and educational while not being so esoteric as to be
beyond
my level of educational comprehension. You all have given me a desire
to read
something of WSB's besides Naked Lunch!
Wanna
talk Jabberwockie?
Maggie
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 21:20:31 -0500
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Nancy B Brodsky
<nbb203@IS8.NYU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
In-Reply-To: <14917a5.34d1359d@aol.com>
Mime-Version:
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Sorry,
I just need clarification but what or who is 'FW'? Thanks...
On Thu,
29 Jan 1998, Maggie Dharma wrote:
> In
a message dated 29-Jan-98 6:00:15 PM Pacific Standard Time,
>
jholland@ICLUB.ORG writes:
>
>
<< The masses do not get it. I've spent years trying to
> convince people that FW isn't useless random
nonsense. I don't think
> ANYTHING is nonsense, myself, but that's a
whole 'nother thread. >>
>
>
Boy, ain't that the truth? And thanks to everyone for contributing to a thread
>
that's very interesting and educational while not being so esoteric as to be
>
beyond my level of educational comprehension. You all have given me a desire
> to
read something of WSB's besides Naked Lunch!
>
>
Wanna talk Jabberwockie?
>
>
Maggie
>
The
Absence of Sound, Clear and Pure, The Silence Now Heard In Heaven For
Sure-JK
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 21:25:32 EST
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Maggie Dharma <IDDHI@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
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That
would be "Finnegan's Wake." In addition to the thread about WSB, a
lot of
people
compare Kerouac's use of language to James Joyce, author of same.
Maggie
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 20:20:32 CST6CDT
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Frank O'Brien
<FMO9287@CUB.UCA.EDU>
Organization:
University of Central Arkansas
Subject: Lookin' For Visions in A Gable
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I'm
working on a thesis for Ginsberg (Ye Gods!
More academia), and
I'm
trying to focus oh his prophetic nature--that is, his poetry as
functional,
perhaps as revolutionary? Especially
withrespect to the
counter-cultural
movement. I've read splotches of info
(collected
letters,
reviews, the usual twisted stuff), but I've got this idea
swirling et gyre with corpus mundi yet love of the
self
celebratory-communal-Whitman-communication-thought
that won't leave
me
be. I've thought of juxtaposing
meaningless Capital-Scam
Babble"Talk"
vs. Ginsberg's Metapure-God"Speak" in the sense that
"Talk"
is empty as a metaphor & "Speak" is a vehicle for
transcendental
visions. The AH! of prophetic visions
and what those
visions
can accomplish, their inherent Mojo for the masses. Kinda
like
Martin Buber's encounter of the "I" and the "Thou." You can
tell
I'm gobbling up confusion, but I'd like direction if anyone's
interested
in flailing this beast into submission.
As
Always,
The
Cosmic Joke
Frank
O'Brien
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:48:51 -0800
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From: "Timothy K. Gallaher"
<gallaher@HSC.USC.EDU>
Subject: FYI Joyce Lists
Mime-Version:
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This is
from http://www.2street.com/joyce/onsite/email.html
a
pretty good Joyce site.
Here is
the list info (Joyce Lists and Finnegans wake list)
j-joyce-request@lists.utah.edu
In the
subject header of the message, simply type the command "subscribe".
The
body of the message may be
left
blank.
To
unsubscribe, send the command "unsubscribe" in the subject header of
an
e-mail
message sent to the
j-joyce-request@lists.utah.edu
address.
Mail
sent to j-joyce@lists.utah.edu will be automatically forwarded to
every
subscriber.
Subscribing,
Unsubscribing, and Posting to FWAKE-L
To
subscribe to FWAKE-L send an e-mail message to the following address:
listserv@listserv.hea.ie
The
body of the message must contain the following text:
subscribe FWAKE-L [your name spelled out normally]
To
unsubscribe, send the command "signoff FWAKE-L" to the
listserv@listserv.hea.ie
address.
Mail
sent to fwake-l@irlearn.ucd.ie will be automatically forwarded to
every
subscriber.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:52:27 -0800
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: "Timothy K. Gallaher"
<gallaher@HSC.USC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
Mime-Version:
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>That
would be "Finnegan's Wake."
Minor
but important little detail--there is no apostrophe
Finnegans
Wake
Finnegans
of the world wake up
In addition to the thread about WSB, a lot of
>people
compare Kerouac's use of language to James Joyce, author of same.
>
>Maggie
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 21:57:28 EST
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Maggie Dharma <IDDHI@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
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In a
message dated 29-Jan-98 6:55:43 PM Pacific Standard Time,
gallaher@HSC.USC.EDU
writes:
<<
Finnegans Wake
Finnegans of the world wake up
>>
thanks,
tim... the second I sent it I thought I'd done it wrong. Maggie
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:00:11 -0800
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Timothy K. Gallaher"
<gallaher@HSC.USC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
Mime-Version:
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Joyce's
work is available in e-text.
This
link will take you to a page with all the urls
http://www.2street.com/joyce/etext/index.html
But one
weird thing is until some lawsuit gets settled technically in the
US we
aren't supposed to download them.
When
will kerouac's public domain stuff get upped to the internet in e-text?
Actually,
we are the folks who would be supposed to do it.
O
tell me all
about
Anna Livia! I want to
hear all
about
Anna Livia. Well, you know Anna Livia? Yes, of course,
we all
know Anna Livia. Tell me all. Tell me now. You'll die
when
you hear. Well, you know, when the old cheb went futt
and did
what you know. Yes, I know, go on. Wash quit and
don't
be dabbling. Tuck up your sleeves and loosen your talk-
tapes.
And don't butt me -- hike! -- when you bend. Or what-
ever it
was they threed to make out he thried to two in the
Fiendish
park. He's an awful old reppe. Look at the shirt of him !
Look at
the dirt of it! He has all my water black on me. And it
steeping
and stuping since this time last wik. How many goes
is it I
wonder I washed it? I know by heart the places he likes to
saale,
duddurty devil! Scorching my hand and starving my fa-
mine to
make his private linen public. Wallop it well with your
battle
and clean it. My wrists are wrusty rubbing the mouldaw
stains.
And the dneepers of wet and the gangres of sin in it! What
was it
he did a tail at all on Animal Sendai? And how long was
he
under loch and neagh? It was put in the newses what he did,
nicies
and priers, the King fierceas Humphrey, with illysus dis-
tilling,
exploits and all. But toms will till. I know he well. Temp
untamed
will hist for no man. As you spring so shall you neap.
O, the
roughty old rappe! Minxing marrage and making loof.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:27:19 -0800
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From: Maggie Gerrity
<u2ginsberg@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Complaint of Skeleton to Time
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Here's a great poem from Ginsberg's early
career (early 1949) that
I
thought was well worth sharing.
Complaint
of the Skeleton to Time
Take my
love, it is not true,
So let
it tempt no body new;
Take my
lady, she will sigh
For my
bed where'er I lie;
Take
them, said the skeleton,
But leave my bones alone.
Take my
raiment, now grown cold,
To give
to some poor poet old;
Take
the skin that hoods this truth
If his
age would wear my youth;
Take
them, said the skeleton,
But leave my bones alone.
Take
the thoughts that like the wind
Blow my
body out of mind;
Take
this heart to go with that
And
pass it on from rat to rat;
Take
them, said the skeleton,
But leave my bones alone.
Take
the art which I bemoan
In a
poem's crazy tone;
Grind
me down, though I may groan,
To the
starkest stick and stone;
Take
them, said the skeleton,
But leave my bones alone.
Early on, it was obvious that Allen Ginsberg
had one of the greatest
minds
of his generation. His presence is sorely missed in our
counterculture.
Maggie G.
"In
dreams begin responsibilities."--Delmore Schwartz
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU
YAHOO!?
Get
your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:30:13 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Edward Desautels
<edesaute@BBNPLANET.COM>
Subject: Re: Complaint of Skeleton to Time
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Yes.
We've read it. This is a Beat listserv.
Ed
At
07:27 PM 1/29/98 -0800, you wrote:
> Here's a great poem from Ginsberg's early
career (early 1949) that
>I
thought was well worth sharing.
>
>
>Complaint
of the Skeleton to Time
>
>Take
my love, it is not true,
>So
let it tempt no body new;
>Take
my lady, she will sigh
>For
my bed where'er I lie;
>Take
them, said the skeleton,
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>Take
my raiment, now grown cold,
>To
give to some poor poet old;
>Take
the skin that hoods this truth
>If
his age would wear my youth;
>Take
them, said the skeleton,
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>Take
the thoughts that like the wind
>Blow
my body out of mind;
>Take
this heart to go with that
>And
pass it on from rat to rat;
>Take
them, said the skeleton,
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>Take
the art which I bemoan
>In
a poem's crazy tone;
>Grind
me down, though I may groan,
>To
the starkest stick and stone;
>Take
them, said the skeleton,
> But leave my bones alone.
>
> Early on, it was obvious that Allen Ginsberg
had one of the greatest
>minds
of his generation. His presence is sorely missed in our
>counterculture.
> Maggie G.
>
>"In
dreams begin responsibilities."--Delmore Schwartz
>
>
>
>_________________________________________________________
>DO
YOU YAHOO!?
>Get
your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>
<center>************************************************************
<bigger>Edward
Desautels
7
Hamilton Road
Somerville,
MA 02144
edesaute@bbnplanet.com
http://www.shore.net/~debra/ed/homepage.html
"One
day I found my shirt lying across my knees,
I
called it Beauty. Since thenI've been a painter of shirts."
Jacques
Rigaut
</bigger>************************************************************</center>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:23:07 -0800
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Maggie Gerrity <u2ginsberg@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: Lookin' For Visions in A Gable
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Frank,
Don't know if this could be of any help, but
I just got finished
with a
lengthy Ginsberg piece myself, entitled "Love, Death, and the
Teachings
of Allen Ginsberg." As the title implies, I focused on
Ginsberg's
threefold persona of lover, mortal, and teacher. I'd love
to swap
bibliographies with you, as my professor has encouraged me to
continue
my research and publish my findings, and I'm sure we can both
use as
much help as we can get.
Up to my ears in Allen,
Maggie G.
"In
dreams begin responsibilites."--Delmore Schwartz
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU
YAHOO!?
Get
your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 21:20:52 +0000
Reply-To: stauffer@pacbell.net
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: James Stauffer
<stauffer@PACBELL.NET>
Subject: Re: Lookin' For Visions in A Gable
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>
I'm working on a thesis for Ginsberg (Ye Gods!
More academia), and
>
I'm trying to focus oh his prophetic nature--that is, his poetry as
>
functional, perhaps as revolutionar
Frank,
I think
this calls for a little immersion in William Blake and in Hebrew
Phrophecy. Both absolutely relevant to AG and both also
prophetic and
political.
It is
hard to overestimate the importance of both of these sources for
AG in
my (not humble) opinion.
James
Stauffer
James
Stauffer
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:38:57 +0100
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Rinaldo Rasa <rinaldo@GPNET.IT>
Subject: (low) memorial of Mario Schifano.
In-Reply-To:
<3.0.1.32.19980127184547.006a78a4@uoft02.utoledo.edu>
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Le
Stelle di Mario Schifano The Stars by Mario Schifano
Le
ultime parole di Brandimante,
The last words of Brandimante,
dall'Orlando
Furioso, by
Orlando Furioso,
ospite
Peter Hartman
Peter Hartman guest
e fine
(da ascoltarsi
and end (listen to it
con tv
accesa senza volume)
tv on no volume)
Molto
alto/ Very high/
Susan
song/
Susan song/
E
dopo/
Later on/
Intervallo/
Intermission/
Molto
lontano (a colori)
Very distant (colors)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mario
Schifano italian beat and pop painter, performer (1934-1998)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Allen
Ginsberg, lui ti ha detto che fra tutti i beatnik del
mondo,
quelli che gli fanno piu' tenerezza sono i beatnik
italiani
perche' protestano contro qualcosa che riusciranno
a
vedere solamente i loro figli.
Allen
Ginsberg has told that between all the beatnik
on the
world, they do him more tenderness are the italian beatnik
because
of they protests against anything that only will their sons
succeed
to see.
cari
saluti a tutti,
Rinaldo.
--------
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 03:06:07 +0300
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From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Complaint of Skeleton to Time
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Edward
Desautels wrote:
>
>
Yes. We've read it. This is a Beat listserv.
>
> Ed
>
well
what do you think about it?
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 03:13:11 +0300
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Where's the beef? (was: Re: beat
weekend)
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Jeffrey
Scott Holland wrote:
>
>
Edward Desautels wrote:
>
>
> Burroughs' examination of the topic of addiction
>
> (whether intentional or not) runs somewhat deeper than an exploitation
>
> of the junk experience to entertain the readers "dime-store"
detective
>
> fiction.
>
>
=== Agreed. Burroughs didn't really see himself as writing lurid
>
dime-store trash, and his writing was far more honest than the
>
armchair-lowlifes who tried in vain to imagine "the seedy underbelly"
in
>
their dime novels.
>
>
> As regards tone, I see Burroughs' early work as strongly influenced by
>
> the "autobiography" of a character named Jack Black titled _You
Can't
>
> Win_.
>
>
=== Yes, it's virtually the standard by which WSB measured all writing.
> It's
loaded with colorful characters not unlike his own, and in fact his
>
Salt Chunk Mary character is lifted straight from YCW, as well as some
>
text verbatim.
>
>
> I read an original
>
> edition of this book several years ago and was fascinated by
>
> Burroughs' appropriation of Black's voice and tone. I recently
>
> acquired a copy of my own, published in 1992 by an outfit called
>
> Omnium Press. Try Amazon.com if you're interested, but, be warned,
>
> this edition is rife with distracting typos!
>
>
=== Omnium's is out of print, and Amazon thinks it's just "on
>
backorder". If you can, find a used copy of the Amok Press version, also
>
sadly out of print, with a gruesome Joe Coleman painting on the cover.
>
Amok's version was reprinted directly from the original, so you could
>
read it laid out in the same typography the young WSB saw it in.
>
>
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
Jeffrey Scott Holland
>
somewhere in the wilderness of Kentucky
>
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
i particularly
liked the portion of the essay earlier in this thread
about
DE. it definitely is an approach to the
book and to the presence
of
everyday living.
dbr
roots
in some holler in muses mill kentucky
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 06:59:49 +0000
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<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: Marie Countryman <country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: Re: Zyprexa Blues #335
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sounds
like caffeine buzzed blues - amazing word play, dave
mc
David
Bruce Rhaesa wrote:
>
Lost in a monopoly game about to lose my mind, i am the sports car, cash
>
short, property only decaying slums, Simon leGreeeedmonster sits across
>
licking his chops and counting his deeds as he polishes his keys, keys
> to
the City, County and Universe and me with a rusty old skeleton key in
> a
rusting out rambler sportser with Idaho plates. SURVIVAL! that's the
>
only word with meaning as Carlos Santana skips in my head. Survival is
> all
i have this sacred second.
"Monopoly is so much fun i'd hate to
>
blow the game" i hear Phil Ochs ringing in my ear in Outside a small
>
circle of friends. hey phil, what's
up? remember me he says? sure i
>
was just listening to your broadside interviews today. you're wrong
>
about blonde on blonde by the way. i
was wrong about a few things he
>
admits. is it true the fbi and cia
pushed you to suicide i wonder
>
aloud? no man i hung myself pure and
simple. that's a shame i say.
>
shoulda kept your eye on the word ... survival ... yep he agrees. you
> do
it for me he says and vanishes.
"Monopoly is so much fun i'd hate to
>
blow the game" do it for me says the vanishing wordman...simon
>
leGreedymonster is breathing his garlicladen vampire breath down my neck
>
from the other side of the table and i'd hate to blow the game caught in
>
phil's lyrics momentarily and then - Heck, i says to myself, i says Heck
>
I've thrown many a game of Monopoly back in the days when the most
>
notorious set of Original Gangstas used to meet on claflin holler to
>
plot the future of parallel universe takeovers. I've thrown him might
> as
well blow 'em i think -- after all it's a matter of survival of
>
sooner or later pick sooner everytime and i'm standing over William's
>
casket, beautiful vestage his can, hat on the top he winks and says i
>
gotta go kid you hold the fort, meaning Survive i suppose and so it's
>
SimonMonster vs. me and the name is survival with a burroughsian spin,
>
k-9 shift coordinate points, copy, k-9 shit to fe-line in all cases,
>
copy, let the cat out of the bag, copy, survive it can be done, i flash
> to
star wars yoda plastered behind a doorway not a curtain and the way
> of
the wizard reveals itself to me through the FoRcE of Muses Mill.
>
>
The dice roll revealing the next Universe I will exist within and the
>
double hexes land me not in Jail but smack damnitt right on Park Place
>
with Seven Hotels each with a different name.
>
>
YIKES! my interior landscape screams primally and my pistons lock in
>
panic anxiety disorder overwhelming Zyprexa-Tegretol stew
>
instantaneously but momentarily. I pull
a Joker out of my sleeve slap
> it
on the table double means roll again this time into parallel universe
> for
all place Re-Place with Street not owned by LeGreedmonster but by
>
Lamar's neighbor.
>
<http://www.mapblast.com/yt.hm?&CMD=MAP&SEC=blast&FAM=mapblast&GC=X:-97.61925|Y
:
>
38.84414|LT:38.84421|LN:-97.61919|LS:10000|c:Salina|s:KS|z:67401|d:678|p:USA&IC
>
=38.84414:-97.61925:8:Potential+Home&GAD2=817+Park+St&GAD3=Salina%2c+KS++67401-
> 2170&MA=2&LV=3>
>
>
sounds like a fair defense and a sweet survival offense i think humming
>
one flew east and one flew west and one converted park place to a place
>
called West Park Street and found home without Ruby slippers but rather
>
only red converse allstars.
>
>
1-29-98
>
copyright david b. rhaesa
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 07:37:40 +0000
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Marie Countryman
<country@SOVER.NET>
Subject: Re: Complaint of Skeleton to Time
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ed:
that's a bit harsh, don't you thinnk? lots of us on this list serv bu=
t as of
yet, you seeem to be the only one with total reading of totality =
of beat
lit. and
speak
for yourself, please. who is the "we" of you speak?
i
myself was delighted to read the pome for the first time, and i've beee=
n
reading ginsberg for years.
mc
Edward
Desautels wrote:
>
Yes. We've read it. This is a Beat listserv.
>
> Ed
>
> At
07:27 PM 1/29/98 -0800, you wrote:
>
> Here's a great poem from Ginsberg's early career (early 1949) that
>
>I thought was well worth sharing.
>
>
>
>
>
>Complaint of the Skeleton to Time
>
>
>
>Take my love, it is not true,
>
>So let it tempt no body new;
>
>Take my lady, she will sigh
>
>For my bed where'er I lie;
>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>
> >Take
my raiment, now grown cold,
>
>To give to some poor poet old;
>
>Take the skin that hoods this truth
>
>If his age would wear my youth;
>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>
>
>Take the thoughts that like the wind
>
>Blow my body out of mind;
>
>Take this heart to go with that
>
>And pass it on from rat to rat;
>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>
>
>Take the art which I bemoan
>
>In a poem's crazy tone;
>
>Grind me down, though I may groan,
>
>To the starkest stick and stone;
>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>
>
> Early on, it was obvious that Allen Ginsberg had one of the greatest
>
>minds of his generation. His presence is sorely missed in our
>
>counterculture.
>
> Maggie G.
>
>
>
>"In dreams begin responsibilities."--Delmore Schwartz
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>_________________________________________________________
>
>DO YOU YAHOO!?
>
>Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
>
=
=
=01=F4=D2*
> =
=
=01=F4=DA0
>
=
=
=01=F4=DA0
>
=
=
=01=F4=DA0
> =
=
=01=F4=DA0
>
=
=
=01=F4=DAp
>
>
=
=
=01=F4=DA=A5
> =
=
=01=F4=DB=04
>
=
=
=01=F4=DB=04
>
=
=
=01=F4x8
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 08:13:56 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
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From: Nancy B Brodsky
<nbb203@IS8.NYU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Complaint of Skeleton to Time
In-Reply-To:
<3.0.32.19980129223011.007b6a30@pobox3.bbn.com>
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Thanks
to whoever posting the poem...I havent
read it.
TO
Edward:
Just because its Beat Listserv doesnt mean
everyone knows everything
about
the Beats. Don't speak for me because I dont like your tone of
voice.
On Thu,
29 Jan 1998, Edward Desautels wrote:
>
Yes. We've read it. This is a Beat listserv.
>
>
> Ed
>
>
> At
07:27 PM 1/29/98 -0800, you wrote:
>
>
> Here's a great poem from
Ginsberg's early career (early 1949)
that
>
>
>I thought was well worth sharing.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Complaint of the Skeleton to Time
>
>
>
>
>
>Take my love, it is not true,
>
>
>So let it tempt no body new;
>
>
>Take my lady, she will sigh
>
>
>For my bed where'er I lie;
>
>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>
>
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>
>
>
>
>Take my raiment, now grown cold,
>
>
>To give to some poor poet old;
>
>
>Take the skin that hoods this truth
>
>
>If his age would wear my youth;
>
>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>
>
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>
>
>
>
>Take the thoughts that like the wind
>
>
>Blow my body out of mind;
>
>
>Take this heart to go with that
>
>
>And pass it on from rat to rat;
>
>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>
>
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>
>
>
>
>Take the art which I bemoan
>
>
>In a poem's crazy tone;
>
>
>Grind me down, though I may groan,
>
>
>To the starkest stick and stone;
>
>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>
>
> But leave my bones alone.
>
>
>
>
>
> Early on, it was obvious that
Allen Ginsberg had one of the greatest
>
>
>minds of his generation. His presence is sorely missed in our
>
>
>counterculture.
>
>
> Maggie G.
>
>
>
>
>
>"In dreams begin responsibilities."--Delmore Schwartz
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>_________________________________________________________
>
>
>DO YOU YAHOO!?
>
>
>Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
<center>************************************************************
>
>
<bigger>Edward Desautels
>
> 7
Hamilton Road
>
>
Somerville, MA 02144
>
>
edesaute@bbnplanet.com
>
>
http://www.shore.net/~debra/ed/homepage.html
>
>
>
"One day I found my shirt lying across my knees,
>
> I
called it Beauty. Since thenI've been a painter of shirts."
>
>
Jacques Rigaut
>
>
</bigger>************************************************************</center>
>
The
Absence of Sound, Clear and Pure, The Silence Now Heard In Heaven For
Sure-JK
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:10:28 EST
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Bill Gargan <WXGBC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Lookin' For Visions in A Gable
In-Reply-To: Message of Thu, 29 Jan 1998 20:20:32 CST6CDT
from
<FMO9287@CUB.UCA.EDU>
You've
probably looked at Paul Portuges' Visionary Poetics of Allen
Ginsberg
already but if you haven't I'd recommend it.
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:21:48 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Edward Desautels
<edesaute@BBNPLANET.COM>
Subject: Re: Complaint of Skeleton to Time
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Apologies
to anyone I've offended. I simply meant to imply that I see little=
value in posting a piece in a forum such as
this without conceptualizing it=
in a way that promotes some sort of
worthwhile discussion. To simply state=
that one likes (or dislikes) a given piece
doesn't go very far toward=
generating ideas, perceptions, exchange. Take
to the next step, whether it=
be a personal insight or reflection on some
aspect of the piece or=
something more lit crit/theoretical. How has
the piece influenced, say,=
your conception of a poetics. Something.
As for
tone, well, I yam what I yam. Besides, I'd just spent four hours=
handing out flowers in the airport and had a
headache like you read about.=
:]
Regards,
Ed
At
07:37 AM 1/30/98 +0000, you wrote:
>ed:
that's a bit harsh, don't you thinnk? lots of us on this list serv but=
as of yet, you seeem to be the only one with
total reading of totality of=
beat lit. and
>speak
for yourself, please. who is the "we" of you speak?
>i
myself was delighted to read the pome for the first time, and i've beeen=
reading ginsberg for years.
>mc
>
>Edward
Desautels wrote:
>
>>
Yes. We've read it. This is a Beat listserv.
>>
>>
Ed
>>
>>
At 07:27 PM 1/29/98 -0800, you wrote:
>>
> Here's a great poem from Ginsberg's early career (early 1949) that
>>
>I thought was well worth sharing.
>>
>
>>
>
>>
>Complaint of the Skeleton to Time
>>
>
>>
>Take my love, it is not true,
>>
>So let it tempt no body new;
>>
>Take my lady, she will sigh
>>
>For my bed where'er I lie;
>>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>>
> But leave my bones alone.
>>
>
>>
>Take my raiment, now grown cold,
>>
>To give to some poor poet old;
>>
>Take the skin that hoods this truth
>>
>If his age would wear my youth;
>>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>>
> But leave my bones alone.
>>
>
>>
>Take the thoughts that like the wind
>>
>Blow my body out of mind;
>>
>Take this heart to go with that
>>
>And pass it on from rat to rat;
>>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>>
> But leave my bones alone.
>>
>
>>
>Take the art which I bemoan
>>
>In a poem's crazy tone;
>>
>Grind me down, though I may groan,
>>
>To the starkest stick and stone;
>>
>Take them, said the skeleton,
>>
> But leave my bones alone.
>>
>
>>
> Early on, it was obvious that Allen Ginsberg had one of the greatest
>>
>minds of his generation. His presence is sorely missed in our
>>
>counterculture.
>>
> Maggie G.
>>
>
>>
>"In dreams begin responsibilities."--Delmore Schwartz
>>
>
>>
>
>>
>
>>
>_________________________________________________________
>>
>DO YOU YAHOO!?
>>
>Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>>
>
>>
=
=
=01=F4=D2*
>> =
=
=01=F4=DA0
>>
=
=
=01=F4=DA0
>>
=
=
=01=F4=DA0
>>
=
=
=01=F4=DA0
>> =
=
=01=F4=DAp
>>
>>
=
=
=01=F4=DA=A5
>>
=
=
=01=F4=DB=04
>> =
=
=01=F4=DB=04
>>
=
=
=01=F4x8
>
<center>************************************************************
<bigger>Edward
Desautels
7
Hamilton Road
Somerville,
MA 02144
edesaute@bbnplanet.com
http://www.shore.net/~debra/ed/homepage.html
"One
day I found my shirt lying across my knees,=20
I
called it Beauty. Since thenI've been a painter of shirts."
Jacques
Rigaut
</bigger>************************************************************</cente=
r>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 11:15:55 +0100
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Re: Complaint of Skeleton to Time
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Maggie
Gerrity wrote:
>
> Here's a great poem from Ginsberg's early
career (early 1949) that
> I
thought was well worth sharing.
===
very nice, Maggie, I had not read this one. I may dig out some more
early
Ginsberg today.
>
> Early on, it was obvious that Allen
Ginsberg had one of the greatest
>
minds of his generation.
===
Ginsberg is certainly the voice of reason for the Beats. He was not
about
to go over the edge like everyone else around him, and tried to
talk
some sense into WSB and Kerouac....unfortunately Kerouac didn't
listen,
but it's a good thing that WSB didn't listen either; WSB
entered
the abyss and came back with postcards and snapshots. Jack
wasn't
so lucky. Ginsberg's key role as mother hen to this pack of feral
chickens
cannot be overstated.
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 07:12:08 -0800
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leon Tabory
<letabor@CRUZIO.COM>
Subject: Re: Zyprexa Blues #335
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
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Hi
David,
Thanks
for the ride. I feel like I am getting off a roller coaster, my eyes
still
squinting and where did I land? A foreign terrain with signs that hint
to
nowhere places, some recognizeable (?) a jambled mess(?). Pardon my
ignorance, who are the red converse allstars?
Looking
forward
leon
-----Original
Message-----
From:
David Bruce Rhaesa <race@MIDUSA.NET>
To:
BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Date:
Thursday, January 29, 1998 4:50 PM
Subject:
Zyprexa Blues #335
>Lost
in a monopoly game about to lose my mind, i am the sports car, cash
>short,
property only decaying slums, Simon leGreeeedmonster sits across
>licking
his chops and counting his deeds as he polishes his keys, keys
>to
the City, County and Universe and me with a rusty old skeleton key in
>a
rusting out rambler sportser with Idaho plates. SURVIVAL! that's the
>only
word with meaning as Carlos Santana skips in my head. Survival is
>all
i have this sacred second.
"Monopoly is so much fun i'd hate to
>blow
the game" i hear Phil Ochs ringing in my ear in Outside a small
>circle
of friends. hey phil, what's up? remember me he says? sure i
>was
just listening to your broadside interviews today. you're wrong
>about
blonde on blonde by the way. i was
wrong about a few things he
>admits. is it true the fbi and cia pushed you to
suicide i wonder
>aloud? no man i hung myself pure and simple. that's a shame i say.
>shoulda
kept your eye on the word ... survival ... yep he agrees. you
>do
it for me he says and vanishes.
"Monopoly is so much fun i'd hate to
>blow
the game" do it for me says the vanishing wordman...simon
>leGreedymonster
is breathing his garlicladen vampire breath down my neck
>from
the other side of the table and i'd hate to blow the game caught in
>phil's
lyrics momentarily and then - Heck, i says to myself, i says Heck
>I've
thrown many a game of Monopoly back in the days when the most
>notorious
set of Original Gangstas used to meet on claflin holler to
>plot
the future of parallel universe takeovers.
I've thrown him might
>as
well blow 'em i think -- after all it's a matter of survival of
>sooner
or later pick sooner everytime and i'm standing over William's
>casket,
beautiful vestage his can, hat on the top he winks and says i
>gotta
go kid you hold the fort, meaning Survive i suppose and so it's
>SimonMonster
vs. me and the name is survival with a burroughsian spin,
>k-9
shift coordinate points, copy, k-9 shit to fe-line in all cases,
>copy,
let the cat out of the bag, copy, survive it can be done, i flash
>to
star wars yoda plastered behind a doorway not a curtain and the way
>of
the wizard reveals itself to me through the FoRcE of Muses Mill.
>
>The
dice roll revealing the next Universe I will exist within and the
>double
hexes land me not in Jail but smack damnitt right on Park Place
>with
Seven Hotels each with a different name.
>
>YIKES!
my interior landscape screams primally and my pistons lock in
>panic
anxiety disorder overwhelming Zyprexa-Tegretol stew
>instantaneously
but momentarily. I pull a Joker out of
my sleeve slap
>it
on the table double means roll again this time into parallel universe
>for
all place Re-Place with Street not owned by LeGreedmonster but by
>Lamar's
neighbor.
><http://www.mapblast.com/yt.hm?&CMD=MAP&SEC=blast&FAM=mapblast&GC=X:-97.619
25|Y:
>
38.84414|LT:38.84421|LN:-97.61919|LS:10000|c:Salina|s:KS|z:67401|d:678|p:USA
&IC
>
=38.84414:-97.61925:8:Potential+Home&GAD2=817+Park+St&GAD3=Salina%2c+KS++674
01-
>
2170&MA=2&LV=3>
>
>sounds
like a fair defense and a sweet survival offense i think humming
>one
flew east and one flew west and one converted park place to a place
>called
West Park Street and found home without Ruby slippers but rather
>only
red converse allstars.
>
>1-29-98
>copyright
david b. rhaesa
>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:33:15 +0300
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Zyprexa Blues #335
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Leon
Tabory wrote:
> Pardon my
>
ignorance, who are the red converse
allstars?
>
Looking forward
>
leon
>
what
are the red converse all stars?
my red
tennis shoes.
just
said yes to the new landlord. the
mapblast site is actually one
block
west of where i'll be moving. i have a
month to move.
siesta
soon,
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:35:24 +0300
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Complaint of Skeleton to Time
MIME-Version:
1.0
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text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Edward
Desautels wrote:
>
> As
for tone, well, I yam what I yam. Besides, I'd just spent four
>
hours handing out flowers in the airport and had a headache like you
>
read about. :]
>
no big
deal from my seat, just one of those practice what we preach
paradoxes
that we all fall prey to from time to time.
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 11:50:40 +0100
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Re: Zyprexa Blues #335
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
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Leon
Tabory wrote:
> Pardon my
>
ignorance, who are the red converse
allstars?
=== The
Red Converse All-Stars were a hot Chicago jazz-blues band circa
1949-1957,
recording several hundred sides on the Bosco, Clanky, and
Postum
labels. Lineup usually included Sloppy Smith, piano; Junior
Mintz,
alto sax; Peg Leg Otis, bass; Little Jimmy, drums; Merthiolate
Jones,
guitar. They briefly had a gig backing
up Sarah Vaughan but
getting
to stare at her behind threw off their playing abilities.
Then
again they might just be a kind of shoe ;)
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey
Scott Holland
somewhere
in the wilderness of Kentucky
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 11:05:47 +0300
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Zyprexa Blues #335
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Jeffrey
Scott Holland wrote:
>
>
Leon Tabory wrote:
>
>
> Pardon my
>
> ignorance, who are the red
converse allstars?
>
>
=== The Red Converse All-Stars were a hot Chicago jazz-blues band circa
>
1949-1957, recording several hundred sides on the Bosco, Clanky, and
>
Postum labels. Lineup usually included Sloppy Smith, piano; Junior
>
Mintz, alto sax; Peg Leg Otis,
bass; Little Jimmy, drums; Merthiolate
>
Jones, guitar. They briefly had a gig
backing up Sarah Vaughan but
>
getting to stare at her behind threw off their playing abilities.
>
>
Then again they might just be a kind of shoe ;)
>
>
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
Jeffrey Scott Holland
>
somewhere in the wilderness of Kentucky
>
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
i just
thought they were my tennis shoes. i
learn something new
everyday.
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 09:29:35 -0800
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Leon Tabory
<letabor@CRUZIO.COM>
Subject: Re: Zyprexa Blues #335
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
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What
gives with all them addresses (?) Mapblast.com/YT.HM (??) Numbers and
numbers
(?)
Is this
a puzzle, a roadmap a clever something or other? Am I confused?
Are you
doing a Zyprexa Blues #335 Riddle a la New York Times Crossword
Puzzle?
Should I put the issue to sleep?
leon
-----Original
Message-----
From:
David Bruce Rhaesa <race@MIDUSA.NET>
To:
BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Date:
Friday, January 30, 1998 7:42 AM
Subject:
Re: Zyprexa Blues #335
>Leon
Tabory wrote:
>> Pardon my
>>
ignorance, who are the red converse
allstars?
>>
Looking forward
>>
leon
>>
>what
are the red converse all stars?
>my
red tennis shoes.
>just
said yes to the new landlord. the
mapblast site is actually one
>block
west of where i'll be moving. i have a
month to move.
>siesta
soon,
>dbr
>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 13:09:37 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Neil M. Hennessy"
<nhenness@UWATERLOO.CA>
Subject: Re: FYI Joyce Lists
In-Reply-To:
<v01510101b0f680d7c1ad@[128.125.227.42]>
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Just a
note on the Joyce lists -- they're both heavy academic slogging. I
was
subscribed to the Joyce list (which focusses on Ulysses, for the most
part)
for a while, and it seemed that everyone that posted had either
published
a book on Joyce, written their dissertation on him, or were
currently
doing their dissertation on him. If that's just the kind of
exclusive
Joycean atmosphere you're looking for, you can revel in all the
coded
language you want there.
Neil
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 14:39:25 +0100
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Re: FYI Joyce Lists
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
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Neil M.
Hennessy wrote:
>
>
Just a note on the Joyce lists -- they're both heavy academic slogging. I
>
was subscribed to the Joyce list (which focusses on Ulysses, for the most
>
part) for a while, and it seemed that everyone that posted had either
>
published a book on Joyce, written their dissertation on him, or were
>
currently doing their dissertation on him. If that's just the kind of
>
exclusive Joycean atmosphere you're looking for, you can revel in all the
>
coded language you want there.
===
Yikes, thanks for the warning; I was considering signing up. I speak
a
little Joyce-code, but I no speaka academic.....
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey
Scott Holland
somewhere
in KY listening to Louis Jordan
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 10:48:36 -0800
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: "Timothy K. Gallaher"
<gallaher@HSC.USC.EDU>
Subject: Re: FYI Joyce Lists
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Yes. I must concur with Neil.
At
02:39 PM 1/30/98 +0100, you wrote:
>Neil
M. Hennessy wrote:
>>
>>
Just a note on the Joyce lists -- they're both heavy academic slogging. I
>>
was subscribed to the Joyce list (which focusses on Ulysses, for the most
>>
part) for a while, and it seemed that everyone that posted had either
>>
published a book on Joyce, written their dissertation on him, or were
>>
currently doing their dissertation on him. If that's just the kind of
>>
exclusive Joycean atmosphere you're looking for, you can revel in all the
>>
coded language you want there.
>
>
>===
Yikes, thanks for the warning; I was considering signing up. I speak
>a
little Joyce-code, but I no speaka academic.....
>
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>Jeffrey
Scott Holland
>somewhere
in KY listening to Louis Jordan
>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 15:07:17 +0100
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Jabberwocky
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Maggie
Dharma wrote:
>
Wanna talk Jabberwockie?
=== I
love it, and think it was definitely in Joyce's head when he wrote
"Ulysses"
and "Finnegans Wake". I think James Joyce is the missing link
between
Lewis Carroll and Walt Kelly.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey
Scott Holland in KY
thinking
about sandwiches
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 13:14:58 +0000
Reply-To: jhasbro@tezcat.com
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: John Hasbrouck
<jhasbro@TEZCAT.COM>
Subject: Re: FYI Joyce Lists
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
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Neil M.
Hennessy wrote:
>
>
Just a note on the Joyce lists -- they're both heavy academic slogging. I
>
was subscribed to the Joyce list (which focusses on Ulysses, for the most
>
part) for a while, and it seemed that everyone that posted had either
>
published a book on Joyce, written their dissertation on him, or were
>
currently doing their dissertation on him. If that's just the kind of
>
exclusive Joycean atmosphere you're looking for, you can revel in all the
>
coded language you want there.
>
>
Neil
Agreement
all around here.
I've
been on the Joyce and Beat listservs, and I think the differences
between
the two would be an interesting topic for a paper I'm not
willing
to write.
John
Hasbrouck
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 13:48:20 +0300
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Zyprexa Blues #335
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Leon
Tabory wrote:
>
>
What gives with all them addresses (?) Mapblast.com/YT.HM (??) Numbers and
>
numbers (?)
> Is
this a puzzle, a roadmap a clever something or other? Am I confused?
>
>
Are you doing a Zyprexa Blues #335 Riddle a la New York Times Crossword
>
Puzzle? Should I put the issue to sleep?
>
>
leon
the
issue is awake alive and well. only
push those buttons with the
seatbelt
firmly fastened and the joycean skeleton key in your hip pocket
and a
guitar pick in your pick pocket.
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 18:15:19 +0300
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: Re: Jabberwocky
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Jeffrey
Scott Holland wrote:
>
>
Maggie Dharma wrote:
>
>
> Wanna talk Jabberwockie?
>
>
=== I love it, and think it was definitely in Joyce's head when he wrote
>
"Ulysses" and "Finnegans Wake". I think James Joyce is the
missing link
>
between Lewis Carroll and Walt Kelly.
>
>
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
Jeffrey Scott Holland in KY
>
thinking about sandwiches
>
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
we have
met the enemy and he is a papercut.
check
this out all you high-brow Joyceans.
<http://www.bway.net/~hunger/ulysses.html>
dbr
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 18:25:46 +0300
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: David Bruce Rhaesa
<race@MIDUSA.NET>
Organization:
smiling small thoughts
Subject: not exactly Beat
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but
someone could probably write something funny putting Ginsberg in the
middle
of the current Clinton Comedy.
dbr
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--------------1CE97496755E--
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 19:32:56 EST
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Andrea Moore <BMXDREA@AOL.COM>
Subject: Ed Sanders inquiry
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-type:
text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding:
7bit
Has
anyone heard anything about Ed Sanders? I am writing a bio/ thesis on the
man and
I have scattered, semi-reliable information on him, but through all my
research
I haven't yet found any real solid criticism or biographical info.
Aside
from a very dated Contemporary Authors entry, there seems to be close to
nada on
this still very active beat writer. Is there an unpublished bio out
there?
Or maybe a dissertation or thesis?
Sanders
is part of a later beat-influenced movement that enters the social,
politicaI
activist realm. I know he isn't what you might call a real, or
"legit"
beat, but I view him as beat in the same light that Anne Charters
does.
At any rate, I follow Beat-L discussion to better understand Sanders'
connection
to the beat core.
Sanders
latest work, "1968, a history in verse," is quite a read. He really
gets
into a conspiratory thang, similar to his manifesto, "Z-D
Generation,"
but his
historical accounts are accessible and entertaining. He's into writing
underground
history in a similar way that Kerouac does in "Visions of Cody."
Drea
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 19:38:37 -0600
Reply-To: cawilkie@comic.net
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Cathy Wilkie
<cawilkie@COMIC.NET>
Subject: Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
As I
was reading the posts going back and forth on this subject, i
wanted
to say something to the effect of what maggie says here.
thanks
to all involved in this discussion--it makes burroughs not so
scary
to me anymore...
cathy
>
Subject:
> Re: Joyce, WSB, word play about word
play
> Date:
> Thu, 29 Jan 1998 21:06:19 EST
> From:
> Maggie Dharma <IDDHI@AOL.COM>
>
>
> In
a message dated 29-Jan-98 6:00:15 PM Pacific Standard Time,
>
jholland@ICLUB.ORG writes:
>
>
<< The masses do not get it. I've spent years trying to
> convince people that FW isn't useless random
nonsense. I don't think
> ANYTHING is nonsense, myself, but that's a
whole 'nother thread. >>
>
>
Boy, ain't that the truth? And thanks to everyone for contributing to a thread
>
that's very interesting and educational while not being so esoteric as to be
>
beyond my level of educational comprehension. You all have given me a desire
> to
read something of WSB's besides Naked Lunch!
>
>
Wanna talk Jabberwockie?
>
>
Maggie
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 21:58:10 +0100
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Sender: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation
List" <BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
From: Jeffrey Scott Holland
<jholland@ICLUB.ORG>
Subject: Re: Ed Sanders inquiry
MIME-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
7bit
Andrea
Moore wrote:
> Is
there an unpublished bio out
>
there? Or maybe a dissertation or thesis?
=== I
know of no book solely about Sanders, but there are good books on
the
Fugs and the Lower East Side crowd in general, though the names of
these
books escape me at the moment. I've never seen a book that covers
him
strictly as a writer, but I'd love to see one...
>
Sanders is part of a later beat-influenced movement that enters the social,
>
politicaI activist realm. I know he isn't what you might call a real, or
>
"legit" beat, but I view him as beat in the same light that Anne
Charters
>
does.
=== I
don't wanna open up what is probably an old tired thread here (I
just
hopped this train last week), but Ginsberg considered Sanders a
"legit"
beat and so do I. Of course, I use a
very wide and inclusive
definition
of the term.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeffrey
Scott Holland - - Berea, KY
drawing
Ernest Hemingway on a Burger King napkin
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 21:13:39 -0500
Reply-To: "BEAT-L: Beat Generation List"
<BEAT-L@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
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From: "R. Bentz Kirby"
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Subject: blaster
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Blaster
Map
blaster
Sound
blaster
Master
blaster
Bass
blaster
Cap
blaster
Disaster
blaster
No
blaster
Portland
Blaster
Mortar
blaster
Clinton
blaster
Blaster
blaster
Blaster
blaster blaster
Jazz
blaster
Rocket
blaster
Blast
blaster
Blust
blaster.
Blaster
Blast.
--
Peace,
Bentz
bocelts@scsn.net
http://www.scsn.net/users/sclaw